Affidavit of support question- regarding current income (Part 6, Q2)

[LondonWelsh 0]

Hi all

Could anyone please help with this question on the I-864?

My FiL is a co-sponsor and is self-employed.

For Part 6, question two we are unsure what he should put. Obviously he has already put his earnings for 2013/14 and 15 in the spaces provided and will give IRS receipts as proof.

As he is self-employed should his 'current annual income' be what he has *actually earned* in the first 7mo of this year or his *projected earnings* for the year?

In 2015 he filed considerably less than usual as he had many expenses, but as of this year he will be over the poverty threshold again. We are going on assets to be sure as he has well over the limit in stocks and property. However, we also have bank statements etc which show his earnings for the first half of the year.

Just unsure as a self-employed person what to put - actually as my husband is self-employed too I'll need to know as he's my petitioner...

I've actually read the instructions this time on the guidance and I'm still not sure in this instance!

Thanks in advance for any assistance!

LW x

[Nich-Nick 3,353]

For a self-employed person, the only income he can claim and prove is pretty much what his last tax return says on Form 1040 Line 22.

He can't predict income because he could reduce that income when he files next year by including a lot of business expenses. The folks who can predict and get by with more income than the last tax return are those who have a regular job. The employer can write a letter saying what the current salary is. Unfortunately, that does not work for self-employed because of the ability to reduce their profit with expenses on Schedule C.

[LondonWelsh 0]

Thanks Nich-Nick

It says on Page 7 (Part 6, Item no.2) of the instructions that 'you may include evidence supporting your claim about your expected income if you believe that submitting this evidence will help you establish ability to maintain income'... also 'you may provide pay stubs for showing your income for the past 6 months'.

I know it's different as he's self-employed (and indeed the reduction of profit with expenses is exactly what happened to give a big blip on his reported earnings in 2015, sigh) so I'm thinking the best course would be to:

- go on assets (he definitely has enough for income to - hopefully- not be an issue) - we have all the paperwork to back this up.

- put his *actual earnings* for 2016 so far in the Part 2, Question 6 box on the form (gross receipts and sales from Jan-July are currently at 21k), since we have to enter something in there, and then explain in an attached letter that it only covers those months (and what he would estimate as a projection)?

We also have a letter from him to explain why his 2015 was lower than usual and IRS statements from 2103/14 to show what his more usual earnings are and that 2016 is projected to be more in line with those.

But as I say we'll be going on assets, so this will be more to back up his case as my sponsor.

Does that make sense?

Thanks again N-N!

LW x

For a self-employed person, the only income he can claim and prove is pretty much what his last tax return says on Form 1040 Line 22.

He can't predict income because he could reduce that income when he files next year by including a lot of business expenses. The folks who can predict and get by with more income than the last tax return are those who have a regular job. The employer can write a letter saying what the current salary is. Unfortunately, that does not work for self-employed because of the ability to reduce their profit with expenses on Schedule C.

[Nich-Nick 3,353]

Page 7 (Part 6, Item no.2) Is what I mean by a regular employed person has resources to document his current income. For example somebody who graduated from college in 2015 and only worked November and December would have a sorry looking tax return. But he has the option to document his new job pays $3000/ month and claim current income of $36,000 per year. He can document it with an employer letter, employment contract, or pay stubs.

But a self-employed person has no "employer" to write a letter. There is nothing that will document his profit/loss except filing a tax return.

I think if you predict a self-employed figure for 2016 and that amount is higher than 2015 tax return Line 22, then you will get an RFE saying the income is not documented. It's just a problem with a self-employed sponsor. He tries to lower his tax bill by coming up with all kinds of deductions to lower his income. (We do the same). But it backfires on you because he needs more income to sponsor.

What I would do if it was mine:

1) Put current income box as whatever his 2015 tax return says on Line 22

2) Use 5x assets to make up the shortfall in income. Document them.

3) Don't write letter to explain anything. It's the government and there is no subjectivity or sympathy on the form. Show enough money on the form and prove it with documents....tax return, financial statements.

Forgot to say-- is he married and is the tax return Joint?

Edited August 14, 2016 by Nich-Nick

[LondonWelsh 0]

Thank you. DEFINITELY don't want an RFE- no time, we need to fly 1st week of Oct and interview is Sept 13!

