Guatemalan President to world: Legalize drugs

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Most likely it would be similar to ending prohibition.. Rough at first, some of the now drug lords would become legitimate, some would move to whatever drugs the government decided to keep illegal.. Slowly others would join the competition as it was no longer seen as an embarrassing business to be in.. A few large corps would eventually control 80% of all the business while another 20% would be small and stylish and higher priced.

We would have some funny new commercials to look forward to.

You can look to California, especially the SF Bay Area, to see how that would work. So far, it hasn't. There are zoning complaints, noise complaints, and a frequency of undesirable people loitering around the establishments. The few countries that have also legalized certain drugs have begun reversing their policies, increasing the restrictions, and often limiting the availability of the drugs to chronic drug abusers enrolled in closely supervised programs.

Edited September 26, 2012 by The Patriot

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

You can look to California, especially the SF Bay Area, to see how that would work. So far, it hasn't. There are zoning complaints, noise complaints, and a frequency of undesirable people loitering around the establishments. The few countries that have also legalized certain drugs have begun reversing their policies, increasing the restrictions, and often limiting the availability of the drugs to chronic drug abusers enrolled in closely supervised programs.

You couldn't tell from the map indicating drug use among adults which country has the most liberal drug policies.

Edited September 27, 2012 by Mr. Big Dog

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

You couldn't tell from the map indicating drug use among adults which country has the most liberal drug policies.

Wikipedia

That image does seem to get around.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Wikipedia

You've got a better map? Stats? Let's see it.

[OnMyWayID 1,489]

You can look to California, especially the SF Bay Area, to see how that would work. So far, it hasn't. There are zoning complaints, noise complaints, and a frequency of undesirable people loitering around the establishments. The few countries that have also legalized certain drugs have begun reversing their policies, increasing the restrictions, and often limiting the availability of the drugs to chronic drug abusers enrolled in closely supervised programs.

Yeah OK.. no doubt there would be problems, there is no 100% win here... maybe we could just start with pot.. So far the proof for pot use causing permanent problems is for those who smoke when they are young and the brain is forming so set the legal age to 21.. People can grow it themselves (east to cut out the traffickers) and potheads that have access to cheap pot generally are nothing more than an annoyance... there will still be the problems we have with other legal drugs (ie: driving while intoxicated) but we could start the experiment there.

[james&olya 1,121]

Where does the private enterprise get the licensing? Do you think that every Joe Farmer is going to start growing weed and cocoa and sell it at roadside stands? What does the Bureau of ATF do? It makes me laugh when people think that the cartels are just going to go away overnight. And peacefully give up a business worth tens of billions.

Do you have even the foggiest idea of how capitalism, the free market system, operates? The price of a given commodity is a function of supply and demand. If supply is restricted, which current drug policy attempts to do, the price goes up. The tremendous profits that can be made are due to the fact that these drugs are illegal and the supply is reduced (at great cost to the tax-payers) by our current 'war on drugs'! If they were made legal the price would come way down and there would no longer be the huge profits. What junkie is going to spend 100 dollars for something he can buy for 5? With the profits reduced there is no longer any incentive for pushers to try and get your kids to get addicted. The drug problem would not go away but it would be far less costly to society in many ways. The money now spent propping up the prices (and profits for criminals) could instead be used for treatment and rehabilitation.

Your comment about whether they will "peacefully give up...billions" is rather ignorant. Unless you suppose they are threatening the legislators who are considering passing legislation that would legalize these drugs. More likely they are contributing heavily to the pro 'war on drugs' legislators!

Cocoa is grown in Africa, I think. It is perfectly legal already. Those of us addicted to it are still able to function fairly normally.

Edited September 27, 2012 by james&olya

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Yeah OK.. no doubt there would be problems, there is no 100% win here... maybe we could just start with pot.. So far the proof for pot use causing permanent problems is for those who smoke when they are young and the brain is forming so set the legal age to 21.. People can grow it themselves (east to cut out the traffickers) and potheads that have access to cheap pot generally are nothing more than an annoyance... there will still be the problems we have with other legal drugs (ie: driving while intoxicated) but we could start the experiment there.

Marijuana is almost completely legal in California. All you need is a medical card from a doctor, but you can get those over the phone, or through the internet. It is becoming a major problem. Cities don't want the marijuana clubs, and are more than willing to drop a dime on them to the IRS or the DEA, if they get too popular, or uncooperative.

SAN FRANCISCO (KGO) -- A fast-moving grass fire threatened some homes in San Francisco's Silver Terrace neighborhood Friday afternoon. But it was what firefighters discovered in one of the homes that got police involved.

Firefighters stumbled upon 28 fully grown marijuana plants, which police later packed into evidence sacks. The street value is estimated at $75,000.

The whole thing was a shock to next-door neighbor Michael Williams, a local pastor.

"To me, when you say 'weed,' I think about weeds that are growing; I don't think about things that are growing inside of a house," Williams said.

The fire broke out on a grassy hillside around 3:30 p.m. near Charter Oak Avenue. Smoke from the fire could be seen from the nearby Highway 280/Highway 101 split.

