Cait&Ismet

We just got our approval yesterday!  

I hope everyone gets their NOA2 in the next couple weeks!! 

All I can say is that my heart breaks for you two and I am very sorry that they are making it extra difficult for you. I wish you all the best.

Thank for the kind words and support. Fingers crossed some luck comes our way!

I feel for you, it must be awful to wait so long, get to that stage and then get denied.

I'd have thought that if there was an issue that made them suspicious about whether it was genuine or not, they'd have focused questions around that specific area to probe it - from the questions you included, I can't see how such a decision should be made, and they didn't seem to be probing a specific issue. To me there seems to be a few things from what you've stated that would count in your favour

1) you originally met in person, while you were studying there. If he was trying to use you for the passport its much easier to troll for potential partners on the internet than happen to meet someone in person. I'd have thought therefore that relationships where the parties originally met in person are much less likely to involve fraud (before anyone gets offended, I'm not suggesting internet relationships are bad, just that they would be the easiest choice for someone whose primary purpose is immigration). Just my guess, but I have no figures on that.

2) You said you've visited several times since. Again, someone primarily motivated by immigration isn't going to wait around for you to make several visits

3) you said you met several years ago - as above, if he's just after a passport and its not genuine, he's playing a long game.

As such, I'd be as mystified as you - it seems very cruel to deny you in those circumstances without really probing whatever they are suspicious about, presenting you with their thoughts and giving you the opportunity to rebut them.

Thank you for playing devil’s advocate and thinking our case through. Your thoughtful response and support means so much! It is such a strange situation. I agree with all the points you made. From what I’m gathering, they are going to let our k1-visa petition expire. Administrative processing will probably go on forever. I’m going to give it a few weeks and if we don’t hear anything we are going to take the CR1 route. I’m so confused by all of this. Thanks again for your insight!

As soon as you know you will not be granted a 2. interview through the senator OR your case has already left the embassy

you can marry and file. There is no waiting period and you don't have to withdraw the K1.

Thanks for the guidance!

When my attorney emailed the consulate they made it clear that they are sending it back to USCIS. I will give the senator 1-2 weeks to get back to me. I got the generic “we appreciate your email…” response. I have a feeling that they may help provide more detail on the case but they will let the case expire.

We front loaded our application last time, but this time around this is what I am thinking of providing. What do you think? Is there anything I am missing?

Old and new photos (including date stamps and skype screenshots with family), videos, travel receipts, visa stamps, boarding pass, hotel receipts, marriage cert, Skype logs, Viber logs, notarized letter of support from family and friends, proof of family interaction, emails between close family members, ring receipt, wedding dress receipt.

I also plan to visit him for 3 weeks in September and 2-3 times in between our marriage in Kosovo and his interview at the embassy. This time I will be attending the interview with him.

To those of you stating her was denied based solely on difference in religion, I do not agree. My husband and I are different religions, I'm Catholic he is Muslim, I am 21 years older divorced with children, he is from a so called T country...we had A LOT of red flags and our process was smooth, not even an RFE at any stage and he is soon to be a citzen There are literally hundreds of couples who come through VJ every year with different religions that are approved with ZERO issues. There is must be another or other reasons for the denial.

We are deeply in love and so devastated by all of this. To deny someone based on race, religion, and/or education is just discrimination. How do we overcome these difference when we apply for the marriage visa? I don’t know what additional proof we can show to prove we have a bona fide relationship if these are the reasons we were denied. We feel so helpless

Mimolicious – btw I love the home you and your husband recently purchased. That is the kind of style home I would like to get once Ismet and I finally get the opportunity start building our life together.

Not saying that religion is the only issue (I don't have any thoughts about this at all tbh), but in your case you guys were at least married. I bet they're a bit more critical when it comes to K-1s.

That is exactly what I was thinking as well. Do you think we will run into the same issues with CR1?

All of these things that can be considered “red flags” are out of our control and have NOTHING to do with our deep love for each other. We just feel so helpless and hurt.

