Illegal and wanting to become legal

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Can you be more specific so she knows exactly what she could be doing to herself? I think she believes what I am telling her but I think she is more afraid of losing him.

Afraid of losing the guy? She can't lose what she ain't got. This guy is looking for a way to get papers - nothing more and nothing less. Oh, and the fines are openly listed on the paperwork - here from the I-130:

PENALTIES: By law, you may be imprisoned for not more than five years or fined $250,000, or both, for entering into a marriage contract for the

purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws. In addition, you may be fined up to $10,000 and imprisoned for up to five years, or both, for

knowingly and willfully falsifying or concealing a material fact or using any false document in submitting this petition.

[moroccanwife 11]

If she is not good at lying, she will not be believed. You appear to be a good friend. As such, use the angle of the lying and the consequences to her, not the 'he's a scam artist, he's out to get you' and you will probably have a better chance to get her through this with the least hurt to herself. Good luck.

Good idea...thank you.

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

Moroccanwife:

Prima facie this appears to be fraudulent marriage, whether that's the case or not. Once you meet somebody, get to know them and eventually get married, wouldn't you want to live with your newlywed spouse? Wouldn't anybody? Hence, this is a very unusual behavior coming from a loving husband.

Secondly, now that the gentleman is married to your friend, he needs to file for AOS as he is still illegal here. If he gets in trouble, he'll be detained and deported with a 10-year ban attached. He is only save once his status is at least AOS pending.

Third, lying at AOS can have dire consequences for both "partners." The beneficiary gets deported and banned for life, and the petitioner gets charged with a crime. As you can imagine, if the beneficiary has been illegal for almost a decade, the I.O. at the AOS interview will make absolutely sure that the marriage is legit. Yes, the overstay is not an issue, but every part of this relationship will be looked at with a magnifying glass.

I don't know how these two got married, but I hope it was in a nice ceremony with friends and family, and plenty of photos taken. While it's perfectly okay for a "normal" couple to step in front of a judge and do this as cheap and easily as possible, those rules are not really acceptable for someone who will benefit greatly from getting married to a USC spouse. Naturally, it's up to the couple that show that their marriage is real and that they live together in harmony, as any newlyweds would do.

For reasons like this, the 2-year Green Card was introduced. So far it has worked as intended by filtering out people who solely or primarily got married in order to get a Green Card.

[moroccanwife 11]

If she lies to the US gov't for a 'husband' whom she doesn't even live with, then yeah, she does deserve what she will get. Honestly, I cannot fathom anyone needing to be 'talked into' not risking federal prison by lying so blatantly to the gov't. So yeah, if she lies, I hope she gets caught, and gets fined/sentenced the maximum possible. Women like her are enabling these sham marriages, which only makes it harder for the legitimate ones.

With that said, I dont think she realizes she could face fines and prison. But I will be sure to point that out to her.

[moroccanwife 11]

Moroccanwife:

Prima facie this appears to be fraudulent marriage, whether that's the case or not. Once you meet somebody, get to know them and eventually get married, wouldn't you want to live with your newlywed spouse? Wouldn't anybody? Hence, this is a very unusual behavior coming from a loving husband.

Secondly, now that the gentleman is married to your friend, he needs to file for AOS as he is still illegal here. If he gets in trouble, he'll be detained and deported with a 10-year ban attached. He is only save once his status is at least AOS pending.

Third, lying at AOS can have dire consequences for both "partners." The beneficiary gets deported and banned for life, and the petitioner gets charged with a crime. As you can imagine, if the beneficiary has been illegal for almost a decade, the I.O. at the AOS interview will make absolutely sure that the marriage is legit. Yes, the overstay is not an issue, but every part of this relationship will be looked at with a magnifying glass.

I don't know how these two got married, but I hope it was in a nice ceremony with friends and family, and plenty of photos taken. While it's perfectly okay for a "normal" couple to step in front of a judge and do this as cheap and easily as possible, those rules are not really acceptable for someone who will benefit greatly from getting married to a USC spouse. Naturally, it's up to the couple that show that their marriage is real and that they live together in harmony, as any newlyweds would do.

For reasons like this, the 2-year Green Card was introduced. So far it has worked as intended by filtering out people who solely or primarily got married in order to get a Green Card.

Thank you so much for your input. P.S. wedding was in fact in front of a judge with just her adult children there and they took one picture.

[mawilson 2,133]

[Otto 83]

The husband is right in that he doesn't have to file AOS.

He can remain illegal forever or until he gets caught. This usually means living on the fringe of society since he can not do what most of us take for granted (i.e., work, travel, have an otherwise normal life). She on the other hand should be conscious of what she's gotten herself involved in (not much good can possibly come from remaining illegal).

[Peikko 1,575]

The OP's friend is either in a very unusual but perfectly legitimate marriage, or she is a victim of abuse. She is not knowingly entering a contract for financial or other gain in exchange for a gg. Whatever people think of the OP, and the OP's decisions, she has a right to present her case to USICs so long as she presents it as it stands, and not massaged fraudulantly to make it look better. It is somewhat bizarre to wish the victim of abuse be punished - but there we go.