The flames got as far as a back fence. Investigators are looking into whether the fire was started by people at a nearby homeless encampment.

Firefighters broke through the front door of an empty house to drag their hoses through; that's when they found the marijuana grow in two back bedrooms. There was an extensive wiring and lighting set-up and an air-filtration system.

Police say the wiring bypassed the electric meter, which is typical in illegal operations. More often police and firefighters are stumbling upon these types of pot farms.

"Certainly there is a lot of gray area about what is legal and what isn't, so we're going to have a lot of people who are going to stretch the boundaries," San Francisco Police Lt. Robert O'Sullivan said.

Police say there was no paperwork inside to indicate a legal growing operation. They have not tracked down the two people who rented the home. They could face charges of growing pot and stealing electricity.

PLACENTIA, Calif. (KABC) -- A transformer fire led police to a marijuana growing operation at an industrial building in Placentia Monday night.

The discovery was made around 7 p.m. after a fire broke out on the 1000 block of south Melrose Street near Melrose Elementary. Police say transformers on the side of the building blew up.

"Firefighters saw smoke coming from the roof of the unit that is in question. They made entry through the roll-up doors and found the plants," said Placentia Police Det. Corinne Loomis.

Police say the grow was intricate, with a hydroponics irrigation system. Nearly all of the 5,000 square feet of floor space in the building was covered with between 1,500 and 2,000 marijuana plants. Some of the plants were just a few feet tall; others were the size of a Christmas tree.

The street value of the grow is estimated at $500,000.

Some people who work nearby say they had their suspicions about the building.

"I used to walk on my lunch breaks this way, and it always smelled like marijuana over there," said Noel Benny, who works nearby.

Police will be using utility records to track down the building's owner. They say it's clear this operation had been going on here for quite some time.

"It's not going to attract a lot of attention," said Loomis. "It's not like a meth lab where you have fumes or dangerous things being done...but certainly for a city or community of our size, this is a substantial grow."

You've got a better map? Stats? Let's see it.

That's just it. The NORML crowd has flooded the internet with misinformation.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

That's just it. The NORML crowd has flooded the internet with misinformation.

What misinformation? Drug use in the Netherlands (legal drugs) is lower than in Germany (illegal drugs). It's been that way before drugs were legalized in the Netherlands. It's that way after. Legalizing drugs has not changed the use of drugs. It has lowered drug related crime. And that is why we need to keep fighting the war on drugs. Prison Corporations - among others - depend on it.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

What misinformation? Drug use in the Netherlands (legal drugs) is lower than in Germany (illegal drugs). It's been that way before drugs were legalized in the Netherlands. It's that way after. Legalizing drugs has not changed the use of drugs. It has lowered drug related crime. And that is why we need to keep fighting the war on drugs. Prison Corporations - among others - depend on it.

Netherlands is having problems with drug tourists:

Rotterdam mayor says cannabis pass creates problems

Rotterdam mayor Ahmed Aboutaleb on Tuesday said the cannabis club membership card does not work and will never work.

Speaking to tv programme EenVandaag, the mayor said the cannabis pass just causes more nuisance. He thinks there will be more street dealing of soft drugs once it is introduced throughout the Netherlands on January 1.

Aboutaleb did not say if he would refuse to introduce the membership scheme in Rotterdam.

The pass was introduced in cannabis cafes in the south of the country on May 1 this year. Making them membership-only was a way of keeping out foreigners.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Netherlands is having problems with drug tourists.

Sure. You'd eliminate that tourism if Germany, Belgium and France would legalize drugs. The Dutch have not increased their drug use as a result of the legalization. Nor have their neighbors. They just changed the way in which to obtain the drugs.

Edited September 27, 2012 by Mr. Big Dog

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

The Dutch have not increased their drug use as a result of the legalization. Nor have their neighbors.

I have read to the contrary. But, I might look for that tomorrow. Tonight's the third night of a mini series on Encore.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I have read to the contrary. But, I might look for that tomorrow. Tonight's the third night of a mini series on Encore.

Let's see it tomorrow then.

[OnMyWayID 1,489]

Marijuana is almost completely legal in California. All you need is a medical card from a doctor, but you can get those over the phone, or through the internet. It is becoming a major problem. Cities don't want the marijuana clubs, and are more than willing to drop a dime on them to the IRS or the DEA, if they get too popular, or uncooperative.

That's just it. The NORML crowd has flooded the internet with misinformation.

You may be right but if we have a choice between dealing with drug dealers and pot heads I might choose the latter.. I admittedly have not thought it through.. Legalization would cause some problems and eliminate others.. The money might be better spent on education and treatment rather than interdiction.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

You may be right but if we have a choice between dealing with drug dealers and pot heads I might choose the latter.. I admittedly have not thought it through.. Legalization would cause some problems and eliminate others.. The money might be better spent on education and treatment rather than interdiction.

You don't get one without the other. The only difference is that is California, the drug dealers have neighborhood storefronts.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Let's see it tomorrow then.

I am still sifting through all the kudos. Here is an article discussing the change in Dutch drug policy:

Article: A Repressive Climate Dominating the Dutch Drug Policy

Edited September 27, 2012 by The Patriot