y2catalyst

Would like to address a comment on fantasy from post on similar forum. "Look a little closer to home unless you are interested in the fantasy trips that won't last very long." Can I explain how the journey started for me, Chapter 1?

There are many common reasons to look abroad for a relationship and the situations are as unique to each individual involved and there are usually 2 or 3 outcomes; works out great and happy life; works out great then a divorce; or those like me who gave it a shot and didn’t work out from the perspective of the visa process by caving into the stress of a K1/K3 denial ripping us apart. Call it fantasy call it fate, you decide fate or fantasy, here is Chapter 1.

Before I tried the K1 visa I had no idea I would ever go to China or considered it. I have been to several countries in my past and China wasn’t on my list, not that I did not like Chinese people, it just wasn’t a place I was interested in visiting. After 23 years of marriage to my Caucasian American wife, two great kids the marriage found its end several years before the divorce, by then leaving me with the house and my son who was 16 at the time, and of course a nice payout to my ex to start her new life (worked out for her to). For a few years after divorce I was so busy with my son keeping up with his year round high school sports which left me little time for a relationship. As the window was closing where my son would soon leave to college I decided it was time for me to date. I decided to join a dating site and after a handful dates seemed very much like a revolving door (无聊), I wanted that meaningful and deep relationship I didn’t have for 23 years in my 1^st marriage. One evening, as I casually browsed through my daily top matches on the dating site I came across an Asian lady's profile that explained she was raised in the States detailing her likes, dislikes, her this & that’s, her expectations and demands sounding like much of the profiles I came across which I also had for 23 years in my last marriage. I remember reading her last comment was intriguing and changed my life (as much as it could as old as I am), her comment “If you have an Asian fetish go look in China”.

Well I never had an Asian fetish and I never consider looking outside the States and epically China but it dawned on me that both my older brothers are marred and very happy with their Pilipino wives, I said heck I will give it a shot, go Asian! Much to my surprise on the dating site I could search in China and wow a laundry list of very beautiful Chinese ladies. Their profiles were far different then the American profiles and if you call it fantasy so be it, I was curious. I read carefully through profile after profile and found a few that I thought I would reach out and start a conversation. Then there was the one, the one I went to Chongqing for, man o man was she the Joy of my life at the time and I even call her Joy when she asked me to suggest an English name for her. Our conversations started by email then after a month a few calls, she could actually communicate in Basic English where we could actually understand one another. We talking while using internet chat tools at the same time which gave more clarity to our conversations. After a month just as I was feeling this fantasy wasn’t progressing very well, on the next phone conversation we had I just decided I to sing to her a song by Leo Sayer “when i need you” (since we were so far apart & I like to sing, haha). That’s when it happened, we just connected from that point on, she just listened and when I finished she had the most contagious giggle and in her sharp almost childish Chinese voice gave her approval saying this was her favorite song in English. I was like, “what?” how would she know that song, but she did and she even pulled it up on her computer and sang along with it while I was listening. We talked more than most married couples do when they are together, I would call her on the drive to work, I would call when I finished my day before bed and any chat on the computer on our open times in between.

For the next several months Joy (Zhou) and I talked, chatted, sang, laughed and I listened to stories of her daily life, some extremely funny, some sad, some exciting and her days of boredom or struggles. Joy is so charismatic with such a wonderful sprit I was sold, she was real, I bought my ticked to China and met her after 6 months after connecting with her “when I need you". This may have been the fantasy part of my story, I wasn’t quite sure what to expect when I went to Chongqing to meet my mail ordered bride, I even started to question myself as to what the heck I was doing. That was all erased when I gathered my bags and walked towards the exit point where several people were waiting for arriving guests and when I turned the corner she was screaming my name and I was in disbelief that I actually would go that far to meet someone who might be my wife. I went to her, we awkwardly hugged, stared in each other’s eyes thinking is this real, is this fantasy. We gathered ourselves and I took a cab to the city, dropped my bags at the hotel and we went for dinner getting acclimated to the whole situation. I had 3 weeks with her in Chongqing, the whole experience of China in the city I was a guest to, meeting her sister, parents, and her son. I remember going to the school where she waited for him and walking him home, I remember her parent’s hospitality, I remember going to Karaoke (kala) with her friends singing all night long, the massages, the disco and of course hot pot, this was all so real or was it fantasy. I was sold, I would ask her if she would want to pursue the K1 visa and formally be engaged and she said yes and I even came prepared with a ring. The remainder of the trip was gathering all the legal docs I would need from her translated to English to start the K1 visa process when I returned to the States and of course more hot pot.

