Lingbaa

Thanks everyone for your input on our situation. I wasn't scared off or anything like that, just busy working with my fiancee to gather as many additional documents and a whopping 200 photos of us together everywhere in Thailand and Angkor Wat in Cambodia. Also had a major project already going at my house. I also spoke to a local immigration atty for about 30-45 min over the phone Fri and meeting at his office tomorrow. He did give me some confidence in his ability because he spotted the problem that triggered my RFE before I even told him about it and when I told him there was a problem at the interview he finished my statement by telling me, "And got a white 221g form letter with a box checked off asking for things you've already given them right? It's happening every time with my clients cases in China, Vietnam and Thailand."

My Fiancee and I also had some 'spirited discussions' about my decision to post our case here at VJ and the fact that everyone could see our photo. As I said before, her English skills are excellent and she has read every word in this post and was not too happy about one members comments which called her character into question. She also wanted me to correct one point in that CO did not use the word player and I did take poetic license on that one for the title, since it pretty much sums up what he was saying. She was devastated by the treatment she received during the interview and crying alot with me on the phone afterwards, so these comments did not really help. She is also under the impression that the CO has time to scour the internet for hundreds of websites related to Visa filings to find the ones in Thailand and then find the one written by Lingbaa and match that up to the case he had just denied with a 221g... which he does all day long as he goes about the duties of his sworn post, dashing the dreams of couples everywhere with extreme prejudice. I would guess that he also probably handles dozens of such cases a day and really doesn't care what people have to say about them on the internet. She protested that I put our photo on my profile and although I know that it is not searchable, I nevertheless decided to pull the photo down. have seized up

To touch base on a few things:

Yes my fiancee knows about the other K1 from 5 years ago and she knew about it before we ever filed and she knew that I had to add further explanation in the RFE sent to USCIS before they granted the NOA2. She's been fully understanding and supportive, never blaming me for the delay that this caused in our case as I sorted out the RFE. We never really talked about these things too much as she did not want to relive the past and neither did I. I suppose if there is something to be learned from my experience and that is to go overy every name, date and detail of the previous K1 if someone reads about my case in the future and also has a previous filing. I never anticipated that the CO would focus on that one aspect and relentlessly ask for details on a case that did not pertain to her. She said I know he had one and that's all I know for sure.

I wouldn't place too much importance on any one item from that list above as some have read into the part about household registration books. It's a form letter, the only thing changed from one case to the next is the Aplicant name, date, case # and then the X in the open box, in our case it's the top one re: "Evidence of your relationship with the petitioner". Below that (unchecked for us) are 5 other boxes for Police Cert, Medical Exam, I-864/I-134, Consent letter from biological mother or father, and one marked Other with an open field where case-specific comments could be added.

I don't think that the CO ever looked at the wire transfer or took it into account in rendering his decision. If he saw that and felt that this was some form of exploitation or revealed some disingenuous aspect of our relationship, I do not believe for one second that this CO would not have seized upon it during the interview. I've even read in other visa sites that it helps to show that there has been some evidence of financial planning for the future. In our situation, my fiancee is the oldest of two daughters and her parents of course love them very much and worked hard to send them to college to get an education. They are not from Issarn and nor are they from BKK. Her father owns his own business which requires a lot of hard work and a significant investment in capital equipment and overhead, and my fiancee is a partner in this business to a degree since she is an accountant and helps with things like keeping the books and paying vendors and handling payroll and such. I know she has a good salary and at times will bring some money to them when she visits, which she does several times a month. This is totally normal in Thai culture as children see themselves as paying back the kindness that their parents have shown to them and raising them and it's something I am fully supportive of, otherwise I would never consider marrying my fiancee or any Thai person for that matter. Now my fiancee's parents learn that an American loves their daughter and she plans to move to America with him. We discussed the wedding plans and an amount for 250-300 guests and I wanted to assure him that I was financially responsible and would make good on a deposit towards that amount soon. I'm sure that my action gave them more confidence in my sincerity, and my fiancee confirmed that after returning home that weekend. I see myself as a part of their family in the future and spending time with them on our vacations and bringing back grandchildren as we definielty have plans to start a family. My fiancee's parents always make me feel welcome in their home and I know that some day my wife and I will be the ones to support them and make life more comfortable in retirement. I have a good career and this does not worry me. I was happy to see that my fiancee's mother already feels comfortable enough to joke with me, questioning whether the alligator in my new profile photo was able to breathe.

Our latest plan will be to supply a ton of photos since that seems to be what they want to see after reviewing several other successful 221g requests for more info, and also a sworn affidavit from both of her parents detailing the several times that I have visited and we have gone to dinner as a large group and discussed plans for a wedding which is planned for 2013 after our daughter completes her visa and AOS. Furthermore, our future son in law has already placed a deposit for the wedding and here is a record of where it went from our daughter's account into our account on such and such dates. I will be discussing my plans with the atty tomorrow however I feel that this approach is without any holes for them to deny my sincerity in following through on our relationship.

Thanks for listening and a special thanks to one VJer for coming to my fiancee's defense, it was appreciated!

