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RocketElephant

Which Visa to Apply For?

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Hello to All!

I believe this is where I should have posted to discuss the merits of considering different visas (now that I know about them).

Here's the basic info:

Me: US Citizen, currently living and working in Vietnam (have been for two years).

Her: Fiancee, Vietnamese National, Works as a pharmacist.

Our Situation: We are planning to have a wedding ceremony here in Vietnam. We then wish to go for a honeymoon in the US for about six weeks. She can meet my family and see my hometown. We'd like to go to a football game (Go ASU!!), and also spend some time in Las Vegas. We do not wish to immigrate or relocate to the US. We only wish to go visit.

My original plan was for her to get the B2 Visa. However, upon closer inspection, it appears the B2 visa is nearly impossible for her to get. She isn't wealthy, and doesn't own a home. (In fact, almost ALL Vietnamese children live with their parents until marriage). She makes good money for Vietnam, but it doesn't even come close to comparing what salaries in the US pay. In my opinion, she does not have the requisite "strong ties" documents to qualify for the B2 Visa. To put the nail in the coffin, any relationship and marriage to me will further impede her B2 application because she will be viewed as an intending immigrant.

Linky Here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/541329-wish-to-reside-in-vietnam/page-2#entry7541853

My next plan was to file for the K1 visa. We'd have the marriage ceremony here in Vietnam, then go to the US and have the marriage 'done on paper' at the Justice of the Peace (Court, Magistrate, whatever it's called). The K1 Visa would give us 90 days (More than we need), and we are not obligated to file an AOS and to reside there. However, other members have told me that although the K1 visa is not an 'immigrant' visa, it is indeed intended for immigrant purposes. These users have said that I will have to prove domicile in the US or intent to domicile in the US. While I could use my father's address, I do not want to lie and say that we will live in the US when we will not. *Special Thanks to user 'Cody and Daisy' for their help*

Linky Here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/544429-k1-process-differentiation/

Finally, I have been looking at the comparison of Marriage Visas Here: http://www.visajourney.com/content/compare

It appears the K3 Visa might actually be in our best interest. We could get married here and then apply for the K3 visa and go to the US. The K3 visa is also a multiple entry and for two years. This would be really great because we could come and go to the US for vacation, reside in Vietnam, and ultimately have the option to start the process for the Green Card.

I know *almost* everyone wants to emigrate to the US. If that's what we wanted, the solution would be very easy. We'd just use the K1 visa. However, we only want to go for a short period for pleasure. Then to return to Vietnam. If anybody has been in a similar position, or has any insight on the three options (or another unseen option), please, please, please let me know. I will be forever grateful for any and all advice.

Thank you so much!.

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hi

for visiting the only visa is the tourist visa

K3 is almost obsolete, but it is like the K1 a no immigrant visa for intent of getting a GC. the purpose of a K3 visa is to enter the US to file for a GC

the two years is while living in the US, you have up to 2 years to file for adjustment of status, but you as the USC have to be living in the US and you would bring your wife to immigrate to the US. Instead of going through consular processing, you use the visa K3 for her to enter the country, she cannot leave the US unless you file the adjustment of status packet and get the advance parole

she could remain in the US and you would have up to 2 years as said to file for the GC.

since you are not interested in living in the US and immigrating your future wife, this isn't for you. the only type of non immigrating visa is the tourist visa, just for visiting the country

K1 is the same as K3, only K1 is for fiancé, meaning unmarried and marrying in the US and filing for GC, you cannot marry in another country

K3 is for married couples, but for the same purpose, for immigrating intent, to bring spouse to get a GC and live in the US, it has no use if you don't live in the US

Edited by aleful

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B2 should be your first step.

KISS applies


“If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”

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hi

for visiting the only visa is the tourist visa

K3 is almost obsolete, but it is like the K1 a no immigrant visa for intent of getting a GC. the purpose of a K3 visa is to enter the US to file for a GC

In my reading (and correct me if I'm wrong), but the K3 has been rendered almost obsolete because the CR1 has become so much more effective, that people wouldn't bother with the K3 anymore. I know what the K1 is "intended" for; however, there is no law against me using it to take my fiancee to the US to get married, then come back to the US. I've already been told that this move would not affect her immigration chances in the future. I'm supposing (assuming is terrible, isn't it?) that we could do the same with the K3 visa after we're married. File for the K3, go to the US for a month and a half, then return to Vietnam with more than a year eligibility left on the visa. I know this isn't what it's "intended" for, but I haven't read anything which seems to imply that doing this is fraudulent or illegal.

the two years is while living in the US, you have up to 2 years to file for adjustment of status, but you as the USC have to be living in the US and you would bring your wife to immigrate to the US. Instead of going through consular processing, you use the visa K3 for her to enter the country, she cannot leave the US unless you file the adjustment of status packet and get the advance parole

While I appreciate your reply, what you have written is completely contradictory to what is written here: http://www.visajourney.com/content/compare

This is a quote from the link above:

NO Advance Parole (AP) (unlike a K-1 Visa Holder needs) is required for travel to and from the US while the K-3 Visa is Valid. K3 and K4 visa recipients are in valid status for 2 years and the visa is a multiple re-entry visa.

she could remain in the US and you would have up to 2 years as said to file for the GC.

