Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf

[Peikko 1,575]

Yeah, one has to question the rational of making something like basketball into a patriotic issue. I mean, is playing sport intrinsically patriotic? I rather think it is not any more than working in McDonalds is. What a lot of broo haa haa about nothing at all. Only in America

That must have made the ancient Greeks a little weird if prancing around nekkid were considered patriotic too.

Or a little closer to our times... Soccer Hooligans beating the Jesus out of each other... for Queen and Country of course.

It was a fav hunting ground for the BNP - skinheads are very patriotic

[_Simpson_ 250]

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/style_im...uote-button.png

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

As for the 'oppression'... well... put it into the proper context and you *might* at the least understand his reasons. Not that you have to accept them.

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

so your saying pay homage to the flag(his teams flag) that wanted him to pay homage to a flag(USA flag) he didnt want to pay homage too. By trying to prove your point you ended up biting your tail. The team itself stood for the flag a team he plays for, he has no ground for not standing.

sure he has his reasons and by now its obvious I dont accept them nor did the NBA and it flag waving fans as you might call them. "Proper context", hmmmm basketball arena, I dont think there was any oppression going on there.

Not really- as I don't have a tail.

Unless, of course, the player's contract stipulates, verbatim, that he had to do certain patriotic rites directly related to the very thing he refused to partake it.

And to that tune, you have not produced any evidence since last night you learned of it playing trivia.

As for putting things into context- perhaps you'd like to stick to the actual topic. Flag. Not Basketball. But changing the context into basketball, just to tickle your fancy:

It wasn't until 1950 that the NBA desegregated because, *tsk, tsk*... the league was generally closed to African Americans due to R-A-C-I-S-M.

I said earlier that they probably got him on a conduct policy, I really doubt there is something that specifically that says stand for the Star Spangled banner.

I posted something from wikipedia, I think thats evidence.

What I am talking about the flag as it applies to the context of this citation which was a basketball player that didnt want to stand for the Star Spangled Banner because he believed that the flag was a symbol of oppression.

Today the flag doesnt stand for R-A-C-I-S-M, its a shame we have fought hard for equal rights and still people want to considered it a symbol of oppression, I think its a joke. I think this player was way out of place for saying such a thing, I just dont get why people are ok with that.

[Peikko 1,575]

The star spangled banner never did stand for racism, did it? I have to admit the American patriotic symbols do somewhat confuse me. I really can't fathom the notion of having to revere a flag as if it were a god, but then...

Edited March 4, 2009 by Madame Cleo

[HAL 9000 96]

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/style_im...uote-button.png

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

As for the 'oppression'... well... put it into the proper context and you *might* at the least understand his reasons. Not that you have to accept them.

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

so your saying pay homage to the flag(his teams flag) that wanted him to pay homage to a flag(USA flag) he didnt want to pay homage too. By trying to prove your point you ended up biting your tail. The team itself stood for the flag a team he plays for, he has no ground for not standing.

sure he has his reasons and by now its obvious I dont accept them nor did the NBA and it flag waving fans as you might call them. "Proper context", hmmmm basketball arena, I dont think there was any oppression going on there.

Not really- as I don't have a tail.

Unless, of course, the player's contract stipulates, verbatim, that he had to do certain patriotic rites directly related to the very thing he refused to partake it.

And to that tune, you have not produced any evidence since last night you learned of it playing trivia.

As for putting things into context- perhaps you'd like to stick to the actual topic. Flag. Not Basketball. But changing the context into basketball, just to tickle your fancy:

It wasn't until 1950 that the NBA desegregated because, *tsk, tsk*... the league was generally closed to African Americans due to R-A-C-I-S-M.

I said earlier that they probably got him on a conduct policy, I really doubt there is something that specifically that says stand for the Star Spangled banner.

I posted something from wikipedia, I think thats evidence.

