Joint Sponsor who is Married Question (merged)

[Tara* 0]

My mom is going to be our joint sponsor.
She filled out form I-864 and provided her tax return and tax transcript. Her income is well above the requirement and she is a US citizen.

She is married so she has a joint tax return with my dad. But her income is higher than his and she makes enough to be our joint sponsor on her own.

We are being told (not professional advice) that my dad needs to be the joint sponsor just because his name is above hers on the tax return and that my mom needs to complete form I-864 A.
We don´t understand why because my mom´s income is high enough for her to be the only joint sponsor.

So is she ok to be our joint sponsor or is the person helping us correct here? Thanks.

[SteveInBostonI130 3,319]

Your mom can be the sole joint sponsor.  But because she is not including your dad's income, she needs to submit her W2's/1099's along with the tax transcripts.  And the current income field should reflect her income only, not the AGI from the joint tax filing.

[pushbrk 12,105]

5 hours ago, SteveInBostonI130 said:

Your mom can be the sole joint sponsor.  But because she is not including your dad's income, she needs to submit her W2's/1099's along with the tax transcripts.  And the current income field should reflect her income only, not the AGI from the joint tax filing.

Not sure where you get this information but the number she uses from the joint tax return is the "total income" from the return or transcript.  Now, the part about providing documentation of her personal income from the past MIGHT work, but she'll need to provide a current pay stub as evidence of her current income.  Employed people's current income does not come from a tax return.  Tax returns are about the past.

 

Doing all that might or might not prevent a Consular Officer from asking for the I-864a from Dad, but it is best practice to provide it up front anyway.

 

The outside advice regarding Dad's name being on top of the tax return is nonsense.  

 

Best practice is to have the higher income earner be the joint sponsor, and provide an I-864a from the joint filing spouse.  Yes, really.  Yes, I'm sure.

[SteveInBostonI130 3,319]

3 hours ago, pushbrk said:

Not sure where you get this information but the number she uses from the joint tax return is the "total income" from the return or transcript.  Now, the part about providing documentation of her personal income from the past MIGHT work, but she'll need to provide a current pay stub as evidence of her current income.  Employed people's current income does not come from a tax return.  Tax returns are about the past.

 

Doing all that might or might not prevent a Consular Officer from asking for the I-864a from Dad, but it is best practice to provide it up front anyway.

 

The outside advice regarding Dad's name being on top of the tax return is nonsense.  

 

Best practice is to have the higher income earner be the joint sponsor, and provide an I-864a from the joint filing spouse.  Yes, really.  Yes, I'm sure.

 

I am getting this from the I-864 instructions.

 

https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/forms/i-864instr.pdf

 

 

The part about including W2's and 1099's is to provide tax information if using one spouse's income from a joint tax return.  A tax transcript, by itself, is not enough.  I-864 instructions, page 8 "...you must include a copy of each and every Form W-2 and Form 1099 that relates to your returns.  Do not include copies of these forms if you provide an IRS transcript....unless you filed a joint income tax return with your spouse and are qualifying using only your income":

 

 

 

 

Also, per I-864 Instructions,  page 8, "If your individual annual income listed in Item Number 7. is greater than 125 percent....you do not need to include any other household member's income."

 

 

Paystubs may be needed for evidence of current income.  But if it is similar to what is shown on the W2's/1099's, paystubs may not be needed.  I-864 instructions, pages 7-8, "You may include evidence supporting your claim about your expected income... You are not required to submit this evidence, however, unless specifically instructed to do so by a U.S. Government official."

 

[pushbrk 12,105]

Those are USCIS instructions but they don't issue visas.  More often than not, Consular Officers want to see an I-864a from a joint filing spouse even if the spouse has no income.  The affidavit is not just a statement and evidence of qualification.  It's a "contract".  They want both spouse's signing the contract.  Really, did you think I wasn't familiar with the instructions?  I'm giving you an answer based on both the instructions AND experience.  Caveat emptor.

[Tara* 0]

Thank you both very much.