My fiancee had her K1 interview yesterday at the Thailand Embassy and we received a 221(g) refusal white paper:

"This office regrets to inform you that it is unable to issue a visa to you because you have not been found qualified to receive a visa under section 221(g) of the Immigration and Nationality Act or regulation issued pursuant thereto. Further consideration will be given to your visa application after you obtain and present the documents listed below (only the marked sections apply to you)"

X Evidence of your relationship with petitioner (i.e. photographs, letters, e-mails, phone bills, old household registration books etc.)

We were both shocked by the decision and by how short the interview lasted before the CO left and then came back with the 221(g) document and ended the interview. She had come to the interview with a mountain of evidence to prove our relationship and other necessary docs including:

• 26 photos taken during three different trips all over various locations in Thailand, including photos of us at dinner with her Mom, Dad, Sister and several other family members
• A photo of us taken on the night when we were engaged and she is wearing a 1 Ct engagement ring which I used when I proposed to her. This is the same ring she is also wearing at the interview
• Several hotel bills from several different locations throughout Thailand
• Evidence of three different airline itineraries for trips taken to see here three times in the last 13 months
• A stack of Skype phone calls showing that we talk on the phone at least every day for the last 15 months and another stack of MSN chat logs from between 1 and 2.5 years ago
• A wire transfer document from my bank in USA showing that I wired $4,000 USD to her which she then transferred to her father's account for a down payment on our wedding later this year after the AOS is completed (I hope!). This was done after I proposed during our 2nd trip but before my most recent trip.
• All sorts of my financial documents like last three years of tax returns and W2's, Employment verification including salary on company letterhead, final pay statement from 2012. Her pay stubs and letter from her employer in Bangkok showing high performance reviews.
• Thai police record and medical transcript document

She did the interview in English as her language skills are quite good. She works in an office as an accountant and handles transactions by computer and over the phone in English with foreign clients and she has a stable employment record and a decent salary for a Thai person of her age and education (college degree) working in her field. She had documentation of all that too. The CO only glanced at a couple of the photos and did not look at any of the other documents mentioned above before beginning to attack her regarding the legitimacy of our relationship and told her that he did not believe that we had a real relationship. She told him that we initially met almost 3 years ago in 2010 on a Thai dating website but we were not really that interested in each other and things did not really click until 2011 (all completely true) after which we started to chat and then speak on the phone regularly until we first met id Sept 2011.

He told here that "...your fiance has many, many women and he is a player! He doesn't love you and he's not going to marry you. Do you know that he has filed many K1 petitions for women in the past? Why would you think that he is ever going to marry you? I don't believe that you are telling the truth about going to the US to marry this man"

The truth of the matter is that I filed one K1 in the past and it was almost 5 years ago, in 2008. That relationship ended amicably before any visa was issued and in actuality. immediately after the NOA2 was issued in Dec. 2008 she just got cold feet about leaving her family and sent me a letter telling me that I was a great guy and we should stay friends... blah blah blah. I correctly noted this previous I-129 in the appropriate section in in my most recent I-129F filing but since it was more than 2 years ago and there was only one, I thought I was fine under IMBRA Act. I have never been married before and have no dependents. I received an RFE to explain the previous K1 filing and did so in great detail explaining all of the above and showing the cancelled petition statement from her embassy. They reviewed my RFE and issued the NOA2.

My fiancee tells me that the CO seemed to have disdain for her from the start of the interview. I think that she was asked to put a finger up to do a fingerprint scan and she placed two fingers or her index finger and the CO said "You just told me that you can speak English but you can't even understand a simple command?" Well she was nervous, and the CO continued to berate her throughout the short interview of only approximately 5 minutes and as stated, he never looked at any of the documents except a couple of the photos. He did retain all of the documents including the photos and only returned to her personal items such as passport and ID card.

The way she was treat really makes me upset, but I realize that these CO's have absolute authority and there is nothing that you can do except play the game. By the end of the interview she was almost in tears and frankly I don't think she is used to telling someone in a position of authority that, "Look, you're wrong and here's why. Look at this!", and so she never really asked him to consider any of the documents that she had brought.

I've done quite a bit of reading on the 221(g) on this website and other places, and realize that its somehwat considered a 'soft denial' while the K1 is going through Additional Processing. they have asked for more documents to be presented by registered mail, but what more can we give them to prove that we are in a committed relationship and plan to marry? have heard that Thailand is very heavily weighting applicant on photos and if it's photos they want we can provide 50 more. Does it help for me to write some sort of letter stating all of the reasons why I love my fiancee and assure them that I will marry and file AOS within a week after she arrives in US? Is there a way to request another interview or drop off the follow-up documents in person and ask for a Thai interview in the hopes that she will get someone more reasonable and rationale?

