davidanhhong

at the citizenship interview or the oath ceremony? Thanks.

oath ceremony

You won't even get into your oath ceremony without your greencard if that tells you anything along with your oath letter. Somebody here posted they took away their greencard at the interview, but never came back to say how they made out. At your interview, should walk out with the same exact stuff you walked in with.

Oh, so right! When my wife went to get her driver's license renewed, the clerk kept her green card. We got out the door and relaized they never gave the green card back, so we went back in and retrieved it.

Also, during the fingerprint interview at the local office, the officer forgot to give my wife her passport back. She forgot about it and it wasn't until she was scheduled for the naturalization interview that we realized the fingerprint office kept it. What's telling (and sad, really) about the USCIS efficiency (or lack thereof), they didn't bother calling us even though the office chief had my wife's passport sitting in her office for 3 weeks.

Most of the parts of USCIS that I have had the misfortune to experience, are at best barely competent, IMHO. The big prize at the end of the process makes most people forget about the rudeness, lack of customer service, incompetence, etc. However, since I work at a different Federal agency, I know how a properly run office should function. USCIS should be ashamed of itself.

Oh, I see. Thanks david.

I was just wondering if I need to do the same (go to clerk of court and file petition), when:

1) the AO already had me signed papers for the petition of namechange (I dont know if they will hand me a piece of paper that officially says my name has been changed during the oath)

2) Our marriage took place in my home country, not here in the US. That's why my name on my foreign passport already reads like this: "First Name + Maiden last name + Husband's last name". On my greencard, SScard, DL, my immigration petition papers and all of our US pertinent documents and papers, my name reads like that. I was explaining to the AO that even before I was petitioned by my husband, my name has been LEGALLY changed to that form thru the power of the judge who married us back in my home country. Therefore, before I even set foot in the US as an immigrant, my name has already been like that, LEGALLY.

All of my petition papers bear the same name. The Consul who interviewed me for my CR1 visa had no problems with it. But this AO during the N400 interview said that they base the name on birth certificate of the applicant. To which I was in complete disagreement because the US has no power to invalidate what was legally transpired in other countries which they dont have the power over. But the AO wont budge! He said I need not do anything else but sign the papers he has prepared for me and the judge will make it final during the oath. I just dont know if the papers he had me signed were like that of the name change petition form you attached and that it will go thru the same procedure as your wife's did.

Last question:

So after you have your naturalization certificate and the signed court order showing your legal name as desired, you can go to the SSA office and register as a US Citizen. This is by far the easiest way to handle it; otherwise you may encounter problems when getting your passport, driver license renewal, etc - not to mention other legal documents like property or auto title, bank accounts, etc.

In your opinion (or knowledge), what could be the problem that one might encounter with all the things mentioned if that person didnt go thru all that name change petition procedure with the clerk of court, even if that person's naturalization certificate, DL, SS, titles, bank accts etc, are all under the name that he/she has already been legally using even before becoming an immigrant?

Thanks a bunch, David

Well, I'm no lawyer but one problem might be if you decide to refinance or purchase a house - all mortgage companies now require a "full doc" loan process, and they will verify all the information against your SSN number. So when you take your naturalization certificate to the SSA to register as a US Citizen, you will save yourself a lot of time and trouble if your registered name agrees with what you have been using before. This probably holds as well if you want to sell a house - with the increase in mortgage fraud, a title search needs to come up perfect.

In the good old days, all you had to do was sign a piece of paper the loan officer would give you, attesting that all the various names you used or went by previously were all the same person - you. However, I would guess nowadays they would have to actually investigate any discrepancies.

What I suggest is that you wait and see how your certificate reads. If no problem, then don't worry . If it is incorrect, then as I mentioned, it takes about 10 days to get the court order back. Then, and only then, I would go to the SSA with both the certificate and the name change order so that they can record both documents.

I'm leaving for the SSA office in a few minutes to do exactly that, with my wife Hong. I'll post an update tonight and let you know how it turned out.

Regards,

David & Hong.

Hi guys,

I had my interview today. I passed and got that paper that says Congratulations!

It is still a bit of a haze for me, I cant even remember if I saw him stamped my application with "APPROVED" or anything like that. I was confused because he was talking so fast and he was in a bit of a hurry. He was flipping thru my documents soooo fast that it was like a blur to me. I hope he didnt forget to stamp my application with that "approved" thing. That is the most important thing

He made me raise my right hand and asked if I will tell the truth. Yes, of course.

He asked me to read and write simple english sentences.

I was asked 6 easy questions from the old test. I was given no choice. He fired away the first question at once.

And then he looked for some documents, tax return transcripts, marriage cert, birth certificate. He asked for driver's license, passport and greencard.