She retired a month ago this year. So will be including my dad´s income with the form I-864 A with the joint tax return and transcript enough? His income is also above the requirement. Or do they need to put down some assets , too? Just worried that marking her as retired they are going to worry that there isn´t income coming in.  Also would my dad then need to show that his income hasn´t ended?  (I don´t want to overcomplicate this either if I don´t need to)

Thanks again.

 

-Tara

Edited November 30, 2021 by Tara*

[pushbrk 12,105]

1 hour ago, Tara* said:

Thank you both very much.

She retired a month ago this year. So will be including my dad´s income with the form I-864 A with the joint tax return and transcript enough? His income is also above the requirement. Or do they need to put down some assets , too? Just worried that marking her as retired they are going to worry that there isn´t income coming in.  Also would my dad then need to show that his income hasn´t ended?  (I don´t want to overcomplicate this either if I don´t need to)

Thanks again.

 

-Tara

So, who makes the most income now, him, or her?  If his income qualifies, make him the joint sponsor and her the household member.  Presumably, even if she's retired, she has income, but the one with more income should be the joint sponsor.

[Tara* 0]

Thanks, she still had a higher income than him in 2020, last year which is what the tax forms are from. So what to do in this case? Many thanks.

[Mike E 11,723]

7 minutes ago, Tara* said:

Thanks, she still had a higher income than him in 2020, last year which is what the tax forms are from. So what to do in this case? Many thanks.

He said it: the I’ve with higher income today in 2021 should be the joint sponsor. 

[Tara* 0]

Ok thanks, her income is higher on the tax return we are showing. Where does it say the one with the higher income this year needs to be the joint sponsor in the instructions, anyways?

[pushbrk 12,105]

7 hours ago, Tara* said:

Thanks, she still had a higher income than him in 2020, last year which is what the tax forms are from. So what to do in this case? Many thanks.

Tax returns are about the past.  Current income doesn't come from tax returns for employed people.  Use current income in the current income section.  Tax return data in the tax section.

 

Current income is a present tense question, you seem to want to answer with past tense data.  Don't make that mistake.

[Mike E 11,723]

7 hours ago, Tara* said:

Ok thanks, her income is higher on the tax return we are showing. Where does it say the one with the higher income this year needs to be the joint sponsor in the instructions, anyways?

You are coming here asking for advice on how to complete your I-864.  A person, @pushbrk, who in my opinion knows more about what works and what doesn’t with I-864 they anyone else on the entire planet (including attorneys) is advising  you that when a married  couple is filing joint tax returns, the spouse who has higher current income should be the joint sponsor.  
 

You free to ignore that advice of course.  I’ve seen dozens of horror stories with I-864 mistakes.  
 

Best luck on your visa journey. 

[pushbrk 12,105]

8 hours ago, Tara* said:

Ok thanks, her income is higher on the tax return we are showing. Where does it say the one with the higher income this year needs to be the joint sponsor in the instructions, anyways?

"It" doesn't.  I'm advising it based on extensive experience.  Forget about what's easy.  Do it the best way.

[Tara* 0]

Got it thanks. So the person with the higher CURRENT income (regardless of what the tax returns you are showing show) should be the joint sponsor. So if 2020´s tax return shows one spouse higher and the next year (now 2021) the other spouse´s income is higher, go with that spouse as joint sponsor  (even though we aren´t showing evidence of their current higher income)  ?

[pushbrk 12,105]

14 hours ago, Tara* said:

Got it thanks. So the person with the higher CURRENT income (regardless of what the tax returns you are showing show) should be the joint sponsor. So if 2020´s tax return shows one spouse higher and the next year (now 2021) the other spouse´s income is higher, go with that spouse as joint sponsor  (even though we aren´t showing evidence of their current higher income)  ?

But you WILL be showing evidence of current income, which has nothing to do with any tax return.

 

You keep talking about tax returns, while I'm talking about current income.  Tax returns for employed people have nothing to do with current income.  Your mother's circumstances are a prime example.  Her current income has changed since she last filed a tax return.  Embrace this concept and then carry on.

 

If you are confused about how to calculate, state, and document current income, describe the details of the current income sources for each of your parents, and I'll tell you the formulas to use.

Edited December 1, 2021 by pushbrk