When I returned to the States engaged, I didn’t question if I was in love, I was in love, (or was I desperate after 22 years of marriage not having that loving feeling). Anyways, I started the K1 process and we continued to talk and talk and talk and on July 30^th, 2010, a date I looked forward to for the longest time. Nothing in our paperwork or otherwise was out of line and she was given a white slip at her interview in Guangzhou, the interviewer barely gave her the time of day. For me, the emotions of being denied, for what, was the past year & a half of my time and personal connection with my finesse a joke to the US Immigration to decide what was best for me. I never in my life felt I wasn’t in control to the point where I had no rights while doing nothing wrong. If I make a mistake I deal with the consequences, this is true as a child and as an adult and I had Uncle Sam deciding my fate for me, well that is how I took it at the time, man I was pissed.

From there you know from the beginning of my story in Chapter 3 (I found her in my own back yard), Zhou and I did not take the next step and try marriage and the K3. I did not go to China the 1^st time for a fantasy, I went there for a wonderful person who I loved with such chorizema, passion and Joy. I owe her in so many ways, she changed the direction and fate in my life. This is my Ode to Joy (Zhou), she was as real as the keyboard I typed on, in person and lead me to my density with my with my now wife Lan who I realize now is more perfect for me, (Chapter 2, letting go of the guilt, maybe I will share that chapter next year, right now I am enjoying my wonderful wife and don’t want to regress). If you find each other in your own back yard or from another country it should be you to decide your fate weather the relationship lasts or it doesn’t. As pissed as I was on July 30^th 2010, my fate was left up in part to Uncle Sam. With all that, I also would not change my China experience for nothing, a roller coaster ride for sure, ups and downs not knowing how long the climb to get top to just to be let down, the thrill of the next turn and the emotions left in my stomach, but at least I have lived, experienced the fantasy and have a story to tell, much better than taking the merry-go-round. When the coaster stopped on this story I know I ended up with my “yuanfen” my wife Lan.

Now I am living my reality, so hop on your roller coaster and see where the fantasy takes you.

In a few years when I am ready to contemplate the subject, I think my next post will be asking advice on the "pros & cons of pursuing US Citizenship for my wife" till then keep it off topic :-)

The following from my profile on Candle for Love site. "Hi, my name is Rob and I have been communicating with my Fiancée Zhou since April 2009. I went to visit her in Chongqing for 2 week in October 2009 and soon after filed for our K1 Visa. The time has finally come and her interview is scheduled for July 30th 2010".

Now it is April 2013 and I thought I would look back at may Candle for Love site and it seems so long ago when I wrote the comments in my profile above. A lot has changed, I could never bring myself to visit this site or Candle for Love site after my negative post about the denied visa and the blow I felt to my guts after what I took seriously my relationship with my Fiancée Zhou and the K1 Visa being denied (white paper) July 30, 2010. With my investment of time and emotions exhausted, my next step was to go back to Chongqing to get married and try a marriage visa, by then my Fiancée Zhou's emotions were also exhausted the and pressure from the family not wanting her to leave ended the relationship. There are times I feel regret or feel sad about the bad experience with the K1 visa and Zhou, who I was so invested in emotionally and feel remorse for her feelings, I hope maybe she will be rewarded with the love she is hoping to find.