What I am talking about the flag as it applies to the context of this citation which was a basketball player that didnt want to stand for the Star Spangled Banner because he believed that the flag was a symbol of oppression.

Today the flag doesnt stand for R-A-C-I-S-M, its a shame we have fought hard for equal rights and still people want to considered it a symbol of oppression, I think its a joke. I think this player was way out of place for saying such a thing, I just dont get why people are ok with that.

The flag never stood for anything but independence and the ideals so hardly fought for and won in the US War of Independence. However, it was and has been sadly used in the name of greed internationally, and selectively to repress certain populations within this one up until a relatively short while ago. Perhaps a couple of high-school-level history courses may do you good? No condescension implied.

Wikipedia is user edited. Beware.

Like I said. This player plaid in a league that was racially segregated until 1950. You may not get it, but most other people have thought processes that allow them to analyze the context in which things arise.

[_Simpson_ 250]

The star spangled banner never did stand for racism, did it? I have to admit the American patriotic symbols do somewhat confuse me. I really can't fathom the notion of having to revere a flag as if it were a god, but then...

Often at sporting events we take our hats off, put our hands over our heart, look at the flag and sing the star spangled banner.

We respect it and take it seriously for many reasons, one because of the soldiers that died fighting under it. I think your god reference just shows your ignorance of this topic. You make it confusing, it doesnt have to be.

[HAL 9000 96]

The star spangled banner never did stand for racism, did it? I have to admit the American patriotic symbols do somewhat confuse me. I really can't fathom the notion of having to revere a flag as if it were a god, but then...

Often at sporting events we take our hats off, put our hands over our heart, look at the flag and sing the star spangled banner.

We respect it and take it seriously for many reasons, one because of the soldiers that died fighting under it. I think your god reference just shows your ignorance of this topic. You make it confusing, it doesnt have to be.

Its not written into regulation that it must be done. Hence your desire to have people punished for refusing to pay respect to it is a bit weak, but it is your right. As it is others' right to refuse to contextualize partial history.

Isn't it grand to have the right to object?

[_Simpson_ 250]

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/style_im...uote-button.png

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

As for the 'oppression'... well... put it into the proper context and you *might* at the least understand his reasons. Not that you have to accept them.

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

so your saying pay homage to the flag(his teams flag) that wanted him to pay homage to a flag(USA flag) he didnt want to pay homage too. By trying to prove your point you ended up biting your tail. The team itself stood for the flag a team he plays for, he has no ground for not standing.

sure he has his reasons and by now its obvious I dont accept them nor did the NBA and it flag waving fans as you might call them. "Proper context", hmmmm basketball arena, I dont think there was any oppression going on there.

Not really- as I don't have a tail.

Unless, of course, the player's contract stipulates, verbatim, that he had to do certain patriotic rites directly related to the very thing he refused to partake it.

And to that tune, you have not produced any evidence since last night you learned of it playing trivia.

As for putting things into context- perhaps you'd like to stick to the actual topic. Flag. Not Basketball. But changing the context into basketball, just to tickle your fancy:

It wasn't until 1950 that the NBA desegregated because, *tsk, tsk*... the league was generally closed to African Americans due to R-A-C-I-S-M.

I said earlier that they probably got him on a conduct policy, I really doubt there is something that specifically that says stand for the Star Spangled banner.

I posted something from wikipedia, I think thats evidence.

What I am talking about the flag as it applies to the context of this citation which was a basketball player that didnt want to stand for the Star Spangled Banner because he believed that the flag was a symbol of oppression.

Today the flag doesnt stand for R-A-C-I-S-M, its a shame we have fought hard for equal rights and still people want to considered it a symbol of oppression, I think its a joke. I think this player was way out of place for saying such a thing, I just dont get why people are ok with that.

The flag never stood for anything but independence and the ideals so hardly fought for and won in the US War of Independence. However, it was and has been sadly used in the name of greed internationally, and selectively to repress certain populations within this one up until a relatively short while ago. Perhaps a couple of high-school-level history courses may do you good? No condescension implied.

