Trump's Air Force one math doesn't add up

[Jacque67 7,328]

Air Force One, the heavily modified, white-and-blue-painted Boeing 747 that transports the president of the United States, is an enduring symbol of American power and prestige.

Its also the target of President-elect Donald Trumps latest Twitter rant.

Boeing is building a brand new 747 Air Force One for future presidents, but costs are out of control, more than $4 billion. Cancel order! Trump tweeted on the morning of Dec. 6.

Trump is wrong. Yes, Air Force One is expensive. But costs are most definitely not risingat least no more than they do for any new military aircraft. In propagating misinformation about the presidents official plane of state, Trump isonce againundermining an important American institution that exists not just to gratify him.

Air Force One is for all U.S. presidents, and has been since the Kennedy administration acquired the first Boeing 707s for official transportation starting in 1962. This isnt Trumps plane to do with as he pleases, Brian Laslie, author of The Air Force Way of War, told The Daily Beast. This is for the office of the president of the United States.

Yes, the new presidential transports could end up costing $4 billion to buy and modify for their unique and demanding mission safely flying the president, a large support staff, and accompanying reporters all over the world. Then again, they might cost much less. We simply dont know yet.

But one thing is for sure. Keeping the existing Air Force One in service wont necessarily save money over the long term. And continuing to use old and difficult-to-maintain airplanes could jeopardize the presidents safety.

The current Air Force Ones have served Presidents George H.W. Bush, Bill Clinton, George W. Bush, and Barack Obamaand are in line to be Trumps official aerial transportation following his January 2017 inauguration.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/12/06/donald-trump-s-air-force-one-math-doesn-t-add-up.html

[smilesammich 10,727]

it ain't about math.

Seemingly out of nowhere on Tuesday morning, President-elect Donald Trump bashed Boeing on Twitter, declaring the company’s costs “out of control,” and saying the government should cancel an order with the company for two new Air Force One jets. As it turns out, that seemingly random outburst against the aerospace company came within an hour after the Chicago Tribune published a column quoting Boeing CEO Dennis Muilenburg offering some tepid criticism of Trump’s aggressive trade rhetoric against China. “Muilenburg suggests the Trump team, and Congress, back off from the 2016 anti-trade rhetoric and perceived threats to punish other countries with higher tariffs or fees,” read the column, by Robert Reed. “Instead, he suggests they get down to the business of advocating a stronger U.S. agenda during ongoing or upcoming trade negotiations with other countries. ‘If we do not lead when it comes to writing these rules, our competitors will write them for us,’ he said.”

http://thebea.st/2hdOqOD

[Jacque67 7,328]

If he's so rich how come he ain't smart?

[Jacque67 7,328]

Precious snowflake

https://www.google.co.jp/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=5&ved=0ahUKEwiPr6n2rOLQAhWKk5QKHRoMA1AQFggcMAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.independent.co.uk%2Fnews%2Fworld%2Famericas%2Fdid-trump-tank-boeing-s-stock-because-he-was-angry-about-a-news-story-a7460031.html&usg=AFQjCNGRmE1a2UAEtxGBbKGwlGWg6JSgwg&sig2=p6FEp30cM4KmPSCFswL3vg

[smilesammich 10,727]

If he's so rich how come he ain't smart?

within the trump bubble he's the smartest. eva.

Precious snowflake

https://www.google.co.jp/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=5&ved=0ahUKEwiPr6n2rOLQAhWKk5QKHRoMA1AQFggcMAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.independent.co.uk%2Fnews%2Fworld%2Famericas%2Fdid-trump-tank-boeing-s-stock-because-he-was-angry-about-a-news-story-a7460031.html&usg=AFQjCNGRmE1a2UAEtxGBbKGwlGWg6JSgwg&sig2=p6FEp30cM4KmPSCFswL3vg

doesn't he hold boeing stock? lol

[Eric-Pris 1,602]

I'm a pilot so I know a little about aviation and airliners.

The cost (sticker price) of a new 747-8 is about $380 million. Mind you, no airline actually pays that, they all negotiate down. So the US government must do so also. The price any airline pays is secret. But lets say they pay $350 million.

They need 2 of them, as AF1 has a twin that flies everywhere it does. (By the way AF1 is not the name of the plane, but a callsign given to ANY plane where the president is on board. So if I were to give him a lift in my plane, I could call ATC as "Air Force 1". That would be awesome. Ok, back to the topic.)

