ya falaha!

I didn't know you had half Algerian babies. You should wear them as a badge of honor like HIT does. It's really siggy worthy...I have half Algerian, Arab babies so I'm better than you. Same dad, too? Damn HIT is gonna be way jealous now.

I haven't read all of this but lordy it's sickening hearing u repeat "my daughter is arab....my daughter is moroccan." I'm american with 2 kids from the same dad who is algerian. They know it, EVERYONE knows it. But THEY are .....gasp.....american!!!!! and proud of it. For the love of god. what is ur point in always bringing this up???? if ur kids weree born here ther are americans!!!!!

Many people have been wondering the same thing.

####### does that mean? So my husband is a bully because *I* used the term "trailer trash"? Honey, step off. My husband is a saint compared to those pieces of human waste that you were married to. Both of them. You were used and abused. You have NO business giving ppl advice on marriage. How dare you? Keep my husband out of this.

Dayum!!

M4M...you have the best pics!!

First, who really gives a ** what an ignorant jealous azz said on that board?! Many foreigners think our streets are paved in gold here and almost all Americans are rich, which is not the case. Should we run around trying to correct every ding dong that posts this as truth? Many of my Arab friends here and overseas joke about "farmers" "fallah/fallaheen" in their countries...its NOT racist Kat, its a joke that may have strong stereotypical connotations but that’s where it ends. Every culture has their own "redneck" "hillbilly" "trash" term. So what?!?

Now onto your continual use of "racist"; it annoys me to no end when people like to throw that damn phrase around and have no clue ####### they are talking about. You are so good at googling your other points....why not try googling Redneck or Trailer trash etc?!?!? In the majority of searches you will NOT find the term racist NOR discriminatory. It is in your head Kat dear...like many of your other delusional statements you’ve made along the way. People consider the term hillbilly, trailer trash, redneck, etc to be a descriptive term sometimes negative NOT racist and many that are lumped into these groups use the term within their own social circles as well! Lumping all such people together in a single group is similar to using the term Cajun as a description of a uniquely American group.

There is no direction to this thread. You keep saying the same sh!t over and over. Everyone gave their own opinions opposite of yours and you keep debating it hoping for some thread of hope that there is another delusional person out there that shares your opinions. No one is going to side with your skewed view on love and relationships. Honestly, as most have said here move on girl....move on.

I honestly think you need to stay away from these boards for a long while. Your constant swirl is very disturbing like the rants of a bipolar (mentally ill) person and at times makes many of us think either you've stopped your meds or stopped your therapy. If you have a therapist...call them ASAP...I'm not being sarcastic or mean I'm truly concerned about what floats around in your head that you've now accepted as your reality.

Yes!!!

Aya, I wouldn't bother bringing the chat logs at all. They probably won't even look at them like others have said. Honestly, I don't get why ppl insist on bringing chat logs at all. A few e-mails showing dates during your relationship should be fine. It's more the dates of the communication that they're after than the contents of the communication.

M4E, you're being too realistic and not analyzing the situation enough dammit. Can you fall in love with someone you find physically unattractive? I know I can't. I'm far too superficial for that. Does he have to be a 21 yr old super stud? Hell no, those types gross me out. Plus, *I* want to be the pretty one in the relationship.

I will state my point simply...it's not ALWAYS the men who are to blame. That is my point. Sometimes marriages do not work out. Why must it always be fraud? I understand that you like to write novels and really pick apart what ppl say but seriously it's not ALWAYS fraud and it's not ALWAYS the man's fault. AND if the man is a scoundrel, SOMETIMES the woman is at fault for being gullible enough to fall for it. However, SOMETIMES the woman is innocent and the guy is that good. That being said, there have been many, many MENA members who have outrageous stories and glaring red flags (you included) and ignored them. So what I'm saying with this is, in those cases, the women are also at fault for being used. They CHOSE to ignore the signs in the sake of perceived "love".

