Jump to content

9 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

Filed: Other Country: Canada
Timeline
Posted

If you live in the United States, a warning: you may want to read the terms of service of the websites you use a little more carefully. That's because a government prosecutor in New Jersey is pursuing criminal charges against the operators of a company that used an automated process to purchase event tickets on Ticketmaster.com for resale.

The charges are being brought under the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act (CFAA), which was passed in 1986 with the purpose of cracking down on the unauthorized accessing of computers (read: hacking). In U.S. v. Lowson, the prosecutor seeks to extend the CFAA to cover the violation of the Ticketmaster.com terms of service, which forbids individuals and companies from accessing the website in an automated fashion.

The Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF), which filed an amicus brief in the matter, thinks this extension of the CFAA could have profound implications. The EFF's Civil Liberties Director, Jennifer Granick, stated:

Under the government's theory, anyone who disregards -- or doesn't read -- the terms of service on any website could face computer crime charges. That gives Ticketmaster and other online services extraordinary power over their users: the power to decide what is criminal behavior and what is not. Price comparison services, social network aggregators, and users who skim a few years off their ages could all be criminals if the government prevails.

Indeed, the EFF points to other cases indicating that this is becoming a very real issue:

...in United States v. Drew, a woman was charged with violating the federal computer crime law for creating a false profile, which she then used to communicate inappropriately with a teenager who eventually committed suicide.
Just two weeks ago we filed an amicus brief in Facebook v. Power Ventures. There, Facebook makes basically the same claim that the government makes in the Wiseguys case: because Facebook's terms of service ban users from accessing their information through "automated means", aggregation tools violate the criminal law.

In U.S. v. Lowson, there doesn't seem to be any dispute that the operators of Wiseguys Tickets, Inc. violated the Ticketmaster.com terms of service. But on the surface, it seems somewhat incredulous to believe that such a violation should be addressed in a criminal court. The EFF says that "The government has suggested that this criminal prosecution is only about protecting consumers' fair access to event tickets," yet the CFAA was clearly not enacted by Congress to address consumer access to event tickets. It was designed to deter hacking. From this perspective, it seems most appropriate that the criminal charges be dismissed and Ticketmaster.com be forced protect its interests in civil court, on its own dime.

If, however, the criminal charges are not dismissed, private companies will potentially be granted "immense latitude to decide what conduct is criminal." This, of course, opens a huge can of worms. After all, terms of service vary from website to website, and they often contain terms that are difficult to understand. In addition, some terms may be unreasonable, or incompatible with the law itself. But consumers and businesses won't simply be able to ignore these terms of service; the alleged violation of some obscure term could potentially lead to criminal prosecution.

Additionally, the ability of private companies to enforce their terms of service through criminal prosecution will likely hurt consumers in other ways. In U.S. v. Lowson, the EFF notes that Ticketmaster is also a player in the ticket-reselling business, and therefore it stands to benefit by making it harder for companies like Wiseguys Tickets, Inc. to compete. If companies can create terms of service designed to clamp down on the competition, and then use the government to enforce those terms of service, consumers can expect less choice and innovation in many markets.

That would be a bad thing, and even though companies should have the ability to set and enforce terms of service, they should also be prepared to enforce them the right way. Hopefully the court in U.S. v. Lowson will send that message.

Source

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quite a stretch of the original law. I find it odd that they take up this case, but not that of Ticketmaster's predatory practices in maintaining their monopoly.

Filed: AOS (pnd) Country: Canada
Timeline
Posted

It's interesting really.

Online scalpers and the likes wouldn't exist if there wasn't a market for it.

If someone wants to buy a bunch of tickets from Ticketmaster or wherever and resell them at a premium, that's their business as far as I'm concerned.

These people who complain that they had to buy tickets for $400 to a Jonas Brothers concert need to shut up and tell their kids "no" that it's not affordable or it's sold out. It's really that simple. The real story is the fact that people ARE PAYING those prices for tickets..

Now as far as violating the TOS of ticketmaster in cases like that, it's a civil matter, not a criminal matter.