Time passed after the denied visa and I managed moved on, still burned emotionally and frustrated by the whole visa experience I remembered my favorite treat when I visited Chongqing called Hot Pot which is very famous in that Providence. I asked a Cheese Colleague of mine if there was a place that served Hot Pot and he mentioned a restaurant in China Town. After a few months passed I was in the area of China Town so I paid the restaurant a visit and ordered my Hot Pot. While I was enjoying my lunch I noticed a very stunning lady across the walkway dividing a hair salon from the restaurant where I noticed her working. Well, I surely had some time for a haircut, after lunch I walked in the salon and I was lucky enough to get this attractive lady named Lan to cut my hair. All the hair dressers in the shop were very friendly and the owner very engaged in conversation with me when I mentioned I had been to China before. Lan was very quiet, I tried to have conversation with her but was difficult, she was polite but she didn't say much the 1st time I saw her but I did learn she had been in USA for 2 years and I was welcome to come back for a haircut anytime. "Long story short", even though China Town was 45 minutes from my house I made it a point to visit Lan almost every other week for a haircut and our conversation became longer but never really engaged to the point she would consider anything of me other than a customer. After 3 months of visiting the shop, on my next haircut appointment I learned Lan went back to China for two months. After 2 1/2 months I received a call from the shop owner telling me Lan had returned and to come back to visit her. 3 weeks passed and I decided to go and visit Lan at the shop, as Lan prepared to cut my hair I asked if I could take her to lunch or dinner sometime as I did before on a few previous occasions but she responded as she did before "no thank you but you are welcome to come for hair cut". (I was starting to think the Visa process was a far better approach, just kidding). After a short pause Lan said, "you come back the next Saturday for dinner, can you take 2 friends that work in the shop for dinner too"? IT WAS ON! I came back the following week, my hair kept getting shorter and shorter but worth it, I took her and 2 friends for dinner the following Saturday. The following week we had arranged another dinner with a different friend, after a haircut of course. In the following weeks Lan introduced me to her friend of many years who had come from China long before her. I had dinner at her friend's house on many occasions meeting her friend's husband and children. After the many dinners and haircuts I learned Lan came over to USA on a Marriage Visa but was divorced after 1 year which was all together a very different story from mine but Lan also had a difficult experience.

After a month Lan and I dated normally, introducing her to my family, close friends and as time passed we naturally became a natural couple. I took Lan back to China so I could meet her family 2011 when I proposed to her there. When we returned back to USA Lan moved to my home and we got married a year later, May 2012 and now heading back to China later in 2013 to celebrate with her family. Everything came full circle, Lan is very traditional, she is very funny, loves my grandkids and my kids and likewise they all lover her, and my mom adores Lan. Lan is still quite by nature but she is still a wife that has normal expectations which I respect, she keeps me straight and I am glad she can hold her own. Did I mention, I am saving a lot on my haircuts now and I don't have to drive at all .

What an experience, As time goes by I learn more about Lan and I love her more from the 1st time I proposed. I found what I was looking for in a relationship, we continue to grow together not apart. Even though my previous experience took me to China and hers to the USA through different Journeys to find us together over HOT POT, wow, I never expected this or to have someone to love me as much as she does, Lan calls this "yuanfen".

I know there are many disappointments like mine with the visa struggle and all, but Thank you to those that know my story and hoped me the best because I found the best and in my own back yard

Thanks for the advice after my bad attitude, I just was not prepared for a no answer, I guess I should have been less optimistic, but I also could not ignore her emotions that triggered me.

I knew the circumstance of her previous B1 Visitor and she had all supporting documents about that case with her and if the matter was a concern to the VO she was prepared to present artifacts about that case to the VO but he did not want to hear or take any of our standard evidence after he asked 3 questions and look aimlessly for 5 minutes before handing the white slip.

For whatever it is worth sent fax of a long letter I wrote to Guangzhou detailing her previous B1 case and how that should be a concern when I am her sponsor and all the evidence she tried to present for our case was not looked at. I did CC: my Congressman. I don’t expect anything action from this and expect my letter will be ignored.

Yes, planning to just marry in Chongqing 1st week of September. Sorry again to all.

Thank you all for both your negative and positive comments. Either way some good will come of this thread and yes calmer minds prevail. Yes, I am calmer, I started this thread in the heat of the moment when I listen to the anguish of my Fiancée which I was never prepared to hear and thus my anguish.

Ok, thanks, I have read every comment and advice. Maybe this thread will help other’s in the future. I think I maybe I know where the issue is, she was refused a visitor visa in the past. I have already wrote my Congressman with a copy to Guangzhou Embassy and I am prepared do go the distance.