Does it take an educated person to make horrible mistakes in choosing men? Do educated women generally choose the scum of the Arab world to marry and fornicate with? Do educated women generally accept heinous and cruel treatment of themselves? Do educated women live in a fantasy world of being loved when instead they're being cheated on, spit on, used and emotionally abused? I'm just trying to see how education works in all of this since apparently uneducated ppl can't see past class. I'd rather be judgemental about class and how a person presents him or herself or behaves than be a victim of such behavior I mentioned above.

Trailer trash is not a racial slur. Just because someone lives in a trailer doesn't mean they are trash. It's a two-fer. Trash that lives in trailers. You know the kind I speak of. Multiple baby daddies, ####### azz clothes, no manners, f-ed up hair-dos, dirty, loud, just low class all around. Tell me there aren't MENA men who haven't married these types not realizing what they got themselves into.

where did ya_falaha said anything about American women??? where did she call you, personally, a hillbilly? #######, you are really, really pushing it.

You seriously need to move on. Pronto.

Len,

I never said that she called all women trailer trash. I dont like that expression just like someone mexican would resent someone calling someone a wetback or other derogatory term. I think trailer trash is an offensive term just because it demonises someone for where they live.

And I have to move on how? This is a mena board and I am not insulting anyone. Visit please but please do not try to run the boards. We are having a discussion and you are very welcome to be here...

Whats love got to do with it?

I guess because I was raised with 2 PhD parents, I have never judged anyone by what they wore or where they lived and if they did not have manners, I looked for other things that they could offer and were good at. I think there is alot of classcism in America. We all have worth and it takes an educated person to look past someones exterior and see who they are inside..

Even if the guy found out he was with a hillbilly, he could still treat her with respect. The foreigners have alot we have to deal with too and get over. Its not just them dealing with us..

Lets go back to what you originally implied. You talked about how some of the guys were unfortunate to marry harpies or trailer trash as you described.

Moody,

You did not say a thing about judging mena people or their class. You talked about trailer trash. You said you didnt blame them because when they got over here they ended up with trailer trash. What should we call an arab or mena guy who cheats on his wife or beats her or has weird habits or throws cigarettes all over the ground outside? Fellahah sbel? kHanzin? Why do Americans have the patent on bad or ill behavior? What about an American who spends all her money effort and time and has an amazing and kind family only to bring someone over here who is mena trash? If we have trailer trash, then they have to have the same equivalent.

You sound like you are from there trying to justify why some of these guys do what they do. I have very frequently heard after someone used a girl for papers things like, she drank too much, she did drugs, she was trailer trash, things like that. In order to victimise someone, you need to dehumanise them. You essentially by saying these guys end up with trailer trash are buying into their garbage. They can leave and go back home to their home country. Or they can stay on the train and get their papers and then say thats why they left.

I completely understand what you are trying to say. I just dont think we have the patent on trailer trash. I think they have a hell of alot of their own...I just dont know what to call them.

Its not easy for either side. I just think that love is the deciding factor. And yes, some trailer trash as you call them and mena people actually find common ground and make things work and some people just use that as was to dehumanise who they married to make it look better when they do the inevitable.

Does it take an educated person to make horrible mistakes in choosing men? Do educated women generally choose the scum of the Arab world to marry and fornicate with? Do educated women generally accept heinous and cruel treatment of themselves? Do educated women live in a fantasy world of being loved when instead they're being cheated on, spit on, used and emotionally abused? I'm just trying to see how education works in all of this since apparently uneducated ppl can't see past class. I'd rather be judgemental about class and how a person presents him or herself or behaves than be a victim of such behavior I mentioned above.

Trailer trash is not a racial slur. Just because someone lives in a trailer doesn't mean they are trash. It's a two-fer. Trash that lives in trailers. You know the kind I speak of. Multiple baby daddies, ####### azz clothes, no manners, f-ed up hair-dos, dirty, loud, just low class all around. Tell me there aren't MENA men who haven't married these types not realizing what they got themselves into.

where did ya_falaha said anything about American women??? where did she call you, personally, a hillbilly? #######, you are really, really pushing it.