The only way it should be a criminal matter is if whatevr they are doing is tampering with the ticketmaster POS and/or causing harm to the website itself to interrupt the normal flow of business...

If ticketmaster is making their money and selling out all of their tickets, what do they have to complain about?

nfrsig.jpg

The Great Canadian to Texas Transfer Timeline:

2/22/2010 - I-129F Packet Mailed

2/24/2010 - Packet Delivered to VSC

2/26/2010 - VSC Cashed Filing Fee

3/04/2010 - NOA1 Received!

8/14/2010 - Touched!

10/04/2010 - NOA2 Received!

10/25/2010 - Packet 3 Received!

02/07/2011 - Medical!

03/15/2011 - Interview in Montreal! - Approved!!!

Filed: Timeline
Posted

It's interesting really.

Online scalpers and the likes wouldn't exist if there wasn't a market for it.

If someone wants to buy a bunch of tickets from Ticketmaster or wherever and resell them at a premium, that's their business as far as I'm concerned.

These people who complain that they had to buy tickets for $400 to a Jonas Brothers concert need to shut up and tell their kids "no" that it's not affordable or it's sold out. It's really that simple. The real story is the fact that people ARE PAYING those prices for tickets..

Now as far as violating the TOS of ticketmaster in cases like that, it's a civil matter, not a criminal matter.

The only way it should be a criminal matter is if whatevr they are doing is tampering with the ticketmaster POS and/or causing harm to the website itself to interrupt the normal flow of business...

If ticketmaster is making their money and selling out all of their tickets, what do they have to complain about?

supporting non human agents like robots and spiders do require building out additional capacity by the host company. that's why capacity management guys hate robots. bottom line, of course it costs money to support them.

and that's not all. in business, any business, your brand is important. letting non human agents process transactions on your site at bulk hurts the brand. this is why marketing and sales people, who know a thing or two about branding,aren't the biggest fans of robots either (especially if your brand is upscale).

Filed: Other Country: Canada
Timeline
Posted

Show me the US statutes that make this criminal, and I'll agree. Otherwise, this is BS.

The Computer Fraud and Abuse Act (codified as 18 U.S.C. § 1030)

(4) knowingly and with intent to defraud, accesses a protected computer without authorization, or exceeds authorized access, and by means of such conduct furthers the intended fraud and obtains anything of value, unless the object of the fraud and the thing obtained consists only of the use of the computer and the value of such use is not more than $5,000 in any 1-year period;

Posted

supporting non human agents like robots and spiders do require building out additional capacity by the host company. that's why capacity management guys hate robots. bottom line, of course it costs money to support them.

and that's not all. in business, any business, your brand is important. letting non human agents process transactions on your site at bulk hurts the brand. this is why marketing and sales people, who know a thing or two about branding,aren't the biggest fans of robots either (especially if your brand is upscale).

Why do you hate the robots? Robots have feelings too.cray5ol.gif

larissa-lima-says-who-is-against-the-que

 

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
- Back to Top -

Important Disclaimer: Please read carefully the Visajourney.com Terms of Service. If you do not agree to the Terms of Service you should not access or view any page (including this page) on VisaJourney.com. Answers and comments provided on Visajourney.com Forums are general information, and are not intended to substitute for informed professional medical, psychiatric, psychological, tax, legal, investment, accounting, or other professional advice. Visajourney.com does not endorse, and expressly disclaims liability for any product, manufacturer, distributor, service or service provider mentioned or any opinion expressed in answers or comments. VisaJourney.com does not condone immigration fraud in any way, shape or manner. VisaJourney.com recommends that if any member or user knows directly of someone involved in fraudulent or illegal activity, that they report such activity directly to the Department of Homeland Security, Immigration and Customs Enforcement. You can contact ICE via email at Immigration.Reply@dhs.gov or you can telephone ICE at 1-866-347-2423. All reported threads/posts containing reference to immigration fraud or illegal activities will be removed from this board. If you feel that you have found inappropriate content, please let us know by contacting us here with a url link to that content. Thank you.
×
×
  • Create New...