The education difference could be something. I recently read a thread here where a Mexican beneficiary was denied because of the difference in education level. He was a manual worker who had not been to college and the USC petitioner was a graduate but I can't remember what her job was.

That is just so awful. Do you remember if their visa was a K1 or CR1?

Most of the K1s have never been to the US because applicants typically can't visit here without a visitor's visa, and they aren't eligible due to socioeconomics or because they have a significant other here and its assumed they have immigrant intent.

To the OP- you mentioned a translator. Perhaps the IO thought its not a real relationship if he can't speak sufficient English for the interview. It may make them wonder how he can communicate with you on the phone.

I don't think 9 years is a big difference. I'm assuming he's older than you? I also don't see the religion as a big problem because if he lived in Italy for 12 years, presumably he isn't very connected to a Muslim community.

Perhaps they saw a red flag with a laborer and someone with a good job, education, and financial means to study abroad 2 semesters? Not saying its fair, but thinking out loud as potential red flags.

I'm very sorry about your denial, and I suggest you marry and then do a CR1. That may show them you're more serious.

Thanks for sharing. I didn’t think of it from this perspective.

He does speak English. That is the language we have speaking to each other in for 5 years. His English is decent but before you enter the interview you can have a translator and he requested one just in case if the officer decided to ask much more difficult questions. If he would have known they were going to be that simple he probably wouldn’t have had one. But you bring up a good point maybe the translator did mess something up? There are so many unknowns.

My fiancé did some schooling for construction but does not have a bachelor’s degree. I have a bachelor’s degree and I decent 9-5 corporate America kind of job. But like so many others in my age group I have tons of student debt. So it’s not very glamorous I would much rather be traveling the world and living a simple life. I’m thankful for my education and experience. But if anything it is the biggest reason I can’t pick up and move to Europe to live with my fiancé. All of this debt really gives me no other choice. Otherwise, I would have been there by now.

I do understand the socioeconomic point you are making. But most of my family (almost all) work in some type of trade. I am the first to go to college in my family. I know things are different in the US but most trade workers I know live very comfortably. Again, I’m not arguing with you by any means. I appreciate your thoughts. It just kills me that this is the kind of stuff that may have contributed to our denial and I have to get it off my chest.

Thank you for your all your support. We both very much appreciate it!

My fiance and I are going through something similar. The CO didn't look at any evidence he brought of our relationship but then requested it through email the day after the interview. We went into AP from 7 weeks and were then denied. The Moscow Embassy says they've sent our case back to USCIS however NVC and USCIS both say they haven't received anything. The only thing we have to go off of is the letter he received when they sent his passport back stating "contains inaccurate information." My Congressman's office said they would ask for the denial reason and the only thing they got back was the same explantion given in the letter to my fiance (so still no clarification). The senator's office stated they can't help us since the Congressman's office is "helping" us already. We feel completely overwhelmed because we can't get a clarification on why we were denied. We will be sending in an FOIA and from advice given through VJ it sounds like we'll have to do a CR-1 and hope we get approved since we don't know the initial reason we were denied.

I am so sorry you are going through the same situation. I never felt so heartbroken. I really hope your situation turns around. Good luck with the FOIA. I will let your know if I ever hear anything from my senator or FOIA request. Most people tell me you don’t get much, but we are not going down without a fight. You can't just deny people and treat them like dirt and not explain why. I will keep you in my prayers. I think we will start the marriage visa process too. I truly believe we both will get through this! Please stay in touch!

You more than likely will never know what exactly the CO thought.

The blanket statement of " not believing it is a genuine relationship" happens often without further details.

The same happened to us. I went to the CO and asked her why and she said "because I feel yours would not be

a lasting marriage." I asked again why do you think so and she just shrugged he shoulders "just a feeling".

Totally bizarre and a stupid assumption.

We were denied after 16 months in AP and I filed another petition that was approved by a different CO who said he could see

how much we love each other just from our photos.