The Green Card is not super important right now. If the K3 visa applies and seven or eight years down the road we want to immigrate to the US we can do the CR1 and wait the 14 months (or more) in Vietnam for the GC to process.

since you are not interested in living in the US and immigrating your future wife, this isn't for you. the only type of non immigrating visa is the tourist visa, just for visiting the country

K1 is the same as K3, only K1 is for fiancé, meaning unmarried and marrying in the US and filing for GC, you cannot marry in another country

K3 is for married couples, but for the same purpose, for immigrating intent, to bring spouse to get a GC and live in the US, it has no use if you don't live in the US

Frankly, I would love for her to get the B2 visa; however, it appears that she won't be able to demonstrate the 'strong ties' needed to overcome their fear of her illegal immigration. Which is so crazy, because if we wanted to emigrate, that would be legal, affordable, doable, and completely within the realm of possibility.

Imagine having a conversation with Uncle Sam.

Her and I: May we please have a B2 Visa to go visit family in the US?

Uncle Sam: I'm sorry, but you don't have enough 'strong ties' to Vietnam. It appears your strongest ties are to your USC husband. We're afraid that you would overstay your B2 visa and never leave... However, we have at least three different options for you to go to the US and never leave.

Her and I: But that's what you're afraid of in the first place!!!!!!!!

Anyways, I digress.

B2 should be your first step.

KISS applies

I am going to look at the B2 visa more closely. It's quite possible we'll try and apply, and if it's no dice, we'll either go on the K1 or the K3 visa (depending if we do the marriage paperwork in VN or not), and return to Vietnam when our vacation is over.

I know that using the K1 or K3 visas is not 'intended' for this, but I have seriously not read anything (at all) which would prevent us from using it this way. From every document I've read this appears to be legal. Could anyone tell me if I'm missing something?

Edited by RocketElephant

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In my reading (and correct me if I'm wrong), but the K3 has been rendered almost obsolete because the CR1 has become so much more effective, that people wouldn't bother with the K3 anymore. I know what the K1 is "intended" for; however, there is no law against me using it to take my fiancee to the US to get married, then come back to the US. I've already been told that this move would not affect her immigration chances in the future. I'm supposing (assuming is terrible, isn't it?) that we could do the same with the K3 visa after we're married. File for the K3, go to the US for a month and a half, then return to Vietnam with more than a year eligibility left on the visa. I know this isn't what it's "intended" for, but I haven't read anything which seems to imply that doing this is fraudulent or illegal.

The Green Card is not super important right now. If the K3 visa applies and seven or eight years down the road we want to immigrate to the US we can do the CR1 and wait the 14 months (or more) in Vietnam for the GC to process.

Hi

I did put in my quote that the K3 is almost obsolete, very few are approved because it is sent with the i130 and most of the time it is canceled at the NVC level and the i130 continues for the CR1 to proceed for consular processing

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If you marry in Vietnam then you can't use a K-1.


August 2000: We start e-mailing. I'm in Bosnia, she's in Florida

October 29th 2000: She sends me e-mail asking if I would marry her

October 29th 2000(5 seconds later): I say yes

November 2000: She sends me tickets to Orlando for when I get back

December 6th 2000: Return from Bos

December 11th 2000: Fly to Orlando, she meets me at airport

December 22nd 2000: I fly back to UK

January 3rd 2001: She flies to UK (Good times)

Mid February 2001: Pregnancy test Positive

Mid February 2001: She flies back to US

March 2001: Miscarriage, I fly to US on first flight I can get

May 2001: I leave US before my 90 days are up

June 2001: I fly back to US, stopped at airport for questioning as I had only just left

September 2001: Pregnancy test Positive again

September 2001: She falls sick, I make decision to stay to look after her as I am afraid I may have problems getting back in.

