Multiple Shorter Entries within a year on ESTA/VWP

[caliliving 606]

Look, you probably won't have problems your first time...so i wouldnt worry about it until aftee that. Once you visit her things can change, feelings ect.

 

all you can do is spend more time out then in. But after a couple visits then seriously think about hour next few steps. 

 

Their is no magic answer that you are expecting. At worst, they ask you to withdraw your application and you apply for a cr1

 

I am going to tell you, the k1 for you is a bad idea!!!! U will be unable to work for 120 days while waiting for the ead and an expedite is a pain and will take just as long! Cr1 is the best bc then u can work right away. Just my 2 cents

 

 

[S*UK 543]

Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but....

I am very sure that you can only use the visa waiver programme to enter and stay in the US for up to 90 days in any 12 month period. This is regardless of whether you leave and then re-enter. 

My personal experience: upon entry using VWP you WILL be asked if you have visited the USA at any point in the last 12 month period (baring in mind they will already know from the dated stamps in your passport). You will of course answer yes and they will ask when/for how long. If you have already spent 90 days in the US in the last 12 months you will be denied entry. 

Based on this your plan to use the VWP this way is actually illegal (as far as I am aware). 

The ESTA is designed for vacations/travel. Me and my fiancé considered using the ESTA in a similar way to you before embarking on K1 and quickly became aware that it would not allow us any more time than the 90 days of the K1 for this reason. 

Edited July 22, 2017 by S*UK

[Unidentified 2,930]

5 minutes ago, S*UK said:

Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but....

I am very sure that you can only use the visa waiver programme to enter and stay in the US for up to 90 days in any 12 month period. This is regardless of whether you leave and then re-enter. 

My personal experience: upon entry using VWP you WILL be asked if you have visited the USA at any point in the last 12 month period (baring in mind they will already know from the dated stamps in your passport). You will of course answer yes and they will ask when/for how long. If you have already spent 90 days in the US in the last 12 months you will be denied entry. 

Based on this your plan to use the VWP this is actually illegal (as far as I am aware). 

Wrong. You can enter for 90 days and stay out and then come back for 90 days all in one year. You can visit as much as you want as long as you stay out longer than you are in. And as long as you can prove that you're going home and that you don't abuse the system.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Unidentified

[JFH 12,189]

2 hours ago, S*UK said:

Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but....

I am very sure that you can only use the visa waiver programme to enter and stay in the US for up to 90 days in any 12 month period. This is regardless of whether you leave and then re-enter. 

My personal experience: upon entry using VWP you WILL be asked if you have visited the USA at any point in the last 12 month period (baring in mind they will already know from the dated stamps in your passport). You will of course answer yes and they will ask when/for how long. If you have already spent 90 days in the US in the last 12 months you will be denied entry. 

Based on this your plan to use the VWP this way is actually illegal (as far as I am aware). 

The ESTA is designed for vacations/travel. Me and my fiancé considered using the ESTA in a similar way to you before embarking on K1 and quickly became aware that it would not allow us any more time than the 90 days of the K1 for this reason. 

Completely wrong. The VWP is for 90 days per entry, with unlimited entries per year. Since every admission for every person who is not a USC is at the discretion of the CBP agents, no entry is ever guaranteed anyway. There is no rule as to how many times you can visit in one year. My "record" is 9. However, since the VWP is for visiting, and each person coming to visit must convince the CBP officer that they are visiting and not living here in installments, this by consequence means that you can realistically only use it a once a year for the full 90 days. If you come back for another 90 days in the same year you start to move into dangerous waters as this would now mean 6 months of the year will have been spent in the USA, and that's not visiting by the CBP definition, or by the IRS definition either. 

[Michael2017 368]

20 hours ago, Aussie_Mike said:

Dear VJ Community,

 

I am planning to visit the USA roughly 6 times over the next 12 months for less 4 weeks each trip using the visa waiver program/ESTA. Should I anticipate problems? Should I plan to apply for a B-2?

