Breaking: Seattle Cop Killer is Toast

[Chica Yeyé 41]

why doesn't this surprise me? Vigilante justice, not cool.

It's not necissarily vengeance on the cops part. I'll reserve judgement until the facts are in.

You have a point. I shall do so and wait until whichever "official" version of events the Seattle Police gives us.

[The_Dude 1,142]

why doesn't this surprise me? Vigilante justice, not cool.

It's not necissarily vengeance on the cops part. I'll reserve judgement until the facts are in.

You have a point. I shall do so and wait until whichever "official" version of events the Seattle Police gives us.

With events like this, the first police release is going to be a glossed over version I imagine. You need to peel away the unicorn puffy stickers to get to the meat of it. I imgaine with something of this magnitude, there will be a public formal inquiry, something beyond the scope of internal affairs.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

From what I heard on the news last night, the guy went around at one point telling people that he was Jesus and had a paranoid fixation with law enforcement. It sounds very much like he had some schizophrenic disorder. Now he's dead its moot of course, but it is unfortunate that we don't know - if it is true the tragedy is how someone like that wasn't in an institution - he shouldn't have been on the streets where he could do people harm.

As to huckabee, its easy to point fingers, but according to him he pardoned the guy back in 1989 because he thought he was given an extremely harsh sentence (the 16 year old Clemmons was given over 100 years), and acted on the basis of the judges recommendation and that of a unanimous parole board. In any event all he did was commute the 100 year sentence to 47 years.

The outrage.

Edited December 1, 2009 by Gene Hunt

[Peikko 1,575]

That's why it's always a good idea to arrest and take to trial rather than summararily shoot. Of course, the guy may not have wanted to be 'taken alive' but again cops are trained to deal with that sort of situation. It is really tragic all around, it's tragic to the cops who were shot and all their families, and it's tragic for anyone who believes that justice should be delivered equally to all.

And it's tragic that this maniacal killer was 1 of the 1,033 pardons/commutations that Huckabee granted.

Huckabee on Rapist and Murderer

By KATE PHILLIPS

December 5, 2007, 9:21 pm

NYT

This is an episode in the career of former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee that probably will not go away soon. It has all the markings of tabloidian detail that can haunt a candidate, a lawmaker, an elected official, who walks and stalks the halls of criminal justice, who has, as he has said, weighed decisions on whether to impose capital punishment, and has ordered death.

But far more than whether Mr. Huckabee had been briefed on the inner-intel (or simply the public intel) of the newest intelligence report on Iran, the parole release of the convicted rapist Wayne DuMond, who went on to allegedly rape and murder others, will probably dog Mr. Huckabee throughout his campaign. It already is an issue and will be.

People liken this episode to that pumped by Lee Atwater, the late legendary Republican strategist, against Mike Dukakis, a la Willie Horton.

While Mr. Huckabee may enjoy his newfound popularity and rise in the polls, with that comes the inspection, the ultra-flyspecking of his days in Arkansas as governor. Forget taxes for a moment. Far more of a flashpoint for the ordinary citizen is the parole of Mr. DuMond, done under Mr. Huckabee's governorship. No matter whether he personally recommended (or urged to the state's parole board) the man's release or not. If his candidacy moves upward bigtime nationally, you can bet someone will offer commercials that play on this particular criminal's acts, far beyond Mr. Huckabee's control, then and now.

The facts are this, as far as we can discern, from Arkansas papers and other sources:

Mr. DuMond was convicted in 1984 of raping Ashley Stevens, 17, another Forrest City resident and a distant cousin of former Gov. Bill Clinton. He was sentenced to life plus 20 years.

In 1992, Lt. Gov. Jim Guy Tucker, a Democrat and acting governor, reduced Mr. DuMond's sentence, making him eligible for parole.

There is some dispute about the closed session attended by Mr. Huckabee held with the Parole Board, but here's a condensed account from the public record:

Mr. Huckabee became governor in 1996, and met with the Parole Board. It's in dispute as to how much he discussed Mr. DuMond's situation. The case had become a cause celebre among certain conservative activists. According to several accounts, Mr. Huckabee wrote to Mr. DuMond in January 1997: "My desire is that you be released from prison."

Well, Mr. DuMond was released in 1999 and he wound up in Missouri. Shortly thereafter, he was accused and later convicted of sexually assaulting and murdering Carol Sue Shields. He was also the primary suspect in the rape and murder of another woman. He died in prison in 2005.

