Catholic Town

[LenJayUS 0]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/03/02/catholic.town.ap/index.html

New Florida town would restrict abortion

Domino's founder building community around Catholic university

Thursday, March 2, 2006; Posted: 11:36 a.m. EST (16:36 GMT)

NAPLES, Florida (AP) -- If Domino's Pizza founder Thomas S. Monaghan has his way, a new town being built in Florida will be governed according to strict Roman Catholic principles, with no place to get an abortion, pornography or birth control.

The pizza magnate is bankrolling the project with at least $250 million and calls it "God's will."

Civil libertarians say the plan is unconstitutional and are threatening to sue.

The town of Ave Maria is being constructed around Ave Maria University, the first Catholic university to be built in the United States in about 40 years. Both are set to open next year about 25 miles east of Naples in southwestern Florida.

The town and the university, developed in partnership with the Barron Collier Co., an agricultural and real estate business, will be set on 5,000 acres with a European-inspired town center, a massive church and what planners call the largest crucifix in the nation, at nearly 65 feet tall. Monaghan envisions 11,000 homes and 20,000 residents.

During a speech last year at a Catholic men's gathering in Boston, Monaghan said that in his community, stores will not sell pornographic magazines, pharmacies will not carry condoms or birth control pills, and cable television will have no X-rated channels.

Homebuyers in Ave Maria will own their property outright. But Monaghan and Barron Collier will control all commercial real estate in the town, meaning they could insert provisions in leases to restrict the sale of certain items.

"I believe all of history is just one big battle between good and evil. I don't want to be on the sidelines," Monaghan, who sold Domino's Pizza in 1998 to devote himself to doing good works, said in a recent Newsweek interview.

Robert Falls, a spokesman for the project, said Tuesday that attorneys are still reviewing the legal issues and that Monaghan had no comment in the meantime.

"If they attempt to do what he apparently wants to do, the people of Naples and Collier County, Florida, are in for a whole series of legal and constitutional problems and a lot of litigation indefinitely into the future," warned Howard Simon, executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Florida.

Florida Attorney General Charlie Crist said it will be up to the courts to decide the legalities of the plan. "The community has the right to provide a wholesome environment," he said. "If someone disagrees, they have the right to go to court and present facts before a judge."

Gov. Jeb Bush, at the site's groundbreaking earlier this month, lauded the development as a new kind of town where faith and freedom will merge to create a community of like-minded citizens. Bush, a convert to Catholicism, did not speak specifically to the proposed restrictions.

"While the governor does not personally believe in abortion or pornography, the town, and any restrictions they may place on businesses choosing to locate there, must comply with the laws and constitution of the state and federal governments," Russell Schweiss, a spokesman for the governor, said Tuesday.

Frances Kissling, president of the liberal Washington-based Catholics for a Free Choice, likened Monaghan's concept to Islamic fundamentalism.

"This is un-American," Kissling said. "I don't think in a democratic society you can have a legally organized township that will seek to have any kind of public service whatsoever and try to restrict the constitutional rights of citizens."

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If you haven't guessed, I'm not all that big on religion.... but I have to be honest here and say I don't see a problem with this particular instance... no one is being forced to move to this new town, your going there on your own free will.. you know the "rules" and what not. It's alot like buying a house that's in a Home Owners Association.. you know what the by-laws are up front.

[ace13 0]

I agree. Let people live where they want to live and next door to who they want to live next door, too. I only feel sorry for them, because I am sure there will be some that will not want them to live in peace. They will purposely cause problems or look for immorality. So and so did this and it will be national news. I can just see it now...

[Jaylen Brit 0]

Interesting..what if 'southern town banned all people of color'? or 'arab town banned all jewish faith followers' 'clever people university town bans all stupid idiots' - these things are a bad idea right? The path to facisim and elitism?

Do we allow this because its privately owned?

Maybe the point surpasses me...

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

[ace13 0]

Interesting..what if 'southern town banned all people of color'? or 'arab town banned all jewish faith followers' 'clever people university town bans all stupid idiots' - these things are a bad idea right? The path to facisim and elitism?

Do we allow this because its privately owned?

Maybe the point surpasses me...

You act like that already isn't happening. Look at neighborhoods. People live next door to people that are like them. It is simply human to want to be surrounded by people that are like you. People are more comfortable.

What a surprise

[mikeize 0]

Indeed. Or a town that bans catholics. Or one that decides to sell liquor and porn to 8 year olds, and then lowers the age of consent. Homeowners assoc's suck too, IMO, btw.

I don't like this idea at all. While what they are proposing may technically be legal, it is on the edge of permissability. Millionaires buying up property in order to realize their personal ideals of community? It wouldn't take long before even just a few people found themselves having to relocate or accept the "rules" of this non-governmental (but seemingly sanctioned, hmm?) "authority". It's interesting though, I'll give it that. Probably won't be heading there for spring break! (or any tennessee dry counties either, for that matter)

-mike

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Interesting..what if 'southern town banned all people of color'? or 'arab town banned all jewish faith followers' 'clever people university town bans all stupid idiots' - these things are a bad idea right? The path to facisim and elitism?

