Bint Halawa

Listen, my husband is a chemical engineer from Iran. With experience in training army personnel how to protect themselves in anti-chemical, anti-biological attack....If there was anyone who would be singled out by the government, it's my husband given his profession and military experience. And yet, I am not behaving or venting like you are.

So get off the "I'm persecuted because my fiance is muslim" rant....You've got nothing to vent about compared my situation.

I done with you.

Actually your husband sounds EXACTLY like what this administration is looking for.... Iranians ready and willing to leave their country with potential intelligence information that can be extracted from them for political purposes... I'm sure they are rolling out a red carpet for him right now... Who knows maybe he has the piece of information they need to seal their case for a war with Iran...

I haven't had a rant yet... I think that's what you are here for... ranting where there is no need. So you have a "situation"? I would think with your vast expertice and limitless knowledge you would be breezing through this process. I'm sure Colin Powell could make a slide show out of your husband's background and present a convincing case for him to be awarded citizenship upon arrival!

So glad to know you're done... I'm just getting started...

Bint,

Hey man, I wasn't too impressed about your private email with the comment about the reason your being RFE'd was because you were in WASP America. First of all, I'm a WASP who is actually taking the time to look into your problem (researching the I-129F instructions and see if there was something you overlooked).

Secondly, if is such a negative place to live for you because of the all the WASPS then why are you trying to bring your fiance here?

I will overlook your racist response to your feeling of being racially targeted.

As for divorce decrees:

When I married my second husband in Thailand before we could proceed with the ceremony, I had to first fill out a form in the US Consulate that proved I was free to marry. One of the requirements was I had present a my divorce decree which could only be certified by the LEGAL ISSUEING AUTHORITY (translated only the courthouse that gave the original could certify a copy).

So they may be following the same rule with you. Feel free to contact them and show what rule they are referring - or - what source they are siting for this RFE business.

Additionally, when I filled in my DS-230 for my second husband, we sent in copies of our Thailand marriage registration (certified by a notary public). However, I was RFE'd because those documents also had to CERTIFIED BY THE LEGAL ISSUEING AUTHORITY (translated: only the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs could certify a photocopy of our Thai marriage certificate).

Best of luck to you.

I'm not here to impress you. I am not a racist and since when does being discriminated AGAINST make a person a racist????? I thought racists were people who discriminated against people on the basis of their ethnicity? Not the ones being discriminated against. WASP simply means White Anglo-Saxon Protestant... is that derogatory to you? I have never found it to be. (I am a WASMuslim)

I certainly think you over-reacted to my PRIVATE comment and show poor judgement referring to it in this forum, if I wanted my comment to be public I would have posted it as such.

And yes I am certain that anyone attempting to bring an Arab Muslim male into the USA will be targeted in one way or another and that all stops will be pulled out to prevent them from doing so. I'm bringing my fiancee here because this is where I have family reponsibilities that prevent me from moving to his country, well at least for NOW.

I have heard from more than one attorney that getting my fiancee here will be a huge challenge. That the USCIS is a walk in the park compared to getting through the processing done at the Embassy in Egypt. In fact the attorney said the officers are REWARDED for denying applications!

I am not able to marry him at ALL in his country. Bringing him HERE is the ONLY LEGAL ROUTE available to me for a legal marriage. US Citizens can no longer have a legal marriage performed in Egypt. Not since April of this year. And there is no sign that this will change in the near future.

The document I provided them was a copy of his divorce decree stamped CERTIFIED by the court in Egypt, along with a FULL English translation and certification of the translators competency as required by the USCIS.

I start phoning tomorrow. Thanks for your efforts to assist.

You were very wise... I had started to do this and then followed the advice of the lady at our local INS office who reviewed my packet before I sent it. I should have followed my instinct.

I think they are leary of us "older folks" getting married when we've had previous divorces. And my fiancee had not gone and had his done in the courts (just religiusly) until a very short time before we met in person for the first time. I'm sure they see a lot of cases where men are trying to keep a wife in the old country and get married to an American for immigration purposes. However they are NOT half as concerned about that as I AM!

My divorce papers were in spanish so I had them translated to english by a certified translator.

I think they said that copies were fine and to send originals if asked. But when the time came to send all my documents, I sent them all original just to be safe, and not have them ask for it later.

Shukran Gazeelan for your advice and good wishes. Fortunately I have friends coming from Egypt on Monday so they will bring me the papers and I will march to the INS office here and show the the RFE and ask them what the heck they want. I also told him to go get another certified copy of the divorce decree from the court and take it over to the translators office and have them print, sign, and stamp another set of the translation documents in case he needs them at the time of the interview.

I wonder what other documents he will need to have translated? Birth Certificate? Military papers?

Personally it feels to me like they are stalling... or trying to throw a wrench in the process to make me give up. Like they say, just because you're paranoid DOESN"T MEAN they are NOT out to getcha! hahahahahahaha

I feel very blessed that I am able to travel to see him often, this will be my 3rd trip this year. I was just hoping to have the process further along by time I got there to help with any stuff that needed to be done on his end. He asks "WHY" way too often...