You seriously need to move on. Pronto.

Len,

I never said that she called all women trailer trash. I dont like that expression just like someone mexican would resent someone calling someone a wetback or other derogatory term. I think trailer trash is an offensive term just because it demonises someone for where they live.

And I have to move on how? This is a mena board and I am not insulting anyone. Visit please but please do not try to run the boards. We are having a discussion and you are very welcome to be here...

Whats love got to do with it?

I guess because I was raised with 2 PhD parents, I have never judged anyone by what they wore or where they lived and if they did not have manners, I looked for other things that they could offer and were good at. I think there is alot of classcism in America. We all have worth and it takes an educated person to look past someones exterior and see who they are inside..

Even if the guy found out he was with a hillbilly, he could still treat her with respect. The foreigners have alot we have to deal with too and get over. Its not just them dealing with us..

So what you're saying here is love is supposed to be blind? Men should look past anything because of love. You and I both know many of these men don't have a true concept of what love is when they meet and marry a woman. At first it's infatuation and lust then it either becomes love or it fizzles. If there is no compatibility then real love can't develop. How can it? Also, you have to see what's good for you. You can love someone deeply but they are no good for you. Look at what has happened to many of the women on this board. Same with the men. They can love their wife but in the long run the situation isn't good for them or their family so they must part ways. Love does not conquer all. Love only goes so far. Maybe I'm jaded but that's how I see it. I couldn't stay with someone simply because I "love" them. There has to be more.

No dip. Nowhere did I state only beautiful ppl are lovable. I said old, heavy, unattractive women are not compatible with young, attractive men. People should find a compatible mate. If you're average don't go for a supermodel type. That's what I'm saying here. We have women here who are dumbfounded because their marriage didn't work out and of course cry fraud because they have no other explanation as to why things didn't work. Not just age...I'm talking many other factors. If you're gonna pretend you're someone's mama don't be surprised if they behave like a child. Don't baby a man and buy him gifts and give him an allowance and then expect him to come here and pay your bills. You're sending a mixed message. I'm dumbfounded that ppl are shocked when their marriage breaks up when the writing has been on the wall all the while.

Have you seen any of the pics of some of the wives of the MENA men? They ARE trailer trash. Come on let's be honest here. And not just trash because they live in a trailer. Trash because of the way they act and present themselves. You mean to tell me a handsome man is going to go for an unattractive, low class, poorly dressed, poorly mannered woman? I blame the men for conniving these women but I also blame the women for falling for these men. Some ppl need to take a good look in the mirror and realize they cannot be attractive to a young, handsome man. If a young, handsome man will not look at you in the US, what makes you think a young, handsome man is going to want you from another country? That doesn't mean some scrawny looking scoundrel couldn't also scam someone. What I'm saying here is that there's a thing called compatibility which many of the MENA couples do not have. No compatibility in looks, size, age, interests, mannerisms, education, finances, etc. Why can't ppl know their role? Sure an unattractive, heavy, older woman can be perfectly lovely and wonderful but she has no business going after a handsome 25 yr old stud. That's just asking for trouble.

Being thin does not protect you. Being beautiful does not make you more lovable. My daughter's father used a beautiful, nice bodied, beautiful faced non trailer living 23 year old to get here. He dumped her right after he removed conditions.

I have seen very beautiful women get used and some fat ones still in relationships.

It all goes back to WHATS LOVE GOT TO DO WITH IT?

The question remains.. Whats love got to do with it?

Sometimes the outside parties have a bigger problem with the couple than the people involved.

Maybe the guy is in to BBW or mature women.... maybe he loves her.

Whats love got to do with this? Thats my question.

