gnasa

If in fact your spouse is employed by the US military/gov and regularly stationed abroad, look into getting your citizenship immediately via the 319(b) expeditious naturalization process.

Another option that may be available to you is preserving residency for naturalization purposes.

what kind of allowance is this?

319(b) expeditious naturalization: my company is private (we have an ESAP program - employees own company stocks) and not on the stock market. Can I still apply for that kind of naturalization from Europe? I was reading 319(b) and my understanding was that the U.S. company has to be somehow connected to the U.S. government as for instance the military. Please advice where I can find more information about this topic.

I'm not sure if the US company has to connected to the US gov. for 319(b) to apply, it states the firm must "engaged in the development of foreign trade and commerce of the U.S.". There is some useful info in this thread that I started last year: www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/261371-expeditious-naturalization-319b-american-company-definition/ and it has some links to my sources of info.

There are several ways to show a corporation is a 'US company', stock only traded on US markets is one of them. My 1st guess would be that your company would qualify IF it is incorporated in the US and most of your colleagues/shareholders are US citizens. You would need to figure out how to prove all of this sufficiently.

when searching for info on 319(b), google is your friend as is this and other forums, the USCIS does a very poor job of clarifying it. You can also turn to the 'adjudicator's manual' if you understand lawyer-speak . Ultimately you may benefit from discussing all this with an immigration lawyer, just be sure to find one that is familiar with 319(b) as most aren't in my experience. Also the laws are 'national' so you can use any lawyer in the US.

I do agree with you that loosing and then having to get another green card is your worst option, either stay in US until you obtain citizenship or determine if 319(b) will apply if your transferred abroad for your work.

glad I can be of some help

Gnasa and Mbeavers

I am in the same boat - I work for SLB MEA and am pursuing a petition for immigration/green card/ citizenship for my wife and I'd of course like to take advantage of 319 b expeditious process. So far I have established SLB is a BVA company - I am wondering if you have had any luck on the stock ownership angle - if you are still around please contact me here or thru ldap and my username.

Thanks, Good Luck and Best Regards

mg

Hi MG,

I couldn't find you in LDAP. Anyway, I haven't been able to determine the citizenship of a majority of SLB Limited stockholders. I guess I've given up on 319(b).

Cheers

gkramer

First let me describe my situation, I'm a US citizen, my wife in Australian, she received her conditional GC and my work promptly transferred me to Europe for a 2-3 year assignment. Of coarse I could have refused but a chance for a non-EU to live/work in EU was too exciting for us to pass-up, we've been in EU for 1.3 yrs now. I have many of the same questions you have, but maybe I can clarify some things for you.

1) How does effect my conditional green card status? Can I apply for returning resident (SB-1) visa? For how long is it valid? What requirements do I have to fullfill? Any infos on that visa?

One of the requirements of a green card (2-year or 10-year) is to maintain the intent to reside within the US. We effectively do this by getting a re-entry permit(s). My understanding of SB-1 visas are they are hard to get b/c you have to demonstrate you couldn't return to US due to something out of your control.

2) Can I renew my conditional green card while living in Europe?

I do not have many details about this, however, 'removing conditions from abroad' is something you should research. We have to do this next year and I'll be sure to post my experience with it here, as it may be helpful to others.

3) How many times per year do I have to enter the U.S. in order to keep my green card status? Once per year? For how long do I have to stay in the U.S. when I visit?

This is a big grey area and I feel is open to interpretation. 1st you need to get a re-entry permit as the best evidence to maintain your intent to reside in the US. Or you could actually stay in the the US for >6 months each year. A history of long extended trips indicating that you actually live somewhere else and just visit the US is a red flag.

4) Can I apply for naturalization/citizenship while in Europe?

Not if you break the continuous residency for naturalization purposes by staying outside of US for >6 months during your 3 yrs as an LPR (there are loopholes to this by being employed abroad by a US company or the US gov. or a missionary etc. and naturalizing expeditiously via 319(b)). Your time inside/outside the US will be scrutinized during the naturalization process down to day (I've heard).

5) I almost feel that this is just to much potential trouble and I should wait a little bit before I go back to Europe for job opportunities. In 6 months I can apply for my 10 years green card and 1 year later for citizenship. I feel (after reading different posts) that going back for a longer amount of time can really risk of loosing my green card even though I am employed by a US company and married to a US citizen. Comments?