That's $700 million for 2 of them. But those are the generic versions built for airlines. They must be outfitted with a complex encrypted top secret communications system, anti-missile defense system, and other secret defense systems. I could see the price double or even triple on the high end, but 5x as much seems excessive.

Let Airbus get involved and that price will be down fast. Airbuses are more fun to fly anyway. Get him a A380.

[smilesammich 10,727]

yeah. air force one should be all about the fun and el cheapo.

[Jacque67 7,328]

yeah. air force one should be all about the fun and el cheapo.

Taxi drivers - lol.

Asked by reporters to clarify his tweet, Trump said, Well the plane is totally out of control. It's going to be over $4 billion for [the] Air Force One program. And I think it's ridiculous. I think Boeing is doing a little bit of a number. We want Boeing to make a lot of money, but not that much money."

WE WANT BOEING TO MAKE A LOT OF MONEY, BUT NOT THAT MUCH MONEY.

Ignoring the fact that Trump said he doesnt want an American company that employs almost 157,000 people to make that much money, the fact that he thinks $4 billion is too steep of a price tag is a head scratcher. The planes themselves arent that expensive, around $225 million each. But its the costs associated with building a resilient enough aircraft to protect the president, as well as one that can act as a mobile command center like it did during 9/11, that accounts for bulk of the expense. The Pentagon is budgeting $3.2 billion for research and development, military construction, and acquisition of at least two new Air Force One planes through fiscal 2021, an analyst told Bloomberg.

According to CNN Money, the Air Force hasnt even told Boeing whether it wants to buy two or three planes. Boeings current contract is only for $170 million, but many details about the overall replacement project, such as how much of the aforementioned countermeasures and security specs will be included, is still in flux.

We are currently under contract for $170 million to help determine the capabilities of these complex military aircraft that serve the unique requirements of the President of the United States, Boeing said in a statement responding to Trumps broadsides. We look forward to working with the U.S. Air Force on subsequent phases of the program allowing us to deliver the best planes for the President at the best value for the American taxpayer.

Of course, Air Force One doesnt have everything. It certainly lacks the splashy, gold-plated fixtures found in Trumps own private jet. Which certainly raises the question of whether the president-elects tirade against Boeing is a smoke screen for his effort to get his own Boeing 757 designated as the official presidential aircraft. Wouldnt want to let all that gold go to waste.

Asked by reporters to clarify his tweet, Trump said, Well the plane is totally out of control. It's going to be over $4 billion for [the] Air Force One program. And I think it's ridiculous. I think Boeing is doing a little bit of a number. We want Boeing to make a lot of money, but not that much money."

The verge

Edited December 7, 2016 by Jacque67

[smilesammich 10,727]

Taxi drivers - lol.

Asked by reporters to clarify his tweet, Trump said, Well the plane is totally out of control. It's going to be over $4 billion for [the] Air Force One program. And I think it's ridiculous. I think Boeing is doing a little bit of a number. We want Boeing to make a lot of money, but not that much money."

WE WANT BOEING TO MAKE A LOT OF MONEY, BUT NOT THAT MUCH MONEY.

Ignoring the fact that Trump said he doesnt want an American company that employs almost 157,000 people to make that much money, the fact that he thinks $4 billion is too steep of a price tag is a head scratcher. The planes themselves arent that expensive, around $225 million each. But its the costs associated with building a resilient enough aircraft to protect the president, as well as one that can act as a mobile command center like it did during 9/11, that accounts for bulk of the expense. The Pentagon is budgeting $3.2 billion for research and development, military construction, and acquisition of at least two new Air Force One planes through fiscal 2021, an analyst told Bloomberg.

According to CNN Money, the Air Force hasnt even told Boeing whether it wants to buy two or three planes. Boeings current contract is only for $170 million, but many details about the overall replacement project, such as how much of the aforementioned countermeasures and security specs will be included, is still in flux.

We are currently under contract for $170 million to help determine the capabilities of these complex military aircraft that serve the unique requirements of the President of the United States, Boeing said in a statement responding to Trumps broadsides. We look forward to working with the U.S. Air Force on subsequent phases of the program allowing us to deliver the best planes for the President at the best value for the American taxpayer.

Of course, Air Force One doesnt have everything. It certainly lacks the splashy, gold-plated fixtures found in Trumps own private jet. Which certainly raises the question of whether the president-elects tirade against Boeing is a smoke screen for his effort to get his own Boeing 757 designated as the official presidential aircraft. Wouldnt want to let all that gold go to waste.