The CR1's are different than the K1's, in that if returned, a K1 dies the death of expiration but a returned CR1 has another

chance to be reviewed and CO's findings will be responded to with a rebuttal once USCIS has the case back.

They are almost always re affirmed. K1's are no longer re affirmed.

My advice is marry and file a I-130 for a CR1.

One last tiny chance is to request a second interview which may not be granted as they already brushed off your attorney.

Sorry this happened to you, I know how it feels.

Best wishes next time around.

No. That is not it.

Reading your story makes me tear up. I’m so sorry you had to experience this. I don’t understand how they can treat couples like this. It is incredibly offensive and rude.

My only hope for a second interview is depending on the senator’s involvement.

Do we have to wait to get married and start the CR1 process? Can we get married next month and start asap?

Your different religions could have played a role due to the Kosovo war in 1998-1999.

Did you send proof of your time together in Italy? You're sure those were all the questions asked? What about your fiancé's background, any arrests/convictions, previous attempts to immigrate to the US etc that he might have forgotten about or not disclosed?

Mallafri76 - what do you think?

The only other thing I can think of is my fiancé's brother and father served in the Kosovo Army during the Kosovo war. Ismet did not, but do you think that can be a reason they would deny us?

We never got an answer on denial of 129 and Senator could not get any more information than they were giving me

K1 will come back to US and be allowed to die here

marry and proceed with CR1

That is my concern, but I thought it was worth a try. My biggest fear is that they will deny us again. We are so confused why we received this denial and how they handled the case. What do you think? Did you have any problems with the CR1 after the K1 visa denial?

Age difference? How did you meet? He says you lived together in Florence. That seems odd if you just met there. He also says you visited him in Florence. Was that after you left or something? He doesn't seem to know your degree. He got it wrong then they asked again and he gave a non-answer (he said "same thing she studied in the US" instead of naming the thing).

Or, something could have been in your chats, like they seem one-sided.

We are 9 years apart. I studied in Florence, Italy for 2 semesters. We met while I was studying. I had my own apartment, but I stayed with him 95% of time. That is what he meant by that. Maybe it is the way he answered my degree.

I sent a 2 year call log for Viber. There were some chats, but mostly showing our phone conversation. He speaks Albanian, Italian, and Engligh. I speak English and a little bit of Italian. Our chats frequently consisted of a mix of English and Italian. I don't think it looks like I was always the one contacting him or vice versa. But good point.

Your different religions could have played a role due to the Kosovo war in 1998-1999.

Did you send proof of your time together in Italy? You're sure those were all the questions asked? What about your fiancé's background, any arrests/convictions, previous attempts to immigrate to the US etc that he might have forgotten about or not disclosed?

We did show proof of our time in Italy - photos and travel documents. My fiance did not attempt to immigrate to the US in the past. He has clean record from Kosovo and Italy. He got police certificates from both countries stating that he has a clean record with no arrests/convictions.

We really don't get it.

Does anyone have suggestions for next steps?

We were planning on getting married in September. Since the K-1 visa doesn't look like its going to work out I was planning on flying to Kosovo to see him and get married in the next couple weeks.

I have sent a letter to the Senator. Do I need to wait to hear from them before we get married overseas?

Also, I'm afraid that the same thing will happen when we apply for a marriage visa.

Is there something in your fiance's background he's forgotten about, previous petition, etc? What were the IO's questions and/or statements to your fiance during interview? Go over the entire interview with your fiance in full detail.

Yes, I have heard other stories like this. Usually it is found out that there is something the USC didn't know or the consulate believes the relationship is for immigration purposely only. Do your families know each other? How did you meet? Was it through family?

Here is the summary of his interview:

He entered the room and he raised his right hand and said stated the "I promise to the truth" line.

1. Where did you both meet? Florence, Italy

2. What did you do in Florence? Lived in Florence and did construction work when I met Caitlin

3. How long were you in Florence? 12 years

4. What did she study? Economics ( I studied Business Administration and Finance, but I think it is close enough)

5. Where did she live in Florence? Can you tell me exactly where she lived? I don’t know the street she lived near Santa Croce.