When i sent my divorce papers to the USCIS i send in a copy of my divorce decree and i send the original to my fiance for his interview. Unless they changed things from then until now. So if your being told to send the original to USCIS that is what i would do. Just make sure you gets copies then when it comes time for his interview the Embassy in Cairo will already have the original divorce decree because it will be with you Approved NOA2 K-1 petition. When his papers get sent to the Embassy (after it gets approved, and goes through the National Visa Center ) they will send him packet 3 which will indiate that he needs original copies of everything you can include the phtocopy of the divorce papers just in case but they will already have the Original from your petition. I hope this helps have a wonderful time in Egypt and i wish you both all the best on your journey!!

AJ1

That's right and I haven't gotten a helpful answer yet... in either place...

It is the USCIS that is asking for a "CERTIFIED COPY".... the one I sent them was a copy of the original who the heck do they want it "CERTIFIED" by????

I will have the original document back in my possession this coming week and will march to the local USCIS office and put them in head hold until they tell me! Just kidding security guards..

Today I rec'd an RFE indicating that I need to submit a "legible final certified copy" of my fiancee's divorce decree. When I completed my I-129F I took it to my local INS office and had them review all the documents. They told me not to send the Certified Translation of the Divorce Decree but rather to send a copy. They said if they wanted to see the original documents that would take place at my fiancee's interview at the consulate in his country. So I sent a complete copy of the document and had a friend take the original document to my fiancee in Egypt when she went for a visit so he would have it with him when it came time for his interview.

I'm totally frustrated.... I just went back to the instructions on the I-129F, read all the posts on this forum I could find dealing with type of copies required and find NOTHING that indicates I had to send either the original or a "Certified" copy of the divorce decree in the original filing.

Now I suppose I have to get the origianal document back from Egypt and then what will he take with him to the interview in the consulate???? Who can deem a document tranlated in Egypt as a "Certified copy"??????

I have to get this back to them by January 31, 2008... I leave for Egypt Dec 17 and won't return until February 2008 so I have to get this show on the road PRONTO....

Any suggestions???

Today I rec'd an RFE indicating that I need to submit a "legible final certified copy" of my fiancee's divorce decree. When I completed my I-129F I took it to my local INS office and had them review all the documents. They told me not to send the Certified Translation of the Divorce Decree but rather to send a copy. They said if they wanted to see the original documents that would take place at my fiancee's interview at the consulate in his country. So I sent a complete copy of the document and had a friend take the original document to my fiancee in Egypt when she went for a visit so he would have it with him when it came time for his interview.

I'm totally frustrated.... I just went back to the instructions on the I-129F, read all the posts on this forum I could find dealing with type of copies required and find NOTHING that indicates I had to send either the original or a "Certified" copy of the divorce decree in the original filing.

Now I suppose I have to get the origianal document back from Egypt and then what will he take with him to the interview in the consulate???? Who can deem a document tranlated in Egypt as a "Certified copy"??????

I have to get this back to them by January 31, 2008... I leave for Egypt Dec 17 and won't return until February 2008 so I have to get this show on the road PRONTO....

Any suggestions???

It's not that women are "unclean" during their menstrual cycle. They are just excused from fasting and praying. Men can kiss their wives, and embrace them, sleep with them, everything as normal, except no intercourse. Women who have their periods can attend the Eid Prayers.

In AD 570 women did not have the sanitary products we have now and menstration was a much messier event. However Muslim women are not segregated from their families during menstration like Orthodox Judaism requires. In meeting with Jewish women they were shocked to hear how "normal" life is for us Muslim women during menses.

Karima

I'm curious about something. I'm wondering how you ladies feel about the implication that you are somehow "unclean" during your period. I know that personally I would have a hard time accepting that, given that it is such a natural and God-given gift. I don't mean to offend, I'm just trying to understand.

mmmmkkkkay. so i don't come to vj much but I'm really confuszled about this one. I suppose all my sister and brother in laws are very open minded muslims. I saw my sister in laws giving their husbands money and I saw my brother in laws giving their wives money. What does your husband plan on doing once here? Will he have thousands of dollars he can bring with him so you don't have to support him? That is what the whole reason you have to send your income information to the embassy with him. They want to be sure you can support him. That is probably what 99% of us have had to do with our fiances and spouses once they have come to the U.S since many were not able to work immediatly and many could not get the same career job here as they held there in Egypt.

Depending on their economic circumstances (which vary in Egypt much as anywhere else in the world) wives may with their husbands approval (and GRATITUDE!) contribute to the household budget, I never said otherwise. And men MUST give their wives money to spend on the family, and for themselves. Thus the practice of "nafaka" (pocket money) upon divorce in Egypt.

Frankly I am shocked that a stranger would ask me what my husband plans to do when he arrives in the US, or how much money he is planning to bring with him. I guess I do not understand the purpose of this website. And understand much less how this information is relevant. Suffice it to say that we have agreed he will support me as Islam requires from day 1.