Asked by reporters to clarify his tweet, Trump said, Well the plane is totally out of control. It's going to be over $4 billion for [the] Air Force One program. And I think it's ridiculous. I think Boeing is doing a little bit of a number. We want Boeing to make a lot of money, but not that much money."

The verge

boeing better get on board with getting airforce one fueled by brawndo, stat.

Edited December 7, 2016 by smilesammich

[Jacque67 7,328]

[ready4ONE 5,400]

I'm a pilot so I know a little about aviation and airliners.

The cost (sticker price) of a new 747-8 is about $380 million. Mind you, no airline actually pays that, they all negotiate down. So the US government must do so also. The price any airline pays is secret. But lets say they pay $350 million.

They need 2 of them, as AF1 has a twin that flies everywhere it does. (By the way AF1 is not the name of the plane, but a callsign given to ANY plane where the president is on board. So if I were to give him a lift in my plane, I could call ATC as "Air Force 1". That would be awesome. Ok, back to the topic.)

That's $700 million for 2 of them. But those are the generic versions built for airlines. They must be outfitted with a complex encrypted top secret communications system, anti-missile defense system, and other secret defense systems. I could see the price double or even triple on the high end, but 5x as much seems excessive.

Let Airbus get involved and that price will be down fast. Airbuses are more fun to fly anyway. Get him a A380.

Airbus doesn't make planes that are more fun to fly, unless you enjoy the thrill of wondering if this will be the flight their pilotless systems finally cause you to crash. And outsourcing these particular planes is an even worse idea in terms of keeping the high tech defense systems somewhat of a secret.

Otherwise you are likely spot on as to the extra expenses involved in building Airforce 1's. These are not your moms commercial airliners.

[Merle 458]

Boeing has become the same as GM; unions and overpaid workers run the place. They can overcharge because they pretty much have the monopoly on American made airliners. There's a reason their nickname is "The Lazy B" among those in the aerospace industry.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

Liberals are so cute. Trump could cure cancer and the DDS would kick in and the MDL would scream he put oncologist out of work.

What Trump basically said was he wants Boeing to prosper and make lots of money but the days of bottomless pocket books and cost overruns on the tax payers dime is over. How could any sane person find fault with that

Oh yeah and the moon bat lefty that wrote the article

Title-

Trump's Air Force one math doesn't add up

Then goes on to say in paragraph 2

""Yes, the new presidential transports could end up costing $4 billion""

​The MDL is like old faithful.. Predictable but not nearly as spectacular

[smilesammich 10,727]

Liberals are so cute. Trump could cure cancer and the DDS would kick in and the MDL would scream he put oncologist out of work.

What Trump basically said was he wants Boeing to prosper and make lots of money but the days of bottomless pocket books and cost overruns on the tax payers dime is over. How could any sane person find fault with that

Oh yeah and the moon bat lefty that wrote the article

Title-

Trump's Air Force one math doesn't add up

Then goes on to say in paragraph 2

""Yes, the new presidential transports could end up costing $4 billion""

​The MDL is like old faithful.. Predictable but not nearly as spectacular

oh my, look who is reading and quoting from the actual article. kudos for getting past the title, nb. sure hope all the kool aid isn't upsetting your tummy.

[bcking 3,157]

Liberals are so cute. Trump could cure cancer and the DDS would kick in and the MDL would scream he put oncologist out of work.

What Trump basically said was he wants Boeing to prosper and make lots of money but the days of bottomless pocket books and cost overruns on the tax payers dime is over. How could any sane person find fault with that

Oh yeah and the moon bat lefty that wrote the article

Title-

Trump's Air Force one math doesn't add up

Then goes on to say in paragraph 2

""Yes, the new presidential transports could end up costing $4 billion""

​The MDL is like old faithful.. Predictable but not nearly as spectacular

My problem with what Trump said isn't that the numbers don't add up, but I think he may be blaming the wrong people.

Boeing produces the planes. Boeing will be responsible for putting in the "super secret" advancements to make it fit to carry a President. But who really decides the ultimate cost? I feel like it is more an issue with the Pentagon. Maybe there is some tech that they should cut out? The 3-4 billion dollar range, to my knowledge, includes the "R&D" for the tech to put in the plane. It's not like they are going to pay Boeing 3-4 billion dollars just for two planes. So I feel like his tweet should have more been directed at the Pentagon.