I think you are wise to understand the possible implications of living abroad on your GC status. If this is an option and you are not forced to move for your work, 1.5 years longer in the US isn't too bad and you'll never have to deal with USCIS again (but you always have to pay US taxes). Even if your job sucks and you have to live in (insert non-desirable town, eg. Houston), 1.5 years of your life isn't that much of a price to pay for US citizenship, AND the grass isn't always greener in Europe. On the other hand, you could attempt to maintain the GC like my wife is doing and if you do end up losing it, you can always get another one (via DCF or the longer way) through your continuing marriage to a US citizen.

I just re-read your original post, to clarify- your US company is offering a transfer to Europe. I strongly encourage you to read into 319(b) expeditious naturalization. If your company is deemed to be US by USCIS standards than I think you can move abroad and become a US citizen in a very short time (<1 yr) The definition of a US company by USCIS can be somewhat complex though, is your company's stock solely traded on a US stock exchange? If so, you've got a good chance that 319(b) applies.

My wife and I were outside of the US for ~10 months and re-entered without issue. I'm a US citizen and wife has a conditional GC. At port of entry at JFK we experienced no issues or additional questions, I accompanied her through the GC-holder line.

With that said, we did apply for a re-entry permit during that trip and she later flew back to US to complete the biometrics appointment. We obtained a REP because this is the best way I know of to show USCIS our time abroad is temporary and our intent is to reside within the US.

See my posting here: www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/326877-re-entry-permit-applied-after-departure/page__p__4871900#entry4871900

If she stays outside of US for greater than 1 year without a Re-Entry permit, her GC is automatically invalid and you'll have to start the LPR-Immigration process from the beginning OR obtain an SB-1 visa from the consulate abroad (somewhat difficult) before attempting to enter the US.

So she must travel back to the US before the 1 year anniversary of her departure date to either apply for an REP (form I-131, ~$485 dollars) or to 'enter and stay'. OR get an SB-1 Visa after >1 year away.

Glad to helpful.

Given your case, instead of waiting to apply for citizenship, I'd try and do it ASAP and start the ball rolling. I've heard it takes about ~3 months from app-to-passport and I think it requires 2 appointments -interview, naturalization (oh and maybe even another biometrics?). There is plenty of info on this forum about the process, probably even specific to the LA area. It will save you the money and hassle of Preserving residency for Nat. purposes (note this is for employes transferred abroad only of US companies, proving this can be difficult).

Hi soniabruin,

It is not up to a customs officer to determine if he has abandoned residence. While they can give green card holders a tough time, only an immigration judge can revoke his PR status. I've heard that a GC holder out of US for >6 months can trigger a reasonable suspicion of abandoning residence, even though it specifically states a re-entry permit is only required for absences of greater than 1 year. Working abroad I think is viewed negatively though. There are several steps he can take to maintain his 'intent to permanently reside in the US', you can find many examples on this forum.

If he/you are only out of US for 8 months, technically it should be OK with just a GC, but it is somewhat of a grey area. If a LPR has a history of multiple extensive trips out of the US indicating they actually live somewhere else and just visit the US, this requires a re-entry permit to 'explain' absences. But in your case there is limited absence and I would consider not bothering with a re-entry permit if you plan to maintain a residence (bank accts, place to live, etc...) in the US. On the other hand a re-entry permit may be a good idea b/c the future is unknown and REP are typically valid for the lesser of 2 yrs or GC expiration. Biometric appts. are typically scheduled for 3-6 weeks after i-131 application is received by USCIS. Although, you can always attempt an early 'walk-in' once you receive the appointment notice. Note that the LPR needs to be in the US during REP application and biometrics, they can leave in between (i.e. he can always come back to the US for biometrics).

If you are a US citizen, your husband should be eligible to apply for citizenship after 3 years of continuous residency, start that process, get citizenship and never worry about USCIS requirements again! (Although you'll always have to complete/pay your US taxes on global income )

Another short answer is yes. It is possible to do an early walk-in at a separate facility than listed in the biometrics appointment notice, but it's not guaranteed. And it wont affect the timing of your processing.

As with many processes in USCIS, unfortunately it depends on the day and mood of the USCIS employee (in addition to schedule constraints). I suggest you try an early walk-in somewhere in the Eastern US. To accomplish this 1) I would research on here when are the better days to try 2)when at facility be clear, nice, and well organized/justified/presented (e.g. bring your plane tix showing you'll be in Eastern US during scheduled biometrics appointment), and it may just work out for you.

See thread: 'Re-Entry Permit: Applied After Departure' for a success story that did just what your contemplating.