April 16th 2002: Our son is born, we start getting stuff together for his passport

March 6th 2003: We leave US for UK as family

Early April 2003: Family troubles make her return to US, I ask Embassy in London about possibilities of returning to US

April 16th 2003: London Embassy informs me that I will be banned from the Visa Waiver Program for 10 years, my little boys first birthday

June 13th 2006: I-129f sent

August 11th 2006: NOA1 Recieved

After our relationship breaks down she admits to me that she had never bothered to start the application process

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K1 as has been said is for marrying in the US, is she OK marrying away from her family.

As has been said K3 is more a theoretical a possibility, in your case akin to winning the lottery.

Remember you need not only US domicile but sponsorship and a lot of filing fees.

Edited by Boiler

“If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”

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I did put in my quote that the K3 is almost obsolete, very few are approved because it is sent with the i130 and most of the time it is canceled at the NVC level and the i130 continues for the CR1 to proceed for consular processing

Now this is indeed some new information for me. Thank you very much. I had assumed (incorrectly, obviously) that the K3 was made obsolete by the more refined CR1 process. I didn't realize that they were also being cancelled in favor of the CR1. This certainly adds a new wrinkle to my plans.

K1 as has been said is for marrying in the US, is she OK marrying away from her family.

We were planning on having a "Celebration Ceremony" here in Vietnam, and doing the legal papers and another ceremony in the US. Would the powers that be look unfavorably if we had dual celebrations? Frankly, she doesn't really want to go to the US. It's me who wants her to go. I have an old grandmother who would never be able to travel out here, not to mention my mother has three young children (my brother and sisters) and for all of them to fly here would be quite expensive (Not to mention, my mother is a super right-winger, and she only sees the world in two colors: 'Murica and Not-'Murica). The only way for my fiancee to meet most of my family is to go to the US. Although we both wish to reside here in Vietnam, it's important to me that they get to meet each other.

As has been said K3 is more a theoretical a possibility, in your case akin to winning the lottery.

Remember you need not only US domicile but sponsorship and a lot of filing fees.

The expense doesn't seem exorbitant. I was expecting about $1500, and here in Vietnam I make almost $3000 a month (Which is MUCH more than I made as a teacher in the US). So I'll qualify for the income requirement. However, I'm still unsure about the domicile requirement. I keep my father's address for all of my US accounts. I have two bank accounts, a 401k, and voter registration that I could use (all linked to my father's address) to show domicile. However, I won't lie on the application. If they are demanding that I declare my intent to resettle in the US in order to give us the K1 visa, well... I won't do it. I'm not going to damage my standing, integrity, or my fiancee's future chances of emigrating to the US. But, I've been told (repeatedly) that the K1 is a non-immigrant visa with immigrant intent. I've also been told to use the visa as a way to go see family in the US and then to leave before AOS is not fradulent.

I know for many of you, my requests seem like salt in the wound. You've had to endure months upon months of agonizing separation, consistent flights, international visits, and waiting. You may feel that I'm trying to gilt the system to have my cake and eat it too. That I should have to go through the same separation, the same process.

I don't want anyone to feel that I'm cheapening their sacrifice; however, there has to be a way for my fiancee and I to visit my family in the US without resorting to immigration. Can it really be immigrate or don't come? I'm not giving up yet, and thank you all for all of your help. I really would be lost without this website.

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You intend using your Vietnamese income to sponsor your fiance to immigrate to the US?

What is a 'Celebration Ceremony'? Anything that suggests a wedding ceremoney should be avoided, if you decide to go this route then have it when you return.


“If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”

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You intend using your Vietnamese income to sponsor your fiance to immigrate to the US?

As previously stated, we don't want to immigrate to the US. At least not now. Maybe five or six years down the road. We would use the K1 visa to go have a wedding ceremony in the US so she can meet my family, and then come back to Vietnam. We would not overstay the 90 days, she would not work, and we would not file for AOS. I'm only considering this because the B2 tourist visa is almost guaranteed to be rejected, and if we get married here in Vietnam, then the K1 route is also forever closed. It really does appear that the government wants us to either emigrate from Vietnam or stay out of the US all together.

What is a 'Celebration Ceremony'? Anything that suggests a wedding ceremoney should be avoided, if you decide to go this route then have it when you return.

Mostly a party to celebrate an upcoming marriage. In the Vietnamese town I live in, it's pretty traditional, and she isn't allowed to live at my house, or go anywhere with me until we have some sort of public gathering for everyone to see that her family approves of our match. It's also illegal for her and I to live together (or share a hotel) without being married. We wouldn't get married on paper, and we would do that after the wedding ceremony in the US.

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it's pretty traditional, and she isn't allowed to live at my house, or go anywhere with me until we have some sort of public gathering for everyone to see that her family approves of our match. It's also illegal for her and I to live together (or share a hotel) without being married.