Tonight, after accounts and new documents obtained by other reported victims (forgive that term) that were published at the Huffington Post by Murray Waas this week, and a CBS interview this morning with Lois Davidson, the mother of one of Mr. DuMond's victims, CNN asked Mr. Huckabee about this long, long coattail of a criminal case that shadows his campaign:

Wolf, my only official action in this was I denied his commutation. It was actually given by Jim Guy Tucker when Bill Clinton was governor back in 1992.

It was on my desk. I did consider it. I even thought that he met the criteria for parole in support of it.

I wish I hadn't. But I didn't parole him. And governors don't parole people in Arkansas, nor can they stop a parole. And that's the tragedy, I think, that this went through several years and many different people.

And all of us failed. That's the truth. All of us failed.

As for former parole board members coming forward now who say that Mr. Huckabee, as governor, persuaded them to release Mr. DuMond, the Republican candidate offered this tonight:

That's what is so heartbreaking about this. There are families who are truly, understandably and reasonably grief-stricken. And for people to now politicize these deaths and to try to make a political case out of it, rather than to simply understand that a system failed and that we ought to extend our grief and heartfelt sorrow to these families, I just regret that politics is reduced to that.

We can guarantee you that this will not go away. Mr. Huckabee will be asked and asked about the DuMond case. As he has been. And should his campaign take hold nationally, you can bet scary commercials will be on the horizon. If not already in the can in someone's darkroom.

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12...rderer/?apage=2

Yes, I think it probably is. If he was suffering from some form of mental illness that wasn't addressed, there's another tragedy to add to all the rest.

Only Joe could make out that wanting justice carried out via the court system rather than by the police as misplaced sympathy for a criminal

[웃 910]

From what I heard on the news last night, the guy went around at one point telling people that he was Jesus and had a paranoid fixation with law enforcement. It sounds very much like he had some schizophrenic disorder. Now he's dead its moot of course, but it is unfortunate that we don't know - if it is true the tragedy is how someone like that wasn't in an institution - he shouldn't have been on the streets where he could do people harm.

As to huckabee, its easy to point fingers, but according to him he pardoned the guy back in 1989 because he thought he was given an extremely harsh sentence (the 16 year old Clemmons was given over 100 years), and acted on the basis of the judges recommendation and that of a unanimous parole board. In any event all he did was commute the 100 year sentence to 47 years.

The outrage.

Well his actions gave Clemmons parole eligibility which led to his parole release.

On the one extreme end you have Huckabee who released way too many career criminals. This won't be the last case of a Huckabee pardon or commutation gone wrong. There are still hundreds of career criminals that were released by Huck.

On the other extreme end you have Romney who:

"During his term, 100 requests for communications came to his attention along with 172 requests for pardons. He turned down each and every one, no exception."

[The_Dude 1,142]

From what I heard on the news last night, the guy went around at one point telling people that he was Jesus and had a paranoid fixation with law enforcement. It sounds very much like he had some schizophrenic disorder. Now he's dead its moot of course, but it is unfortunate that we don't know - if it is true the tragedy is how someone like that wasn't in an institution - he shouldn't have been on the streets where he could do people harm.

As to huckabee, its easy to point fingers, but according to him he pardoned the guy back in 1989 because he thought he was given an extremely harsh sentence (the 16 year old Clemmons was given over 100 years), and acted on the basis of the judges recommendation and that of a unanimous parole board. In any event all he did was commute the 100 year sentence to 47 years.

The outrage.

Well his actions gave Clemmons parole eligibility which led to his parole release.

On the one extreme end you have Huckabee who released way too many career criminals. This won't be the last case of a Huckabee pardon or commutation gone wrong. There are still hundreds of career criminals that were released by Huck.

On the other extreme end you have Romney who:

"During his term, 100 requests for communications came to his attention along with 172 requests for pardons. He turned down each and every one, no exception."

That does not show any sort of qualification on Romney's part, nor does it disqualify Huckabee. Go back to last year and watch the videos of him debating. The man has no independent thoughts. I think all the hairspray rotted his brain.

[Chica Yeyé 41]

why doesn't this surprise me? Vigilante justice, not cool.

It's not necissarily vengeance on the cops part. I'll reserve judgement until the facts are in.

You have a point. I shall do so and wait until whichever "official" version of events the Seattle Police gives us.