Hi blackspot,

See thread here: www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/326877-re-entry-permit-applied-after-departure/

Its about our ultimately successful re-entry permit issue after departing for abroad. It required travel to the US. It is my understanding that the USCIS must receive the re-entry permit application when the applicant is inside the US, although I'm not 100% sure about this. You must do Biometrics in the US which is scheduled anywhere from 2-8 weeks after application. You do NOT need to be in the US when the re-entry permit is issued, place a trustworthy US address on the app or a US embassy/consulate abroad, note that USPS will not forward mail from the USCIS.

Removing conditions from abroad is less clear for me, even after reading the relevant threads here in addition to some legal advice I received:

"Regarding the Petition to Remove Conditions, that needs to be filed within the 90-day period before she has been a conditional permanent resident for 2-years, that Petition can be filed while they are out of the United States. Depending on how the USCIS wants to handle it, they may adjudicate the petition while she is still out of the US, or they may put it on hold until they return to continue living in the US. I have seen them handle it either way and there does not seem to be any magical formula for getting it to happen one way or the other."

Hi Beth, we're in a similar situation, I'm a USC and my wife has a conditional green card. My company transferred me to Europe for a multi-year work assignment ~2 months after my wife received her GC. We are not willing to live apart and I do not know if that would affect the ROC process. So we got her a re-entry permit (REP) which is valid until her conditional GC expires and we moved temporarily abroad. We plan on trying to remove conditions from abroad in summer 2012 and then probably getting another REP.

Note that if your husband's work falls under a 'US company', is military, or other specific categories, you could apply for US citizenship under the 319(b) provision essentially waiving the 3-year wait for citizenship. I was disappointed when I determined my employer would not qualify as a 'US corporation'. I cant wait for the day that my wife is granted US citizenship and we can come and go to the US as we please! 319(b) is definitely something to look into if you qualify.

There are numerous topics and websites that explain more clearly than I can about 'maintaining residency' or 'abandoned residency' within USA during extended travel for legal permanent residents.

For trips greater than 1 year, a GC holder needs to have a valid Re-Entry Permit. It is easiest/required to get the re-entry permit before the GC holder departs/starts their journeys. For a trip of less than 1-year, a GC holder is reasonably safe from having been deemed abandoned residency, but it is a very grey area. A history of several repeat trips with more time abroad than in the USA will raise flags and cause residency to be questioned.

Davidid,

This is our 2nd application for a re-entry permit, 1st was granted approximately 6 weeks after obtaining GC but never received.

Re-entry permits are valid for 2 years or the expiration date of the green card, which ever is earliest.

As my wife's current GC is conditional, the RP is valid until conditional GC expires in Aug next year.

We'll be applying to remove conditions (most likely from abroad) at that time.

To clarify, I'm a US citizen, wife is Australian.

Glad to be helpful.

Hello, I'm sharing this info in case it might be helpful to someone. My wife (and I) decided to apply for another Re-Entry Permit after our departure abroad for my temporary (2-3 year) work assignment with an international company. This was due to her original Re-Entry Permit status as 'lost in the mail' after it was issued, see thread titled: 'Re-entry Permit - Lost in Mail'

To accomplish this, we sent in the I-131 form during a recent holiday trip to the US, ensuring USCIS received it while we were still in the US. We departed US and waited for the biometrics notice to be sent to our US residence in CA. We received the notice ~ 3 weeks later and biometrics was scheduled at a CA location. Our/her biometrics appointment always seem to be scheduled at the most difficult times for us, this time my int. business trips and the start of her 3rd trimester were big conflicts. So, instead of flying all the way to CA from Europe, my wife flew to New York and completed a biometrics walk-in before and at a different USCIS support center (ASC) than listed on the biometrics notice. She had allotted 2-3 days for visiting the different USCIS biometrics offices in the NYC area, but she was let in to complete the fingerprinting at the 1st location visited. So it is possible to complete an early biometrics appointment at a different facility (appointment in CA, walk-in in NY) than listed on the appointment notice. Although, I do not want to give the impression that it is simple, being well organized and being clear was helpful. There was a big risk that she couldn't complete an early walk-in in NYC, but it worked out for us this time. Finally a grey-area that worked out in our favor in our dealings with USCIS!

Result: Re-Entry permit in hand and valid until late next year, when we must remove conditions...

Hello all,

Thanks for your comments in advance.

I have a question regarding the address we put on a I-131 re-entry permit application.

The background - LPR through marriage to US citizen. We were approved for a re-entry permit but never actually received it because USCIS claims it was lost in the mail. We are now temporarily abroad for several years due to work. We will be in the US in early July to apply for another (1st) re-entry permit. We will depart the US between application and biometrics, thus requiring a later trip back to the US to complete biometrics.

Can we use, say a relatives address in Chicago or New York, on the I-131 form so the biometrics appointment gets scheduled at a facility easier to fly to from Europe? OR is it required to place our 'home' address in CA which will equate to a biometrics appointment scheduled in CA?