Do we allow this because its privately owned?

Maybe the point surpasses me...

You act like that already isn't happening. Look at neighborhoods. People live next door to people that are like them. It is simply human to want to be surrounded by people that are like you. People are more comfortable.

Apples and Oranges again? It's the simple difference between what people choose and what they're told. Certain groups of people might not consider working in certain types of jobs. That's fine as long as it's their choice. But when employers say you can't work here 'cause you are "take your pick", then that's not to be tolerated. And it can't be justified by saying that they usually don't care to work in that kind of job anyways.

What a surprise

Well, I tried but it ain't working.

[ace13 0]

But wouldn't it be a choice to live there? He is buying up a bunch of land that no one is living on...like a compound maybe....what do I care? It isn't like they are planning on killing anyone or sacrificing babies or anything. They just want to live with people that have their same Christian beliefs. If a bunch of KKK members want to buy a compound and live together, good for them. I bet no black person would want to live there anyway. Same with this, a non-believer wouldn't want to live there, so fine, don't

Do you think you would get a ticket for having sex before marriage?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

But wouldn't it be a choice to live there? He is buying up a bunch of land that no one is living on...like a compound maybe....what do I care? It isn't like they are planning on killing anyone or sacrificing babies or anything. They just want to live with people that have their same Christian beliefs. If a bunch of KKK members want to buy a compound and live together, good for them. I bet no black person would want to live there anyway. Same with this, a non-believer wouldn't want to live there, so fine, don't

As long as "Ave Maria" doesn't accept any government money at all, I've got no problems with this.

And by government oney I mean no government funded infrastructure either. Let them build their own roads, their own freeways.. let them lay down their own water and gas pipelines etc. A typical town takes plenty of government assistance... if this town does not, I've got no problems with it.

[ace13 0]

Or get fined for not going to church on Sunday

Would all places of business be closed on Sunday?

But wouldn't it be a choice to live there? He is buying up a bunch of land that no one is living on...like a compound maybe....what do I care? It isn't like they are planning on killing anyone or sacrificing babies or anything. They just want to live with people that have their same Christian beliefs. If a bunch of KKK members want to buy a compound and live together, good for them. I bet no black person would want to live there anyway. Same with this, a non-believer wouldn't want to live there, so fine, don't

As long as "Ave Maria" doesn't accept any government money at all, I've got no problems with this.

And by government oney I mean no government funded infrastructure either. Let them build their own roads, their own freeways.. let them lay down their own water and gas pipelines etc. A typical town takes plenty of government assistance... if this town does not, I've got no problems with it.

Would that mean they don't have to pay taxes?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Or get fined for not going to church on Sunday

Would all places of business be closed on Sunday?

You know what would be awesome (for those of us on the outside) ... if Ave Maria had their own religious police who went around punishing young people for not praying or showing too much skin and such. Then we wouldn't have to look to Saudi Arabia for stories of religious obscurantism, we could get them right here at home!

[ace13 0]

Or get fined for not going to church on Sunday

Would all places of business be closed on Sunday?

But wouldn't it be a choice to live there? He is buying up a bunch of land that no one is living on...like a compound maybe....what do I care? It isn't like they are planning on killing anyone or sacrificing babies or anything. They just want to live with people that have their same Christian beliefs. If a bunch of KKK members want to buy a compound and live together, good for them. I bet no black person would want to live there anyway. Same with this, a non-believer wouldn't want to live there, so fine, don't

As long as "Ave Maria" doesn't accept any government money at all, I've got no problems with this.

And by government oney I mean no government funded infrastructure either. Let them build their own roads, their own freeways.. let them lay down their own water and gas pipelines etc. A typical town takes plenty of government assistance... if this town does not, I've got no problems with it.

Would that mean they don't have to pay taxes? Just donations to church and alms giving...right

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Same with this, a non-believer wouldn't want to live there, so fine, don't

Look, they can make up their little slice of heaven and do all the imbreeding or whatever else they want. See what I care. Looking at the bigger picture, though. it seems to be kind of a dangerous path to go down. What's next? I need a visa to visit that place? Besides, it should not be recognized by the state and/or county as a municipality nor should it receive any public funding.

[ace13 0]

Same with this, a non-believer wouldn't want to live there, so fine, don't

Look, they can make up their little slice of heaven and do all the imbreeding or whatever else they want. See what I care. Looking at the bigger picture, though. it seems to be kind of a dangerous path to go down. What's next? I need a visa to visit that place? Besides, it should not be recognized by the state and/or county as a municipality nor should it receive any public funding.

They wouldn't have to pay taxes, then...just those donations to church...

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Would that mean they don't have to pay taxes?

FL doesn't have a state tax AFAIK. They would still have to pay sales tax, obviously. And they're part of the US so clearly they get no exemption from filing their 1040s.

If taxpayer funds go into this town, then they can not constitutionally limit the town to just people of a certain creed. Nor can they impose rules that violate the constitutional rights of citizens of all creeds.

Edited March 3, 2006 by Agent Smith