 

A few facts:

• Early 30's, Male, Caucasian, Australian Citizen.
• Spent a lot time in the USA on L1, J1 and F1 visa's over the last 10 years. No visa over-stays. No criminal history, etc.
• My intent is spend time with my girlfriend whom I met while on my L1 visa. That job assignment ended in June 2017. We are considering engagement and K-1 in the next 6-12 months
• I continue to be employed as a professional by the same company. My current assignment has me working rotationally, spending 28 days at work in central asia, I then have the next 28 days off work.
• I had no issues arriving on ESTA on my first time off.
• I have documentation and evidence in my passport of my continued employment and plans to leave (e.g. flights back to work in central asia)

 

I am concerned that my planned multiple entries dont fit most tourists patterns. Equally, applying for a B1/B2 also opens myself up for explaining why I intend to visit the USA frequently, and concerns we may marry on the wrong visa type (which we obviously wont do).

 

Any thoughts would be helpful, thanks.

 

Hi,

 

I have discussed something similar with CBP online customer service and my lawyer.

As long as you are longer outside than inside for each of the trips, you should be ok.

If you want to play it save, you want to be double the time outside as inside.

All comes down to the CBP officer, and in most cases, you would receive a warning and secondary inspection before they send you home straight. So, once you got such a warning, you are better off to be longer time outside. If you get no warning, you can get going. Attached a list of ties that they can ask you for. Download it.

 

You will need to file taxes in the USA at one point. There are some online calculators that will tell you when. For a 3 year period, it is around 4.5-5 months of being in the USA each year before you become a tax resident (not 6 months as many think).

http://www.visataxes.com/residency-tax-calculator.php

 

 

Ties.pdf

Edited July 22, 2017 by Michael2017

[Boiler 43,360]

Visitors are required to have a foreign abode and obviously you do not have one.

 

Seen similar situations with people working on oil rigs wanting to spend their of time in the US. Cruise ships etc.

 

You will be able to enter until they say no, as it is down to the PoE everytime you apply nobody can say when that will be or what they would so then, most likely given a warning first, maybe allowed to withdraw your application to enter.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Boiler

[mallafri76 1,012]

14 hours ago, Aussie_Mike said:

 

 

Thanks for the feedback. I'm trying to understand what is a realistic strategy.  Would say 2-3 weeks in the USA followed by 5-6 outside be less alarming?

 

Spending time in Australia is not a deal breaker. I'm trying to understand what doesn't raise suspicion while also wanting to be with my significant other.

"They" say to stay at least double the time outside the US as you do inside. But you also have to look at the total amount of time you spend in the US in any year as well as what ties you have to your home country. 

 

It's hard to say what will raise suspicion but I would say too many frequent visits or too many long visits in a year will most likely raise some eyebrows. The way you explained your work, you can only visit for four weeks at a time, correct? So in my opinion, you shouldn't do more than three visits a year of four weeks each. That will still put you much more outside the US than inside and the length of each visit isn't long enough to raise suspicion. 

 

You're from a VWP country, which means you have the luxury of visiting the US during the visa process. Don't play around with it too much because if you get denied entry, you cannot travel under VWP anymore and getting a visitors visa with a fiancé or spouse in the US is near impossible. 

[mallafri76 1,012]

5 hours ago, S*UK said:

Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but....

I am very sure that you can only use the visa waiver programme to enter and stay in the US for up to 90 days in any 12 month period. This is regardless of whether you leave and then re-enter. 

Nope, it's up to 90 days per entry. So in theory, you could stay for 90 days, leave for a day and then come back for another 90 days. However, the rules say you have to have a reasonable amount of time between visits. That's where CBP comes in and determines whether or not they think you're spending a reasonable amount of time outside the US or if you're trying to use the VWP to live in the US. 

[Michael2017 368]

I have been in the past years, always 5 months in the USA with ESTA, WW, and will go now again for another 2.5 months in fall.