I told her that this is probably just a tactic employed by this CO to rattle her and make us lose hop and that submitting more photos and documents will get us past this 221(g) but would really appreciate any guidance from other VJer's familiar with a similar situation of denial due to a previous K1 filing and what other document may help besides the obvious, which I've read is a lot of photos. After all, he didn't even look at the current stack of documents and they still need to be reviewed by somebody.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

My first time posting here although I have greatly benefitted from the wealth of information on these forums and the wisdom of some of the more experiences members. I am an engineer and used to documenting everything in writing and I have done things in the past like settling an estate with no will and 4 different parties involved, however nothing in my life up to this point has prepared me for the current situation I am in, trying to decipher the intricacies of immigration law and wading through the often ambiguous or just plain wrong information provided by USCIS phone representatives.

My question is related to an RFE I received July 20th on my current I-129F filing pertaining to a waiver for violation of the IMBRA act. I had previously filed one I-129F filing back in January 2008 and the petition was approved with no RFEs in Dec. 2008. Due to an amicable ending of the relationship back in early 2009 there were no further filings on this petition, no interview was ever scheduled, etc. The NOA1 stated that it was only good for four months and so i had wrongly assumed that it was in an inactive, canceled or deleted status when I filed again more than three years later. When I completed the current I-129F I believed that I was not in violation of any provisions of the IMBRA act of not more than one previous filing and more than 2 years earlier for previous filing.. I checked the box and put the info related to the previous I-129F filing (beneficiary name, date, embassy ) in the appropriate section of my current I-129F.

When I called USCIS to ask about the RFE (at first I thought that there must have been a mistake) they would not tell me what aspect of MBRA act i had violated, just that it was something related to IMBRA. I then looked up the old case from 2008 online and found that it still show up as "Post Decision Activity" status and last action was approval on Dec 22 2008. I called USCIS again and asked how t cancel this old petition and they advised me to create a Request to Withdraw this old petition and send it in to my facing California Service Center by certified mail. I asked a second phone CS agent at USCIS and got the same answer. I drafted the letter with all of the info they requested that I include and made an appt at the InfoPass office so that I could show the document to someone in person just to confirm a third time. The Info Pass representative confirmed that the document looked correct and that i should mail it to the California Service Center. I did so the next day, but waited over 5 weeks with no response.

Although my receipt from the certified mail shows that it had been received more than 5 weeks earlier, the USCIS states that the California Service Center has never received the Withdrawal letter from me on this old approved petition. I told the USCIS CS rep I would like to investigate what happened to my filing as I had never received anything and was told someone would get back to me in 5 days. After 5 days I called again and now was told that they e-mailed me that info (they hadn't) but the results were that they confirmed that the 4 y.o. petition was approved back in 2008 and that I could still proceed to the next step in obtaining a K1 visa on that petition. Arrrrgggh! I explained that I was trying to Withdraw this old petition and was told someone would look into that and a few days later I did get a letter which stated that they would like to apologize for giving me the incorrect information on my inquiry about the lost withdrawal, however no recommendation on how to proceed in actually withdrawing the old petition.

At this point I started reading over the VJ forums and found that everything I had been told by USCIS to date was incorrect, that the Request to Withdraw must be sent to the embassy in the country of my former fiance. VJ forums are more accurate and complete than any info I have received from USCIS. I sent an e-mail inquiry and a PDF of my request to withdraw the petition to the US Embassy in my former fiance's home country and received an immediate response that the document should be notarized and sent to them, and then they would pull the petition and send it back to NVC. I sent the notarized document and a week later on Sept. 17th when I called the NVC they advised me that they received the paperwork back from the US embassy and had forwarded everything back to USCIS California Service Center the same day. That seemed odd, almost like nothing is processed or reviewed at NVC? They stated that the physical documents are sent back to Cal Service Center and not just a notice to cancel the visa in their system so,"...it takes at least 60 days for it to be received there in California and 120 days for the case status to be updated online in the USCIS system. I called the USCIS 800 number a week later and 4 more times up until last Fri Oct 28th and they tell me that to date, they have never received any paperwork from NVC or updates from them on the withdrawal when I give them the case # for this old petition.

Now my deadline for responding to the RFE on my current petition is looming (Oct. 8th) and so I must submit it this week. i am 15 min from the Post Office for CSC so this time, when I submit the RFE I will hand deliver it to the PO and get a proof of delivery. My question for the VJ community is how I should complete the RFE response document. I was hoping to be able to show the updated status online or confirm with the USCIS that they received the withdrawn petition or some proof that it has been withdrawn, but it appears that this is not possible. I also asked the NVC if they could provide me with some proof of receiving/sending the withdrawn petition back to USCIS but they tell me that they do not do that. I just have a copy of my notarized withdrawal form that i sent to the embassy now to show that the process has been started to have it withdrawn. IS this going to be enough evidence for them to approve the petition? In my response, should I document every step I have taken in calling the USCIS, getting an InfoPass appt and then sending the withdrawal to CSC or should I just forget that part and only tell them about the documents sent to the Embassy and the verbal I received from NVC that it was processed? Should I ask for a waiver in my RFE or just state that I thought that I was in compliance with IMBRA provisions and that once the old petition is officially withdrawn no waiver is necessary. I asked these questions to USCIS and they said they cannot give e this info and that I should consult an immigration atty.

Thanks in advance and sorry I have written so much, but I did not want to leave out any details that may be important.

Pete