Edited March 8, 2010 by Madame Cleo

[Fandango 1,440]

The OP's friend is either in a very unusual but perfectly legitimate marriage, or she is a victim of abuse. She is not knowingly entering a contract for financial or other gain in exchange for a gg. Whatever people think of the OP, and the OP's decisions, she has a right to present her case to USICs so long as she presents it as it stands, and not massaged fraudulantly to make it look better. It is somewhat bizarre to wish the victim of abuse be punished - but there we go.

Let's cut thru the bull here...

'massaged fraudulently' = to lie blantantly on a gov't form.

'victim of abuse' = victim of her own stupidity/loneliness/low self-esteem/willful ignorance.

She absolutely has the right to present her case to USCIS...I have no problem whatsoever with her doing so, and I would wish her the best of luck. So many times, we see people on here with the most ridiculous blinders on...but hey, it's all for love, right? No one's perfect and everyone makes mistakes.

But the second she lies to help her pseudo-hubby, yeah...that's when the Oprah-kleenex time is over afaic. You break the law, then you should pay...and no amt of 'but I love him!' should change any of that. Save that line for the Springer show.

[mawilson 2,133]

'massaged fraudulently' = to lie blantantly on a gov't form.

No government form asks for details of how you met your spouse.

[Peikko 1,575]

Bull?

I think it's very obvious that she is a victim of abuse. The fact that she is prepared to lie in order to preserve a marriage that seemingly has such a small benefit to herself practically proves it.

She will lie if she is a victim of abuse. Being a victim of abuse means that someone is using a person's personality defects (low self esteem, stupidity, loneliness) in order to manipulate that person for their own ends. The friend believes she is in love and wants to be married, she wants the GG so she can have her husband come and live with her. She is not married in order to gain financially or materially. You may well feel scornful of that belief, and how that is not what real love is but that isn't very useful to the OP or her friend.

If she lies but the marriage is genuine - well, that is a bizarre situation to be in. I am not sure I would feel that she deserved punishment in that situation either. However, that isn't very likely in my opinion.

[moroccanwife 11]

Let's cut thru the bull here...

'massaged fraudulently' = to lie blantantly on a gov't form.

'victim of abuse' = victim of her own stupidity/loneliness/low self-esteem/willful ignorance.

She absolutely has the right to present her case to USCIS...I have no problem whatsoever with her doing so, and I would wish her the best of luck. So many times, we see people on here with the most ridiculous blinders on...but hey, it's all for love, right? No one's perfect and everyone makes mistakes.

But the second she lies to help her pseudo-hubby, yeah...that's when the Oprah-kleenex time is over afaic. You break the law, then you should pay...and no amt of 'but I love him!' should change any of that. Save that line for the Springer show.

Geeezzze...you're not a very happy person are you? In my friend's defense...she loves her husband very much. However, once I explain to her the consequences of lieing...I'm quite sure she wont be lieing.

[Peikko 1,575]

I hope you do manage to get your friend to do the right thing, which is to present her case without lying about her and her husbands living situation. If her husband is a genuine person, that will not be a problem; in fact he will do all he can to create a situation that proves their marriage is genuine. If however he is abusing your friend then she may go through a very tough time over this and she will need the support of people who care for her. If you believe she genuinely does have self esteem issues, you would be doing her a service if you also persuaded her to get some professional help with that as well to prevent situations like this happening in the future.

[Fandango 1,440]

Cleo, I am sincerely intrigued to your opinion re: being a 'victim'. Does being a victim absolve one from any wrong choices one makes? Where's the culpability start for a 'victim'?

[Peikko 1,575]

Cleo, I am sincerely intrigued to your opinion re: being a 'victim'. Does being a victim absolve one from any wrong choices one makes? Where's the culpability start for a 'victim'?

She is no different from any spouse who is mentally abused. Do you always view victims of spousal abuse as idiots who deserve their fate? A victim of mental abuse is rarely in control of their own choices by very definition. We know that some people target women for GC's among other things. These women need to be given the tools to break the cycle of manipulation not be punished financially, or with prison time although of course, she will get what she gets depending on what she does end up doing.

As things stand, the only thing we can accuse the OP's friend of being guilty of is probably having low self esteem and making an incredibly bad choice for a marriage partner. She is currently in danger of compounding that choice by possibly engaging in criminal behaviour and all for what? For the chance to be with someone who makes her feel by turn like princess and then the lowest of the low for such is the stuff of manipulation.

She is being punished, whatever led her to believe she is only worthy of love under such circumstances is punishment enough, and it's not exactly a cake walk to implement the changes that she will need to change the direction her life runs in, if she can.

I think it is very different when people take money and knowingly pretend to be married for financial gain. In such circumstances a criminal prosecution is probably more 'deserved'.

Edited March 8, 2010 by Madame Cleo