Another possibility is to attempt a walk-in after receiving appointment letter into a different ASC than the appointment is for, but I feel there is too much uncertainty and costly flights if the walk-in fails.

Even another possibility is to attempt to expedite the process and stay in the US for up to 2-4 weeks waiting between application and biometrics, but there is no guarantee or valid information that USCIS lets you know if it is expedited or not, aid from congressmen would most likely be required.

Comments/advice appreciated!

For the re-entry permit application, I think the applicant has to both be in the country when USCIS receive that application and for biometrics, but can leave between those 2 dates, however I'm not 100% sure, can someone verify this? They know when you are in and out of the country...

Walk-ins for biometrics is a gamble, some have success, some do not. I think you'll need the actual appointment letter to do biometrics though. Fees are never refundable with USCIS, even if they make an error.

If your husbands GC is conditional (valid for 2 years) then the re-entry permit will expire with the GC. We are in a similar situation with my wife's GC and we plan to try an remove conditions from abroad. If were unsuccessful, we'll go through the DCF process in Italy to obtain another GC when we move back to the USA.

Most of all, don't rely on your company's HR to give you correct answers as they have no stake in it. Verify everything they tell you...

Hi ZombieSS

There could be other possible visa paths for your fiance. It seems to 1st hinge on how to get married in the US. If you plan to move abroad, explore not worrying/waiting for the K-3 visa, she might be able to come here as a tourist. I think you can marry while on tourist status, she just has to depart within 90 days (I may be completely wrong on this...)

2nd hinge is the uncertainty in the future. It would be nice to move immediately with your wife back to the US, but that is just not reality. Direct Consular Filing (DCF) may be an option, as a US citizen with 'residency' abroad, DCF for an IR-1 (or something like that) from the Philippines after you're married might be an option. I'm not sure if you can do DCF from there, but it will be all spelled out on the US Embassy/Consulate website for there if it is possible. otherwise you'll have to follow the K-3 visa process and adjust status...

Also, speaking from personal experience, I recommend you get you wife a green card when your ready to live in the US for 3 years and can get her US citizenship after that time. I have experience trying to hang onto my wife's greencard while being temporarily stationed abroad for my job. Interrupting GC to citizenship process by not living full time in the USA is a logistical nightmare, costly, and you are always at risk of having it taken away due to an abandoned residency claim despite re-entry permits, etc...

OR

If you manage to get the green card for her before/during your temporary assignment abroad AND your employed by a US company/govt you'd be eligible for expeditious naturalization.

Hopefully this is helpful.

Hi all and thanks for your advice in advance.

I'm a US citizen, wife is Australian citizen currently with US conditional legal permanent residency. We were transferred to Italy for my work last August (2010) and expect to 'reside' in Italy until 2013-ish. We were granted a US re-entry permit but never actually received it, a very long story... We are now trying to decide if we should surrender the green card or reapply for re-entry permit(s) and take the steps required to maintain intent to reside in the US (a requirement of the green card).

Before/If we surrender the green card, I'd like to understand if an Australian citizen who previously had legal permanent residence in the USA could apply for another US immigrant visa/green card via the DCF process from within Italy? I have residency in Italy but my wife does not because that would jeopardize her current green card. She does have a permesso di soggiorno. Is the DCF process within Italy only for Italian citizens/residents?

Thanks

gnasa

JustBob - Yes, unfortunately the previous 8 years my wife spent in US (under F-1: college BS-PhD) doesn't count towards anything because she was not a resident during that time. Thanks for your input, I have to look into ROC and DCF and understand it more before any decision.

Sorry for the bump! Any advice anyone?

I want to follow up to let everyone know that they do not re-issue 'lost in the mail' re-entry permits. In the end the USCIS at the Embassy was wrong... Our re-entry permit will not be reissued.

Please find copied below the reply we received from the Nebraska Service Center:

“Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2011 10:11 PM

To: Rome, USCIS

Subject: RE: Re-entry permit LINxxxxxxxxxxxx

The travel document was mailed to her address in XXXXXXXXXXXXX, CA on Sept 14, 2011. Since the document was not returned to our office as undeliverable we assume it was delivered. The only way we can produce another document is if she files a new application (with fee)”.

We apologize if you were given a different information when showing up at our office. In the past they use to issue a new travel document but we assume that their procedures have changed.

Regards,

USCIS Rome, Italy

I'm not sure what to do now. Thanks for your input.