Trailer trash is not a racial slur. Just because someone lives in a trailer doesn't mean they are trash. It's a two-fer. Trash that lives in trailers. You know the kind I speak of. Multiple baby daddies, ####### azz clothes, no manners, f-ed up hair-dos, dirty, loud, just low class all around. Tell me there aren't MENA men who haven't married these types not realizing what they got themselves into.

where did ya_falaha said anything about American women??? where did she call you, personally, a hillbilly? #######, you are really, really pushing it.

You seriously need to move on. Pronto.

Len,

I never said that she called all women trailer trash. I dont like that expression just like someone mexican would resent someone calling someone a wetback or other derogatory term. I think trailer trash is an offensive term just because it demonises someone for where they live.

And I have to move on how? This is a mena board and I am not insulting anyone. Visit please but please do not try to run the boards. We are having a discussion and you are very welcome to be here...

Whats love got to do with it?

Where did love fit in your fairy tale?

Can't marriages just fail because ppl are no longer compatible? That's how my first marriage ended. He was MENA. I met and married him in the states. He didn't need me to stay here. We had two children and were married 10 yrs. He was a citizen for nearly 5 yrs by the time we divorced. I wanted the divorce, he did not. Why must it always be some sort of conspiracy just because there's an Arab involved? And, sometimes the women are the beasts, not the men. Because the man is Arab that means there's something up? What about if the guy gets here and finds out he's married to an awful harpy? Or maybe she's a total trailer trash hillbilly but he didn't know it because he wasn't familiar with the cultural here? Why must the man always be at fault in this?

First

Please do not perpetuate nasty things about American women. If I had a dime for every time I heard an American woman being described as trailer trash by a mena man, I would be rich. There is nothing wrong with being a hillbilly . Hillbilly women make amazing wives and usually know someone that can fix your car, bake bread for you and bail you out of jail. Trailers are places for people to live and although I dont live in one, I know people who do and they should not be run down because of what they can afford. Trailer trash is a derogative statement used by people who catagorise all people as one thing or look down at where they live and its as bad as bashing someone because they are from mena.

How important is LOVE in these relationships? If you really loved a woman that was petitioning for you, you wouldnt leave her because she was less educated or lived in a trailer because you would have known that about her before you got here. Hence the importance of true love. If you really love someone, you bend and move

I just want to know what love played.

If you want to contribute, please do. What role did love play in you leaving your spouse you had of 10 years who happened to be mena? Was it for greener pastures or did you fall out of love or none of the above?You met him here so you did not go through the stressors of the wait and the petitioning process but you did have the cultural things going on.. go ahead and share

I have never lived in a trailer nor am I a hillbilly but I resent like hell anyone being catagorised like that because I know some amazing people who are both.

Have you seen any of the pics of some of the wives of the MENA men? They ARE trailer trash. Come on let's be honest here. And not just trash because they live in a trailer. Trash because of the way they act and present themselves. You mean to tell me a handsome man is going to go for an unattractive, low class, poorly dressed, poorly mannered woman? I blame the men for conniving these women but I also blame the women for falling for these men. Some ppl need to take a good look in the mirror and realize they cannot be attractive to a young, handsome man. If a young, handsome man will not look at you in the US, what makes you think a young, handsome man is going to want you from another country? That doesn't mean some scrawny looking scoundrel couldn't also scam someone. What I'm saying here is that there's a thing called compatibility which many of the MENA couples do not have. No compatibility in looks, size, age, interests, mannerisms, education, finances, etc. Why can't ppl know their role? Sure an unattractive, heavy, older woman can be perfectly lovely and wonderful but she has no business going after a handsome 25 yr old stud. That's just asking for trouble.

So you know someone who accepted another wife....does that mean it's "normal"?

So the guy agrees to not have kids because the wife can't then decides later that he may want one and his mom really wants a grandbaby and love goes out the window. He does what is "right" for himself and his family. So yeah he could love the wife but still divorce her and marry another for the greater good or at least what he feels is the greater good.

What's love got to do with it?