Who can I blame, no I cannot blame anyone and especially my race. Purely being emotional. I have struggled like many on this visa journey. I am sure many here started from little to getting where you are and what you have because you are a warrior. Yes, by nature I am a warrior and will I go for it, thank you.

After this post I think I know the specific issue which was likely her past visitor visa refusal in 2007 which I did not think would be an issue. I would be happy to share the detail of her circumstance for others to learn but I have already put myself out there so I want to go back in my personal shell (Teepee) and just fight for her like a warrior and I am sure we will be ok, just a little more time.

Sorry again to everyone here

"The Counculate has determined, based on your testimony, documents and any other evidance,that you do not have a bona fide relationship with your petitioner"

Three questions

1. When we met

2. How many time is see her in China

3. Are we engaged

Looked at his computer 5 minutes and issued white slip

All phone, travel, records, EOR letter, engagement ring, money trandfers and forms complete and verified by Lawyer but were never asked for even though she tried to present them.

April 2009 meet on internet

Oct 2009 two weeks in Chongqing and were engaged, showed her ring

Dec 2009 file K1

any news on what was in the white slip?

To the OP:

How many times did you visit her? Are they documented?

Visit once, October 2009. I will go back end of the month to visit again and try to file K1 again but my lawyer said if I go at the end of the month just marry her then. So we will try again either way.

Sorry, last post, sorry, My head is obviously not all there, my divorce was final July 2009.

You do. In the letters of intent, you specifically state that you are ready, willing and able to marry each other. One partner still being married (even if a divorce is pending) makes that statement untrue.

If this is actually the case, then that'd be exactly why the K1 Visa was denied. Nothing to do with race or discrimination, just a lack of planning and understanding the rules on behalf of the petitioner.

Sorry to everyone I offended, I can’t repost or take any words back as you know I was emotionally charged when I received the new. Arizona wants to profile, different subject and should not use that headline. As far as race card, how can I play that card, it will get me nothing with this application or appeal.

Well, there are several good comments on both sides of the fence, but at the same time I was wrong to point my race for any reason, on the other hand we did everything I can think of, including having attorney, income and solid root in this Country. Deciding to live in another country to be with who I love has nothing to do that I hate USA, but I hate this process where some VO is splitting hairs on bona fide relationship without looking at future evidence.

Ok, yes, Divorce filed and separated in 2007 and I explained this in letter but they never want to look at my EOR letter and attached Divorce filing. I met her in April 2009 on internet, so maybe this is the reason, I will let lawyer advice from here.

Hope those offended get over the offence, we all face some discrimination throughout our life, and my comment is not intended to discriminate or use race card, I am Just shocked! Will be my last post here so everyone can get on with their life as well I.

All front loading was in I-129F which included travel, modest money I send her every month, communication records and engagement ring receipt. Additional ongoing proof they never looked at it.

No red flags that I am aware. The only thing I can think is my Divoce was filed in 2007 and the divorce was final July 2010. I put that in my letter with copies of 2007 copy of filed divoce. I met Zheng April 2009 and visited her October 2009, So I can go back this month and file again in September.

Regardless of my post, the emotions are high like many others before me and I know I am not the only one faced with this situation regardless of race. My point is #######! Where did we go wrong, I cant figure it out. The letter received said we did not prove Bona fide relationship, but they never look at any of our proof. Zheng has simple life so nothing in her background and nothing in by background. The letter said the case will be sent back to CIS where I can contact them and file appeal. Is it easier for me just to go back to Chongqing again this month get more proof and file K1 Visa again in September?

Sorry for offending anyone but everyone in this world is offended some way or another, please dont miss my point.

Good day!1..my fiance is also an American Indian(both of his parents), but he is proud to say that he is American and never let his ethnicity hinder his goals in life...you,ranting here, wouldn't help you at all...most of the people here were being good to you, trying to give encouragements, but somehow you've been acting a lil rude(sorry to say that)..there might be other reasons why your petition was denied...as for us,we will be having my interview this coming August..me & my fiance are really praying that by God's will, we will get an approval(somehow, I would like to know if your assumption is right.. )I guess, it's not whether who you or what you have..It's about faith, being humble and respectful to what is there,...things happen for a reason..if it is for you, if will be for you no matter what will happen...just hang on, your attorney might find solutions to help you&your fiancee on your petition...God bless!!... ..have a good day ahead!!..