Before I can respond with a meaningful strategy in your particular case, I would need precise dates on

when your wife became a resident - 7/30/10

when you left for Australia - Left for Italy: 8/23/10

and when her Green Card expires - 7/30/12

Hi All,

I'm looking for advice and help understanding all the options to either maintain LPR status or surrender or other possibilities while temporarily working abroad. Story goes like this:

1. I'm a US citizen, my wife has a conditional green card (AOS from F-1)
   
2. my company has transferred me to work abroad for the next ~2 years
   
3. we applied for and were awarded a re-entry permit, but never actually received it
   
4. my understanding is the re-entry permit would be valid until her conditional green card expires
   
5. After several emails and an infopass appointment at embassy abroad, USCIS claims that it was not returned to them as 'undeliverable' and so it is our fault that we never received it. Thus, if we are to get a re-entry permit we need to reapply from within the US.
   

We've been out of US for ~6 months so far. We have a vehicle and active bank acounts but no residence or utility bills of our own within the US, so I fear USCIS will deem my wife has abandoned her residency without a re-entry permit (guaranteed if she is out more than 365 days). I'm at a loss what to do now.

• My company will most likely not reassign me back to the US within the next year.
  
• I've investigated a 319b naturalization, but couldn't determine successfully if I work for and "American" company.
  
• If we surrender the green card voluntarily, my wife should be able to visit the US up to 3 months at a time. But what happens when we are ready to move back to US permanently? When we reapply for a green card are we going to have to jump through even more hoops? and how is the process different if done from abroad?
  
• Or, if we somehow manage to maintain intent to reside within US and keep the green card, can we remove conditions from abroad? I've heard something about an 'overseas hold' process, can someone with experience offer any tips?
  

Thanks for your input!

I am in a similar situation i.e. re-entry permit approved but seems to have been lost in the mail. The agent at my infopass appointment wasn't too helpful.

But, may be you can help: How do I get to null the original re-entry permit? Who should I call or write? Thanks.

At our infopass appointment we simply stated the clear relevant facts and timeline to the officer with clear questions (I think they really appreciate efficiency and professionalism, even though they are not at times) and they explained to us that the re-entry permit was in fact issued and hasn't been returned to sender. If it is deemed lost in the mail, then they will cancel the original and reissue one sent to our local Embassy. This would all be done internally to USCIS I assume.

We went the infopass at embassy with 2 specific questions in mind: 1. can they reissue the re-entry permit because we never received it? OR 2. can we apply for re-entry permit (and do the fingerprinting) at local embassy? Flying back to the US and waiting for USCIS processing is not an option for us.

For you, if possible, I would schedule another infopass and try again, unfortunately I feel like it's like trying to role a hard 6 to get immigration officers to help and clarify their misleading rules...

OR if you are the spouse of a US citizen that is registered to vote somewhere, contact your congressmen.

OR there are an abundant amount of lawyers in the US.

Hope this is some help for you, post back and let everyone know the outcome.

The Reentry Permit is needed once you are outside the US for 1 year, not 6 months. All this information is at your fingertips and I'm surprised that you did not look this up before going on a long trip.

Just Bob - while I appreciate your advice and correct me if I'm wrong, I think the policy of USCIS is - if LPR is out of USA for 6 months < LPR < 1 year time frame there is a reasonable suspicion of abandoned residency.

I would recommend to other US green card holders that if they plan to be out of the US anytime to think about being prepared to provide proof they haven't abandoned residency (which essentially a re-entry permit does for the > 1 year time frame until its expiration, which is typically 2 years) as USCIS actions/attitudes/mis-information seem to be unpredictable! My understanding is at 6 months out, the 'abandoned residency' suspicion starts. I don't want to start a discussion about the in-and-outs of maintaining residency but if you don't temporarily live in the US, work and maintain a residence abroad temporarily, they may try to take your GC if you don't have a re-entry permit and your out >6 months.

FYI, I left out details regarding the length of my abroad work assignment... I'm a US citizen, my wife has a conditional GC, and I'll be working abroad for longer than 1 year - we've moved and don't have a residence in the US at this time. Technically you have 1 year to be outside the US without a re-entry permit before abandoning residency, however USCIS can consider any amount of time they please when they deem you to having abandoning residency, including your past travel history. It may be that 6 months out is a timing threshold where USCIS's suspicion starts. Regardless, we do require a re-entry permit to maintain/waive the residency requirement of the US green card. The whole process gets fuzzy for me when we need to remove conditions from abroad, which I'll research at that time.

I'm just trying to play by their rules, keep my family together, and work in my chosen field, at times I go back an forth about just surrendering the GC and getting another one when we move back to the US, it may be the least costly and simplest option...