When he saw my birth certificate, he told me that per Virginia law, I could not use my maiden last name as my middle name, which is how my name is written on my foreign passport. He said no necessary step is to be taken on my part, he said that the judge will make it legal for me during the oath ceremony. So he had me sign several papers with the way my name should "be" per VA law, without a middle name since I was not given a second name at birth. Then he had me sign my pictures with my usual signature as I have on my foreign passport. He said that in other states, the wife's maiden name used as the middle name is not an issue. But in VA, he said it is not allowed.

I read somewhere in this forum that somebody also encountered this "maiden/middle name" issue thing. I just couldnt recall what the AO told the applicant.

I suppose it is gonna be like a "name change" for me to make it legal to use the form of my name I am using right now in the state of VA. But what confuses me is that I read somewhere that an applicant had to appear before the judge for the name change or something before his oath. What was not clear to me was if that person had it minutes or an hour before the oath at the same place where the oath ceremony was held and with the same judge who presided the oath.

I asked when to expect my oath. He said, since March is almost over, it is probably in April. And he added, your oath is not gonna be here at Fairfax, it is gonna be in Lynchburg. In my head, I am a little bit confused about that since I have not heard of Lynchburg city to be a place for a naturalization oath ceremony. I have heard of Montecillo but not Lynchburg. Oh, I dont care where in VA as long as I take my oath soon! Even if they ask me to go back to NC where I was fingerprinted just to have my oath , I wouldn't mind! April sounds too good, I hope that it's true

I asked him if my name has already been cleared by the FBI or it still needs to be submitted for namecheck. He responded, "Your name has been cleared, we could have not approve you if it has not been cleared."

Then he handed me that piece of paper that says, Congratulations! It says that I passed the english and civics test and that I am recommended for approval. I just wish I had seen him stamped my application with that APPROVED stamp I really couldnt recall. He probably did when I was not looking as I was getting the documents he asked for. But not sure I hope he didnt forget!

So, one more "waiting game and postman watch" to go. I guess I'd be singing to our postman

everyday

"Mister postman look and see

If there's an oath letter in your bag for me..."

I hope this one wont take longer that what the AO told me. I hope and pray.

Sakura, it was my wife who encountered the same problem about using her maiden name as her middle name - which is how her VA driver's license, our house title, bank accounts, car title, yadda yadda yadda all read . Unless your naturalization certificate does read the same, you should do an official name change like we did, at the county courthouse in Mansassas if you live in Prince William county. It cost $39 and you have to fill out the legal petition plus the court order granting same plus a self-addressed stamped envelope so that they can mail the signed order back to you, but there is no need to actually appear before the judge. You just go to the clerk's office with all the paperwork filled out - exactly as it appears in the guide which I've attached herePWC_Court_Petition_for_Legal_Name_Change.pdf. We filled out 2 copies of both the petition and order. After the clerk verifies your driver's license and swears you to tell the truth, she'll sign her part and give you back one order stamped "received" as evidence in case you need to file it before actually getting the signed order. But, it only took about 10 days for the signed order to arrive in the mail.

So after you have your naturalization certificate and the signed court order showing your legal name as desired, you can go to the SSA office and register as a US Citizen. This is by far the easiest way to handle it; otherwise you may encounter problems when getting your passport, driver license renewal, etc - not to mention other legal documents like property or auto title, bank accounts, etc.

Anyway, good luck!

Congratulations davidanhhong! Finally!

Did the AO tell you to go to court for the name change or you just decided that it's best to do that? As the AO explained to me, I dont need to do any further steps for me to be able to use my maiden last name as my middle name now that I'm married. He said the judge will make it legal and final for me during the oath.

Anyways, all of us could use a little vacation after all this. I hope that the rest of us could get to the finish line very soon!

Sakura, we didn't have a "judge" administer the oath - it was just the deputy director of the Alexandria office. I believe under VA law, only a judge can legally change your name.

But, you might just wait and see what happens in your ceremony.

PS - I quickly learned NOT to put much faith in what the AO told us. They may mean well, but they also want to get rid of you and move on to the next victim - er, customer

Sorry for not updating like I promised earlier, but after posting the last time and scheduling the Infopass appt. at the Alexandria office, my wife's oath ceremony letter arrived in the mail! Anyway, last Wednesday 3/25 we arrived at the Alexandria office at 8AM, waited in line for half an hour, then checked in and waited some more. Finally an officer took us upstairs to the 2nd floor and after fumbling around with the video and loudspeaker equipment, the deputy director of the office came in and said a few words, then swore everyone in as US Citizens!! After watching the "Proud to be an American" video, she then posed with each new citizen for a photo op. So after 4-1/2 years, my wife became a citizen around 10AM

My wife's mother has been staying with us on a tourist visa, which was to expire on December 1st, and I had applied for a visa extension for her which got turned down Feb. 24th and she was given 30 days to depart the USA. We had also engaged an immigration attorney to handle her mom's immigration application, but we couldn't file it until my wife got her citizenship. So immediately after the oath ceremony, we went by the attorney's office so that they could make a copy of the citizenship certificate, and then they overnighted the immigration application so that her mom can stay here. Talk about cutting it close! I had been monitoring the 1-way ticket prices to Saigon for the last month, and was about to buy the nonrefundable ticket but decided to wait until after the last Infopass appt. And of course found the oath ceremony letter in the mail the evening before. That saved us about $850.