6. Where did you live in Florence? Via Scipione

7. How did you travel in Florence? We lived so close. It was a 5 minute to walk from our apartments. She had an apartment but she lived with me most of the time.

8. What is the name of her school? Elizabethtown

9. What did she study in Florence? The same as what she studied in US.

10. How many times did she visit you? 3 times (Twice in Florence and once in Kosovo)

11. When was the last time you both saw each other? October

12. Where you ever in the US? No

13. Where do you live now? Kosovo

14. Where does she live? Wayne, PA

15. Where does she work? Vanguard

16. What does she do? She helps with people with their finances and retirement. Now she is an Administrator and works on a different projects.

17. How do you both communicate? Viber and Skype

After the questions were answered, the officer said “I’m not convinced that this relationship is true.” Ismet asked why and he responded that “I have nothing else to say. I will send the documents back to USCIS.” Then he left the room.

They took all of his supporting documents that he brought to the consulate. They took Ismet’s phone number. The translator told him “We will send the documents to USCIS and this office will make the decision if you get the visa.”

It just does not make sense to me!

I'm sorry this happened to you and is sooo unfortunate I can see why you are frustrated you didn't even get a bit of an explanation as to WHY.

Unfortunately I've seen so many cases with the petitioner being of different religion then the Muslim beneficiary and has gotten denied. NOT ALL of course I've seen so many approved. That's the only thing I can think of why they denied you...... Which is stupid I know, but it just makes no sense you guys had all the proof of having a real long relationship. I'm sorry.

It just is so unfair. How can you stop 2 people from being in love and starting a life because they are from a different religion. Its awful!

Cases can be denied for obscure reasons, or reasons that you as the USC may not know.

Are there any red flags in your case, such as you being relatives, different religion, recent divorce or previous immigration attempts?

We are not relatives. We were not married before. He has not previously tried to immigrate to the US. We are not very religious people, but I am catholic and he is muslim.

Get your fiance to send you a copy of the 221G Something just doesn't sound right.

He emailed a copy of the 221G to me and our lawyer hours after the interview. All it said was "return to USCIS via NVC for review"

It doesn't make sense

The senator's office will be able to get a clearer response as to why it was denied. Unfortunately, since K1 petitions have an expiration, your file will be sent to USCIS to expire. You will probably need to file a new I-129F or marry your fiancee and then file a I-130 for the CR1 visa.

Did you front load your petition? As in, send all the evidence in your initial I-129F filing?

We did front load our petition. We learning towards the CR1 visa, but first I really want to better understand why they denied us the visa.

Me and my fiancé (he is from Kosovo) have a strong case we knew each other for 5 years, we provided 2 years worth of call logs, 5 years worth or travel documents, 30 photos (including pictures with his family). We were so excited to finally start our life together.

He had his interview at Skopje Embassy in Macedonia on Tuesday (8/9) it lasted maybe 5 minutes. They didn’t look at any of our paperwork and said to my fiancée “I’m not convinced this is a real relationship.” They gave him a 221(g) refusal. They did not request for any more evidence to show our relationship is bona fide.

My immigration attorney who has been supporting us throughout this process contacted the Consulate less than 24 hours after the interview requesting to reconsider the case and stated that we can provide more evidence. They politely brushed him off and said they are sending it back to the USCIS. Did not even acknowledge the additional evidence to support our bona fide relationship. The lawyer was shocked.

We really have a strong case and true loving relationship. Me, my fiancé, and my lawyer do not understand this denial.

I contacted my US Senator explaining the situation and requested support to review the case further (still waiting for a response). My lawyer and I are also planning on submitting a Freedom of Information Act Request.

My questions are:

1.Has anyone encountered this before? It does not make any sense.

2. Are there other ways to figure out why we were denied the visa?

3.What should I do next?

Any help or guidance is appreciated. This process has been beyond heartbreaking for us.