Never a problem. I know form others who stayed 7-8 months per year. Also no problem. Usually, you will get a warning before you run into trouble.

If you are pulled in a secondary inspection and they warn you, take the note and change your visiting schedule, until then, enjoy!

[Aussie_Mike 12]

15 hours ago, caliliving said:

Look, you probably won't have problems your first time...so i wouldnt worry about it until aftee that. Once you visit her things can change, feelings ect.

 

Exactly. Time away and back together makes bonds stronger. We are both feeling that. The ball seems clearly in my court for the next step

I am on my first visit and had no issues. Only weird question was the CBP officer asked me to confirm the last 4 digits of my social. Apparantly my name is common. He also asked if my nominated residence on ESTA is a lease I was maintaining; which it is not - I cancelled my lease on finishing my L1

2 hours ago, mallafri76 said:

The way you explained your work, you can only visit for four weeks at a time, correct? So in my opinion, you shouldn't do more than three visits a year of four weeks each. 

Not quite. My company will my fly me almost anywhere for my time off. I didnt realize this until I started and my original plan was to fly back to my nominated residence in Australia, then pay my own way onto the USA. Which I will most likely do in the future based on feedback here when I do return. Under this circumstance, at the POE, I will have return tickets booked to Australia, and a (business class) return ticket from Australia to my work. It sounds risky, but reasonable to spend some (but perhaps not all) of my time off in the USA every ther month. My gf and I may be able to manage short visits in Europe or Canada when she has vacation time from school.

 

4 hours ago, Boiler said:

Visitors are required to have a foreign abode and obviously you do not have one.

 

Seen similar situations with people working on oil rigs wanting to spend their of time in the US. Cruise ships etc.

 

You will be able to enter until they say no, as it is down to the PoE everytime you apply nobody can say when that will be or what they would so then, most likely given a warning first, maybe allowed to withdraw your application to enter.

Good feedback and your observation makes sense. I have made plans to have my residential address as my parents. Since leaving my L1 I cancelled my lease in the USA and moved all my accounts back to my parents address. I have renewed my drivers license, enrolled in health insurance, and changed my voting status, and bank accounts all back to this address. My parents are totally onboard with their son spending more time with them.

 

1 hour ago, Michael2017 said:

I have been in the past years, always 5 months in the USA with ESTA, WW, and will go now again for another 2.5 months in fall.

Never a problem. I know form others who stayed 7-8 months per year. Also no problem. Usually, you will get a warning before you run into trouble.

If you are pulled in a secondary inspection and they warn you, take the note and change your visiting schedule, until then, enjoy!

Wow. Thats remarkable. Did you state you were visiting a significant other, fiance, wife? I saw your comment on taxes and discussed this in advanced with the taxation accountant, kpmg, which managed taxes for all expats residing in the US in my company. They said it would be a concern because of tax treaties in place on the proviso I am paying my appropriate income taxes in Australia ... for this calendar year.

 

Edited July 22, 2017 by Aussie_Mike

[Boiler 43,360]

I thought your plan was to split your time between your job and the US?

[Aussie_Mike 12]

9 minutes ago, Boiler said:

I thought your plan was to split your time between your job and the US?

I may not have been clear. I have to be at work in Asia every 4 weeks. My 4 weeks off is mine, I can be wherever, I just want to be with my girlfriend who is a USC as much as possible without breaking any laws.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Aussie_Mike

[Boiler 43,360]

Like I said, not quite wherever.

[caliliving 606]

Tbh I think you are in a unique situation where you can 5ravel for months and keep your job. I would bring ties of your job and not stress so much. Remember they can and will go thru your phone and computer. Just be truthful and you shouldn't have any problems. At worst they bring you to secondary and you show them proof and they may ask you to withdraw your application, but I don't anticipate you having problems and if you withdraw your application it won't cause you to have problems with a k1 or cr1.

[Boiler 43,360]

The issue is not if he will have a problem, it is when.