Anyway, after getting the letter I had to take off from work and do all the stuff the immigration attorney had been telling us to do for the last 4 months, such as getting my mother-in-law's inoculations, etc etc. That turned out to be pretty expensive - about $400 total since a new vaccine was added to the list sometime this year ($180 for it alone!). And also we had to go to the courthouse in Manassas and do my wife's legal name change (which came back yesterday).

So tomorrow, we will go to the social security office with my wife's naturalization certificate, plus her court-order for her name change, and register her as a US Citizen, then later in the week go apply for her US passport.

I could use a serious vacation after all this!

I wonder if USCIS monitors these forums to head off potential complaints to Congress...

Thanks everyone for your kind wishes, and I'll post an update tomorrow after the next (hopefully last!) USCIS appointment.

While waiting to speak to an officer during the last appointment at the Alexandria office, I overheard several people getting treated rather brusquely or even rudely when they attempted to get more information or state their side of the story. So it seems us poor applicants have no power and little respect from the officers. Even the immigration attorneys representing their clients had to sweet-talk the officers in order to get them to look up information or get involved in solving the applicants' problems.

The whole office looks shabby and decrepit, with watermarks on the ceiling tiles and the display equipment not functioning. Overall it must be a rather depressing place to work. So tomorrow I'll bite my tongue a lot and attempt to sweet-talk my way through this, even though I really hate this bureaucracy by now .

Regards,

David & Hong

Thanks Sak... I'm trying to get my wife to call the Senators office and put the screws to them. We shall see =)

Hi, I'm about ready to write my senator as well. We applied for my wife's N400 back in August 2008, she passed her interview on 10/22/08, and then nothing. I tried writing a letter to the IO officer in January of this year - no response. Then I called the toll-free number - no help since they insist on waiting 120 days from the interview. So I waited until Feb. 20, 2009 and called again - they wrote down our information and promised to make an official inquiry as to why the oath ceremony letter was being held up. By that time I didn't really trust them to do anything so I made an Infopass appt. and we went to the Alexandria office to find out what the problem was, on Feb. 23, 2009.

After waiting an hour, we finally spoke with one of the information officers, who looked up the case # and said there were two FBI inquiries on my wife sent out near the end of August, and only the 2nd one had come back (clean, of course). So they were waiting for the first (earlier by about 10 days) one to come back. The information officer said he would try and get the office to accept the second FBI check result as satisfactory and waive the first one. The officer took down my cellphone number and said he would call me with an update, and he did call back later that day stating everything was OK now and to expect the oath ceremony letter in the mail "shortly". About half an hour later, another officer from USCIS called and told me that there was a problem with my wife's legal name. As is customary, I had put down her first name, maiden (last) name and my last name as her married name on our marriage certificate when we got married in 2004, and she has been going by that name ever since. The USCIS officer told me that under Virginia (where we live) law, her name is her first name, her two middle names and then my last name. I have never heard of this practice and I seriously doubt that it is true - if somebody here knows, please let me know . Anyway, I told her that we wanted to proceed with the oath ceremony ASAP and that we would get her name legally changed afterwards, which she agreed with, and so ended our conversation.

To make a long story short, we haven't heard anything from USCIS since then. The next oath ceremony according to the 2nd officer is March 20th. There is no way to call the Alexandria office - they blank out the last 7 digits of their phone number when calling me on the cellphone. So now I have another Infopass appt. scheduled for this Wednesday, 18 March 09, to find out what the latest problem is. Hopefully it can be resolved in 2 days so that she can get her citizenship next Friday.

I suspect it may be that they are waiting for an official name change document, despite the assurances from the 2nd officer, so this Monday we will go to the Manassas courthouse and get my wife's name legally changed to what we have been using for the last 4-1/2 years now.

I sincerely hope to be shed of the USCIS soon, as I am pretty tired of dealing with this agency. And I have been a supervisor in another Federal agency for the last 12 years - I would never tolerate such lack of customer service and followthrough in my employees as seems to be the norm at USCIS. My employees know that if a customer calls them up, they are expected to take ownership of the problem, even if it is in another department, and get some satisfactory resolution if possible, and a detailed explanation if not, within one business day if at all possible. And if not possible, to call the customer and keep them informed! After all, they pay some substantial fees to apply to my agency, and that's the least they deserve. And I will be glad to suggest this change of policy to the USCIS, via my senator and Pres. Obama (once we are done with them, naturally ).

Sorry for the rant, and I know many people here probably have worse stories to tell, but it feels good to vent!