Wikipedia is user edited. Beware.

Like I said. This player plaid in a league that was racially segregated until 1950. You may not get it, but most other people have thought processes that allow them to analyze the context in which things arise.

"No condescension implied" you dont need to add such statments, your talking down to me, no need to use such tatics Im a big boy I can handle it, just say what you think minus these statements.

The flag never stood for anything but independence and the ideals so hardly fought for and won in the US War of Independence.

What the flag didnt stop standing for things after we won our independence thats just silly.Thats what if stood for then. What about when we fought against slavery under the flag. What it stands for changes as time goes on and wars are fought and though there was dark times in our history I am proud of what the the flag stands for today.

I know what wikipedia is, are you really contesting anything I posted that was from wikipedia?, come on.

Your talking down to me again in that last sentence, sad.

[_Simpson_ 250]

I have to get going, its been fun

[HAL 9000 96]

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/style_im...uote-button.png

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

As for the 'oppression'... well... put it into the proper context and you *might* at the least understand his reasons. Not that you have to accept them.

He got payment from his team. Maybe that was the flag he should have paid homage to?

so your saying pay homage to the flag(his teams flag) that wanted him to pay homage to a flag(USA flag) he didnt want to pay homage too. By trying to prove your point you ended up biting your tail. The team itself stood for the flag a team he plays for, he has no ground for not standing.

sure he has his reasons and by now its obvious I dont accept them nor did the NBA and it flag waving fans as you might call them. "Proper context", hmmmm basketball arena, I dont think there was any oppression going on there.

Not really- as I don't have a tail.

Unless, of course, the player's contract stipulates, verbatim, that he had to do certain patriotic rites directly related to the very thing he refused to partake it.

And to that tune, you have not produced any evidence since last night you learned of it playing trivia.

As for putting things into context- perhaps you'd like to stick to the actual topic. Flag. Not Basketball. But changing the context into basketball, just to tickle your fancy:

It wasn't until 1950 that the NBA desegregated because, *tsk, tsk*... the league was generally closed to African Americans due to R-A-C-I-S-M.

I said earlier that they probably got him on a conduct policy, I really doubt there is something that specifically that says stand for the Star Spangled banner.

I posted something from wikipedia, I think thats evidence.

What I am talking about the flag as it applies to the context of this citation which was a basketball player that didnt want to stand for the Star Spangled Banner because he believed that the flag was a symbol of oppression.

Today the flag doesnt stand for R-A-C-I-S-M, its a shame we have fought hard for equal rights and still people want to considered it a symbol of oppression, I think its a joke. I think this player was way out of place for saying such a thing, I just dont get why people are ok with that.

The flag never stood for anything but independence and the ideals so hardly fought for and won in the US War of Independence. However, it was and has been sadly used in the name of greed internationally, and selectively to repress certain populations within this one up until a relatively short while ago. Perhaps a couple of high-school-level history courses may do you good? No condescension implied.

Wikipedia is user edited. Beware.

Like I said. This player plaid in a league that was racially segregated until 1950. You may not get it, but most other people have thought processes that allow them to analyze the context in which things arise.

"No condescension implied" you dont need to add such statments, your talking down to me, no need to use such tatics Im a big boy I can handle it, just say what you think minus these statements.

The flag never stood for anything but independence and the ideals so hardly fought for and won in the US War of Independence.

What the flag didnt stop standing for things after we won our independence thats just silly.Thats what if stood for then. What about when we fought against slavery under the flag. What it stands for changes as time goes on and wars are fought and though there was dark times in our history I am proud of what the the flag stands for today.

I know what wikipedia is, are you really contesting anything I posted that was from wikipedia?, come on.

Your talking down to me again in that last sentence, sad.

Huh?

Want to try that again? I know what you wrote there... but it is a bit off the mark since it doesn't really make much sense.