With events like this, the first police release is going to be a glossed over version I imagine. You need to peel away the unicorn puffy stickers to get to the meat of it. I imgaine with something of this magnitude, there will be a public formal inquiry, something beyond the scope of internal affairs.

I doubt there will be any inquiry. The blue line is clear and closed. But we shall see.

Mind you, the dude was a piece of work and he did -so we think- kill the cops. But that does not justify having the dude shot instead of knocked out, handcuffed and placed into custody.

Also, what Cleo and Six are saying is right --- if the dude had a diagnosable mental condition that was evident since previous incarceration and the state failed to acknowledge/treat it, that is another tragedy.

[Peikko 1,575]

Anecdotally, it seems that many of these killings that take place are as a result of persons with serious mental issues having access to guns and not treatment. That's tragic.

[Chica Yeyé 41]

Anecdotally, it seems that many of these killings that take place are as a result of persons with serious mental issues having access to guns and not treatment. That's tragic.

I concur. More money being used to lobby for gun posession and/or gun control than money being used to get real about mental illness and its treatment.

[DEDixon 39]

Only a lib would think its "tragic" that a cop killer has met his end. tsk tsk..

They need reality checks on multiple levels.

Hey everybody look, it's the return of stupid. Any loss of life is a tragedy, even when you don't like them. Furthermore, him dying like this, we'll never know what was his motive and the victims family will never get closure.

"name calling is the last resort of limited intelligence."

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I wondered about this... I hope they are brought to justice for what they did. They endangered many more police officers.

Clemmons had stayed on the run for nearly two days with help from a network of friends and family who gave him places to stay, medical aid, rides and money, police said. Troyer told Fox News police arrested three people overnight on suspicion of rendering criminal assistance.

On Monday, officers detained a sister of Clemmons who they think treated the suspect's gunshot wound.

"We believe she drove him up to Seattle and bandaged him up," Troyer said.

Police believe people close to Clemmons have misled officers, and Troyer said anyone helping him could face charges. Clemmons' sister wasn't in custody late Monday, and her name wasn't released.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/200...sShot01-ON.html

[Peikko 1,575]

Name calling is fun, we all do it from time to time and to attribute some precious intellectual high ground simply because one indulges in it from time to time is puerile. If that's all one has...different story obviously.

[웃 910]

From what I heard on the news last night, the guy went around at one point telling people that he was Jesus and had a paranoid fixation with law enforcement. It sounds very much like he had some schizophrenic disorder. Now he's dead its moot of course, but it is unfortunate that we don't know - if it is true the tragedy is how someone like that wasn't in an institution - he shouldn't have been on the streets where he could do people harm.

As to huckabee, its easy to point fingers, but according to him he pardoned the guy back in 1989 because he thought he was given an extremely harsh sentence (the 16 year old Clemmons was given over 100 years), and acted on the basis of the judges recommendation and that of a unanimous parole board. In any event all he did was commute the 100 year sentence to 47 years.

The outrage.

Well his actions gave Clemmons parole eligibility which led to his parole release.

On the one extreme end you have Huckabee who released way too many career criminals. This won't be the last case of a Huckabee pardon or commutation gone wrong. There are still hundreds of career criminals that were released by Huck.

On the other extreme end you have Romney who:

"During his term, 100 requests for communications came to his attention along with 172 requests for pardons. He turned down each and every one, no exception."

That does not show any sort of qualification on Romney's part, nor does it disqualify Huckabee. Go back to last year and watch the videos of him debating. The man has no independent thoughts. I think all the hairspray rotted his brain.

Ya, Romney is definitely not the sharpest tool in the shed. He has never been CEO of a state, CEO of a company, CEO of the Olympics. He is a moron.

Huckabee and Obama are really smart though.

[DEDixon 39]

Name calling is fun, we all do it from time to time and to attribute some precious intellectual high ground simply because one indulges in it from time to time is puerile. If that's all one has...different story obviously.

name calling is the last resort of limited intelligence ... end of story.

and "we all" don't do it from time to time.

[Peikko 1,575]

Name calling is fun, we all do it from time to time and to attribute some precious intellectual high ground simply because one indulges in it from time to time is puerile. If that's all one has...different story obviously.

name calling is the last resort of limited intelligence ... end of story.

and "we all" don't do it from time to time.

Fine, you are above such pettiness. However, your theory is still wrong. Name calling is fun and people do it because they can, not because they lack intelligence.