After living in the Muslim/Arab community for more than 25 years I have seen it all. I would have to concur with your statement that 99% of the American women who marry men from overseas do just what you stated and support their husbands. I am not in favor of this arrangement and find that it is contrary to our religion and our husbands' cultural norms. It is much better for the marriage if the man fulfills his religious and social duties towards his wife from the start, including financial support. I realize this is idealistic in the view of those 99%. But I for one will not accept anything less, and Thanks be to God, I do not have to.

I certainly understand why the INS wants to know that the immigrant fiancee/husband will not become a burden on the government, but that does not mean that I have to support him when he arrives. He will be supporting me.

A'salaamu Alaikum,

Some one wrote: "I've never heard of this before. I know we're not required to contribute anything to the household unless we so desire but I have never heard of intentionally hiding what I have. That sounds like deceit and not a way to start a marriage in my opinion but if it's worked for you in the past, go for it."

Now don't go jumping to conclusions.... who said anything about "intentionally hiding"... he has never asked what my assets are, nor what my income is. How is it deceitful to not answer a question that he has never asked! My finacee is far too proud to even show the SLIGHTEST interest in my financial situation.

I'm only here for advice related to Immigration issues. I'm 49 years old and have been married to Egyptian(s) for nearly 25 years. I've learned more than one or two VALUABLE Lessons in that time... but none of them related to Immigration... oh well there's a first time for everything. Can you imagine if marriage licenses here required the couple to exchange credit and asset reports before they issued a marriage license... Come to think of it maybe in this culture it would be a good idea...

Karima

P.S. Not only are Muslim women not "required" to contribute to the household they should take permission to do so, and hopefully she will never need to do that because in my opinion that is not a good way to start a marriage.... The traditional Egyptian man does not thrive well when supported by his wife. (here or there)

A'salaamu Alaikum and thanks for all the information. I'm in shock that you all think I should divulge my personal finances with my fiancee. I have no idea why any one would think this, maybe I"ve been in arab/Muslim culture for too long (30 years)... I've been married twice before and NEVER did I reveal my assets to my husband. In Islam (and Egyptian culture) women are not required to support their husbands or share their personal assets. Ask any Egyptian or Muslim woman and they will tell you to NEVER reveal what you have to a man.

When I went to the INS to have them look over my I129 package I asked the lady there if there was a way to avoid sending the I 134 to my fiancee and send it directly to the Embassy in Cairo, she said she wasn't sure, but she agreed TOTALLY that it was NONE OF HIS BUSINESS what I had or how much I made. She also advised me to simply put my tax return with the document (I'm self-employed) and forget about listing all my other assets because I make MORE than enough to satisfy their requirements. (Also who can read 30 pages of tax forms anyway!)

I'm very fortunate I can see (Alhamdulillah) to be able to travel to Egypt often since I can see it is going to take a while to bring him here, insha'allah. Guess I'll go in October and in January!

Thanks again for the advice, ma'sha'allah this is a difficult process.

Karima

A'salaamu Alaikum and Hello,

I have finally filed my 129-F package and want to have my fiancee start preparing the documents he will need to submit to the Consulate in Cairo. I have read that different Consulates ask for different items. True?

What does he need to be preparing in advance? I've told him to get his birth certificate translated into English, and I'll send back the divorce papers we had translated for the I-129 package, but what else will he need? I've seen something about police records, but I assume the packet he will receive from the consulate will describe what they want from the police and the medical exam... (correct?)

Has anyone on this group sent the I-134 directly to the Consulate in Cairo rather than to their fiancee? I object to sending it to my fiancee (a woman's assets do not need to be divulged to her future husband!).

Any other suggestions? We only have his most recent divorce decree. He was married once before to the same woman so there is a previous divorce, so I'm not sure if he really needs that one or not. Does he need marriage certificates?

I know I'm asking alot, but does anyone have an estimated time that it takes Cairo to process things from their end? I'm planning to go to Egypt in Ramadan (Oct) but if there is any chance we might get his visa by the beginning of 08 then I might wait and go after the New Year so we could come back together.

In closing does anyone know what's going on with the US Embassy refusing to provide the paperwork for US Citizens who chose to marry inside Egypt? I really feel sorry for the sisters who want to marry and plan to stay in Egypt. Looks like they have to come home and bring their fiancees' here to marry them! Sub'han'allah. What a mess.

Thanks and Jezakallahkhair for any information.

Karima

I was just reading in this site that the I should not send the I-134 with my I-129F application. That it should be sent to my fiancee to take with him to the interview. I just can't believe I have to divulge so much personal financial information to someone who is not yet my husband. Can't a girl have any secrets? I've never told any man I've been married to just exactly WHAT I have and how MUCH. Why start now...

Does anyone have any experience with sending the I-134 along with the I-129F? My fiancee will be having his interview in Cairo Egypt. Does anyone know if that embassy asks for the him to bring it with him or if they will get it along with the package from Nebraska? I'd really rather send it to the directly.

It's bad enough I have to tell Big Brother/Uncle Sam every thing I have...

Thanks!