I talk to her many hours today, we will not give up, I do not say I am above or less than anyone and my citizenship is rooted in this country since it was founded. Yes, I am angry and sad because there are things I do not understand, I know it is more than income and mine is over 100k per year. I overcame hardships growing up and made choices along the way that put me in a position where I think I can decide to exercise my rights as a citizen of USA regardless of what Country she is from and marry her. We talked a long time today and I think I will go to Chongqing in a few weeks again, and file K1 Visa Again and see why USA will refuse us Again!

your the clowns, we do have an attorney, lets see what he has to say.

What are you talking about, they did not even take the EOR letter, yet let Zheng say anything at the interview. Just a quick no! I am sure I make twice as much as you and your family put into this slipping USA economy. What's your point?

What’s hard, I know why it is hard, because I am not Freaking white in USA, this is why, the USA use the Navajo language to Fu#@$% Japan and now USA Fu#@$% cheat me and Zheng and now I hope the world can see American Indians were removed from this planet long ago. I would rather live in China with Zheng then go through this again.

The gender of interview was a Chinese man, I have sent my lawyer the White slip copy tomorrow. Best Case I will move to China if that is what it takes. This country already robbed my heritage many years ago so #######, I will not let USA rob me now.

Point is Now American Indian will have to prove they are from USA, hmmm, I think I will move to China to be with the woman I love.

Un Freaking believable, All our paperwork was perfect to my knowledge. Zheng had so much support at Guangzhou from other Visa goers and they help to verify again our paper work and evidence. The interviewer asked my Fiancee 2 questions which she answered them perfect. She speaks very good English and she tried to present my EOR letter at the interview and other sufficient evidence but they did not want to accept anything and gave her a white slip. I am very successful and have made so much freaking money in this country and paid so much taxes in this country and this makes me furious that they would treat me like sh#$%, and they treat her like sh#$%, then it is as if my country who I cant imagine how much I have paid in taxes would not accept any of our evidence. Like most of you we have spent over a year in our relationship committed and in love and it comes down to this B.S. #######. What Freaking proof do they need with a white slip,, , no offense, I am American Indian and I did everything next to NOT being WHITE, so #######, is this why I have a WHITE SLIP, USA is still in the Freaking south, it's now USA called Arizona, can't give an American Indian a break who loves a Chinese Woman.

Yes, I have all SCAN copies I listed & just completed reproducing origional duplicates & Forms with my mew signatures where needed, including forms for her signature.

Thank you very much, I think we will be fine. I will have the package to FedEx 1st thing in the morning, time is ticking, tick....tick...tick... love the pressure

Rob

Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experience. I actually meant Engagement Ring Receipt, sorry.

Best Regards,

Rob

Well, we have come so far and our Interview appointment is scheduled for July 30. We have spent almost a half year preparing for the interview. I had originally intended to meet my fiancée in Guangzhou however because of employment responsibilities I could not.

Well I guess I made a big mistake by sending my documents to my fiancée by USPS Priority Mail in mid June. It appears USA said they sent them and China system indicates there were sent but they did not receive them.

I did make color copies of everything or reproduced in duplicate originals of several of the artifacts we need and can reproduce original signature documents and have them delivered within 5 day to my Fiancee wiht FedEx service.

I have color copies of the following however these are the only artifacts I cannot produce originals for:

1. I-797

2. Engagement Receipt

3. Hotel Receipts (October 09)

4. Boarding Passes (October 09)

Your Advice is Appreciated, Should we reschedule the interview until we can get a new I-797?

Thank you,

Robert

thank you both for the feedback. One more question about medical exam. How many days before the interview should the medical exam be scheduled?

Thank you,

Rob

I am sure this comes up alot.

My fiancée told me she has no instructions in packet 4 about the medical exam appointment or date. Who does she call for medical appointment?

She also has no vaccination records so she will need to have all vaccinations administrated before the medical exam date.

Rob - no - the dates you mentioned - you'll be fine.

In the artifacts list - you include a current 'employment letter' also ?

Good Luck ! Go Pink !

Thank you both for responding. Yes, Employment letter was signed off by my manager May 18th.