N-400 Questions/ Vietnamese Re-educatiom Camp

[hope2018 25]

Hello everyone, 

I am preparing the N-400 form for my dad. On the form, there are certain questions that I am not sure how to fill.

Background:

My dad had some police training and worked for South Vietnam. When North Vietnamese took over the country, he was sent to "the re-education camp" for a little over 2 years. He sent a refugee application with the U.S. Orderly Departure Program many years ago but he got denied because he did not meet the criteria of having at least 3 years in the reeducation camp. 

Questions on N-400:

 

15. Were you EVER a member of, or did you EVER serve in, help, or otherwise participate in, any of the following groups:

 

A. Military unit?

B....

C. Police Unit? 

 

I put "Yes " to the "Police Unit". Is it correct?

 

23. Have you EVER been arrested, cited, or detained by any law enforcement officer (including any immigration official or any official of the U.S. armed forces) for any reason?

26. Have you EVER been place in an alternative sentencing or a rehabilitative program (for example, diversion, deferred prosecution, withheld adjudication, deferred adjudication)?

28. Have you EVER been in jail or prison? 

 

What should I put? Would the "Vietnamese re-education camp" fits in these questions? Since it was a long time ago, there is not really any records of my dad being in the camp. If I answer yes, I have to provide records. He got a copy but the ink is faded and hard to read. He still has a denial letter from the US Embassy many years ago mentioning he went to the reeducation camp under 3 years. The translator told us not to answer yes because it is not applicable. 

Please advise

 

[nightingalejules 678]

Generally speaking, it’s better to answer “yes”and then explain. If you say no to prison and they disagree, then the petition will be denied. 

[CarlHamilton 252]

Sounds like this would be more of a problem if he had been on the other side.  Isn't he a green card holder?  How did he handle this question on the green card application?

[hope2018 25]

9 hours ago, shomer said:

Sounds like this would be more of a problem if he had been on the other side.  Isn't he a green card holder?  How did he handle this question on the green card application?

I don't remember seeing this exact same question on DS-260. 

[mccorleone 12]

The questions 23/26/28 apply for the period of time that he is in the US only, not the events that took place in VN.  Answer NO the those 3 questions.

[CarlHamilton 252]

27 minutes ago, mccorleone said:

The questions 23/26/28 apply for the period of time that he is in the US only, not the events that took place in VN.  Answer NO the those 3 questions.

The questions ask "have you EVER" (original emphasis). Why do you think ever means US only?

[Going through 5,668]

12 hours ago, mccorleone said:

The questions 23/26/28 apply for the period of time that he is in the US only, not the events that took place in VN.  Answer NO the those 3 questions.

Not correct.

Application question reads as "EVER"...as in ever, in any country.

 

 

On 4/3/2018 at 7:47 PM, hope2018 said:

15. Were you EVER a member of, or did you EVER serve in, help, or otherwise participate in, any of the following groups:

 

A. Military unit?

B....

C.  Police Unit? 

 

I put "Yes " to the "Police Unit". Is it correct?

Correct.

 

On 4/3/2018 at 7:47 PM, hope2018 said:

23. Have you EVER been arrested, cited, or detained by any law enforcement officer (including any immigration official or any official of the U.S. armed forces) for any reason?

26. Have you EVER been place in an alternative sentencing or a rehabilitative program (for example, diversion, deferred prosecution, withheld adjudication, deferred adjudication)?

28. Have you EVER been in jail or prison? 

23.  Yes (he was detained).

26.  Yes (the re-education camp would be termed as a rehabilitative program).

28.  No.

 

On 4/3/2018 at 7:47 PM, hope2018 said:

If I answer yes, I have to provide records. He got a copy but the ink is faded and hard to read. He still has a denial letter from the US Embassy many years ago mentioning he went to the reeducation camp under 3 years. The translator told us not to answer yes because it is not applicable. 

Even if the ink is hard to read, you still have documentation so that's a good thing.

Don't listen to the translator----think about it:  from his previous filing/rejection, the US Embassy has on record that he attended a re-education camp, so NOT disclosing it on the application would be a clear misrepresentation of facts when USCIS reviews his entire file.

 

Fill in the questions appropriately, attach a written explanation of the details, and submit a copy of the re-education document.  Many photocopiers can darken original images if you are uncertain it's readable enough.

 

Edited April 6, 2018 by Going through

[WandY 430]

I would say "No" to all. Why? Because it was an extraordinary event (military take-over, acts of war, etc.) that was a long time ago. In my opinion, the questions are for ordinary matters, not those found at the end of the Vietnam War. It's an interesting question, but my answer is a solid "No." Good luck!

[Mountain Climber 186]

1 hour ago, WandY said:

I would say "No" to all. Why? Because it was an extraordinary event (military take-over, acts of war, etc.) that was a long time ago. In my opinion, the questions are for ordinary matters, not those found at the end of the Vietnam War. It's an interesting question, but my answer is a solid "No." Good luck!

This makes no sense.  Just because something was an extraordinary event or happened a long time ago does not mean it does not have to be disclosed.  The questions are for ALL matters, not just ordinary matters. 

[CarlHamilton 252]

17 hours ago, Mountain Climber said:

This makes no sense.  Just because something was an extraordinary event or happened a long time ago does not mean it does not have to be disclosed.  The questions are for ALL matters, not just ordinary matters. 

In fact, these questions are specifically designed to capture the extraordinary things that some people may have been up to a long time ago in foreign countries (Nazi crimes come to mind, not that this applies to the OP).  "Sorry, it was a long time ago" or "it didn't happen in the US therefore it doesn't count" is not something you want to say to an immigration officer when you get caught lying about wartime experiences.  

Edited April 8, 2018 by shomer

[WandY 430]

Your logic does not hold. Do some homework (Bosnia, etc.) and you'll see that extraordinary circumstances ARE NOT the same. But whatever. Just my opinion.

[Going through 5,668]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. 

USCIS bases their approval on factual evidence. 

 

The circumstances of his prior history is not a reason for denial---however misrepresentation of his prior history is.

 

They already will have evidence in his file that he attended the camp, so makes sense that OP's father should disclose it instead of purposefully omitting it, and the application is denied based on misrepresentation.

Edited April 9, 2018 by Going through

[CarlHamilton 252]

10 hours ago, WandY said:

Your logic does not hold. Do some homework (Bosnia, etc.) and you'll see that extraordinary circumstances ARE NOT the same. But whatever. Just my opinion.

Why don't you please enlighten us about Bosnia?  Make sure to provide links.  In the meantime, read this: https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/449/490/case.html

Edited April 9, 2018 by shomer

[hope2018 25]

Thank you everyone for being so helpful! My dad answered yes and passed the N-400 interview! Honesty is the best policy.