I agree that love can develop even if there was fraud in mind at the beginning. I also agree about the family pressure thing. I believe we had one member who experienced this. I think it was patiently_waiting. She had a baby and the family pressured her husband to leave her if I'm not mistaken. I can totally see how that could happen. Esp. in cases where the wife can't have children either because of age or any other inability to conceive.

I don't know, I think it's possible that there was love in some of these "green card relationships". Maybe not initially, but sometimes love develops over time. I think family/cultural pressures often come into play that I can't fully understand.

I guess this is where the whole 1st and 2nd wife would come in. The first wife could legally divorce him and then he could marry wife number two. I have not seen too many arab women who would put up with this but I did know one American woman about 5 years ago that legally divorced her husband, they moved a moroccan girl in and they all lived together in one house, the 2 wives, the guy and I don't know what happened after that.

Now if she did the laundry and cooked. Would you divorce your spouse and become a first wife if you could no longer have kids and he did not want to lose you but he wanted kids?

What role does love have in putting up with those factors and that kind of relationship

Maybe I am off track but I think you have to love someone an awful lot to love them and then let them marry someone else...

Can't marriages just fail because ppl are no longer compatible? That's how my first marriage ended. He was MENA. I met and married him in the states. He didn't need me to stay here. We had two children and were married 10 yrs. He was a citizen for nearly 5 yrs by the time we divorced. I wanted the divorce, he did not. Why must it always be some sort of conspiracy just because there's an Arab involved? And, sometimes the women are the beasts, not the men. Because the man is Arab that means there's something up? What about if the guy gets here and finds out he's married to an awful harpy? Or maybe she's a total trailer trash hillbilly but he didn't know it because he wasn't familiar with the cultural here? Why must the man always be at fault in this?

I have to find one. I'm undecided right now. Any suggestions? Should I corn it up with a holiday theme?

He's a doll, Jenn! He almost looks like an entirely different baby now. I love the chunkeroo cheeks and legs.

I agree that love can develop even if there was fraud in mind at the beginning. I also agree about the family pressure thing. I believe we had one member who experienced this. I think it was patiently_waiting. She had a baby and the family pressured her husband to leave her if I'm not mistaken. I can totally see how that could happen. Esp. in cases where the wife can't have children either because of age or any other inability to conceive.

I don't know, I think it's possible that there was love in some of these "green card relationships". Maybe not initially, but sometimes love develops over time. I think family/cultural pressures often come into play that I can't fully understand.

You're doing the right thing, Diane. You're incredibly brave and SMART! So many women would've looked the other way and let their man continue to treat them badly.

Love is swell and I guess necessary to a point but love isn't everything. And like the fine lady in my youtube says....love don't pay the rent. It takes a lot more than love to make a marriage work.

Nice job! You did a lot of work in a short time...very impressive!

That's pretty fantastic. Very generous of your husband. Um does he have a brother?

We're having really bad wind gusts up here in MI, too. It's bitter cold and it's starting to snow. I'm so not ready for all of this. BTW, I love the new pics of Malek. He's looking like a big boy.

Happy Wednesday everybody! It seems like I am able to check in about once a week nowadays. I hope everybody is well and that the visa process is moving for those still waiting. Everything is good here, just working really hard and doing the mommy and wifey stuff. I don't have a lot of computer time except for working but I like to still check in from time to time.

Amanda--I'm so glad to hear that your husband has gotten a job. That is really great news!

We have a wind advisory here in my part of Ohio. We have had about 50 mph winds and it is very cold...right around the high 20's with a little snow off and on. I work with some counterparts of mine that are here from Wisconsin and they aren't able to fly home tonight. Apparently, Wisconsin got hit pretty hard with a lot of snow and blizzard like conditions. Be careful to all that are in the bad weather areas.

Take care and I hope to be in touch more often.

Happy Birthday, Sara!

Your "fiance's" story stinks to high heaven. I hope you can smell it also. I'm sorry this has happened to you.