I think we'll play it safe then and do as you suggest. The only reason this even happened is he used an accountant to make it go faster and they said he could claim the expenses!

No marriage, no dependents, he is a household of 1 (so, 2 including me for the purposes of the form )

Might be worth me having copies of his earnings for this year anyway in case they ask? (Bank statements)

TVM!!

Page 7 (Part 6, Item no.2) Is what I mean by a regular employed person has resources to document his current income. For example somebody who graduated from college in 2015 and only worked November and December would have a sorry looking tax return. But he has the option to document his new job pays $3000/ month and claim current income of $36,000 per year. He can document it with an employer letter, employment contract, or pay stubs.
But a self-employed person has no "employer" to write a letter. There is nothing that will document his profit/loss except filing a tax return.

I think if you predict a self-employed figure for 2016 and that amount is higher than 2015 tax return Line 22, then you will get an RFE saying the income is not documented. It's just a problem with a self-employed sponsor. He tries to lower his tax bill by coming up with all kinds of deductions to lower his income. (We do the same). But it backfires on you because he needs more income to sponsor.

What I would do if it was mine:
1) Put current income box as whatever his 2015 tax return says on Line 22
2) Use 5x assets to make up the shortfall in income. Document them.
3) Don't write letter to explain anything. It's the government and there is no subjectivity or sympathy on the form. Show enough money on the form and prove it with documents....tax return, financial statements.

Forgot to say-- is he married and is the tax return Joint?

[LondonWelsh 0]

So as a household of 2 we need to have $20,025 as our poverty guideline https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/files/form/i-864p.pdf and if he has $8071 on his 2015 tax return, that means he has to prove 5x the shortfall which would be $11,964 x 5 = $59,770.

He has £135k in shares and £118k in real-estate (checking the exact amount as two of his three properties were assessed together and one is his main residence so that won't count, but even just in shares he has enough) so that should see me fine anyway right?!

As long as we can prove it?

Writing this stuff down for me as much as anything else

Thank you. DEFINITELY don't want an RFE- no time, we need to fly 1st week of Oct and interview is Sept 13!

I think we'll play it safe then and do as you suggest. The only reason this even happened is he used an accountant to make it go faster and they said he could claim the expenses!

No marriage, no dependents, he is a household of 1 (so, 2 including me for the purposes of the form )

Might be worth me having copies of his earnings for this year anyway in case they ask? (Bank statements)

TVM!!

Edited August 15, 2016 by LondonWelsh

[LondonWelsh 0]

One more thing on this, the current statement we have for his investment portfolio is from 1-31 July.

Will we need the one from August as my interview is on 13 September (and presumably he could cash the whole lot in on August 1st?!)

If so will an emailed copy do as I'm not sure it would arrive by post in time?

And also would this invalidate the amount he's currently put on the form as August figure may be slightly different from July? Or will it not matter as long as it's above the amount we need it to be?

TIA once again!

[Nich-Nick 3,353]

I think 31-July is fine. Do you have 2013 and 2014 tax returns that might show more income and that he doesn't typically take such large business deductions? Schedule C is where you can see the breakout of income vs expenses.

You will be presenting this in person in London, right? While they do have to follow the law which is precise, they won't be hard-nosed about it and make you jump through extra hoops.

Also be sure you have a photocopy of his American birth certificate or passport which is required from a joint sponsor.

[LondonWelsh 0]

Belated reply to this, sorry! Hectic week :/

Yes we have the 2013 and 2014 tax returns Also a photocopy of both birth certificate and passport (belt and braces!)

There is actually a deduction on his tax return of about $700 *after* line 22 so we are putting the lower figure just to be on the safe side so it doesn't look like we're putting more than the final amount.

Thanks again for your help!

LW x

I think 31-July is fine. Do you have 2013 and 2014 tax returns that might show more income and that he doesn't typically take such large business deductions? Schedule C is where you can see the breakout of income vs expenses.

You will be presenting this in person in London, right? While they do have to follow the law which is precise, they won't be hard-nosed about it and make you jump through extra hoops.

Also be sure you have a photocopy of his American birth certificate or passport which is required from a joint sponsor.

...and yes presenting in person, in London