So you are saying if I go to Vietnam and get a couple girls and travel with them and tour the country it is illegal for them to stay with me in my hotel?

I have been wanting to tour Vietnam for a few years.

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So you are saying if I go to Vietnam and get a couple girls and travel with them and tour the country it is illegal for them to stay with me in my hotel?

I have been wanting to tour Vietnam for a few years.

That is correct. This law is not applied to foreign girls, only Vietnamese girls. Some of the cheaper Nha Nghi (motels) might turn a blind eye. But the nicer hotels certainly won't allow it (unless you purchase two hotel rooms, and only use one). Most of the 'working' girls will have a partnership with a local Nha Nghi where they'll be able to stay the night. Most non-working girls would never leave their family or home towns to tour with a foreigner without a very serious commitment. Although many women might be more progressive in HCMC and the capital, Ha Noi, and might go with you on a vacation if they've spent some time getting to know you.

Vietnam is still a communist country (one of only five left in the world), and they monitor the movements of foreigners and citizens rather closely. Each family has a home 'guestbook', and if anyone comes to stay they must notify their local block leader and police station. Even if the Vietnamese wish to move from one house to another (even in the same town), they must notify their local authorities of where they are going.

It's a lovely country, and the people are truly remarkable. They're of a generous and kindhearted nature that only being truly impoverished brings.

You should certainly come to Vietnam for your next vacation.

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what you are not understanding is that in order for your fiance to get a k-1 you have to sponsor her and be domiciled in the US. It isn't as easy as applying, getting approved and you are on your merry little way. You need to study the guides at the top of the page and understand the difference in visa types and what is required from each. If your fiance has a good job to go back to with proof there is a good chance that she will be approved for a b-2.

And also, so you understand what people mean by not having a "celebration ceremony' Anything that looks or smells like a wedding, even if it isn't registered, is a wedding to USCIS and the consulate. At least once a month we see couples here who are denied for these so-called celebration ceremonies.

A k-3 is only for married people with a pending i-130/cr-1, and they are rarely issued.



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Hello to All!

I believe this is where I should have posted to discuss the merits of considering different visas (now that I know about them).

Here's the basic info:

Me: US Citizen, currently living and working in Vietnam (have been for two years).

Her: Fiancee, Vietnamese National, Works as a pharmacist.

Our Situation: We are planning to have a wedding ceremony here in Vietnam. We then wish to go for a honeymoon in the US for about six weeks. She can meet my family and see my hometown. We'd like to go to a football game (Go ASU!!), and also spend some time in Las Vegas. We do not wish to immigrate or relocate to the US. We only wish to go visit.

My original plan was for her to get the B2 Visa. However, upon closer inspection, it appears the B2 visa is nearly impossible for her to get. She isn't wealthy, and doesn't own a home. (In fact, almost ALL Vietnamese children live with their parents until marriage). She makes good money for Vietnam, but it doesn't even come close to comparing what salaries in the US pay. In my opinion, she does not have the requisite "strong ties" documents to qualify for the B2 Visa. To put the nail in the coffin, any relationship and marriage to me will further impede her B2 application because she will be viewed as an intending immigrant.

Linky Here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/541329-wish-to-reside-in-vietnam/page-2#entry7541853

My next plan was to file for the K1 visa. We'd have the marriage ceremony here in Vietnam, then go to the US and have the marriage 'done on paper' at the Justice of the Peace (Court, Magistrate, whatever it's called). The K1 Visa would give us 90 days (More than we need), and we are not obligated to file an AOS and to reside there. However, other members have told me that although the K1 visa is not an 'immigrant' visa, it is indeed intended for immigrant purposes. These users have said that I will have to prove domicile in the US or intent to domicile in the US. While I could use my father's address, I do not want to lie and say that we will live in the US when we will not. *Special Thanks to user 'Cody and Daisy' for their help*

Linky Here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/544429-k1-process-differentiation/

Finally, I have been looking at the comparison of Marriage Visas Here: http://www.visajourney.com/content/compare

It appears the K3 Visa might actually be in our best interest. We could get married here and then apply for the K3 visa and go to the US. The K3 visa is also a multiple entry and for two years. This would be really great because we could come and go to the US for vacation, reside in Vietnam, and ultimately have the option to start the process for the Green Card.

I know *almost* everyone wants to emigrate to the US. If that's what we wanted, the solution would be very easy. We'd just use the K1 visa. However, we only want to go for a short period for pleasure. Then to return to Vietnam. If anybody has been in a similar position, or has any insight on the three options (or another unseen option), please, please, please let me know. I will be forever grateful for any and all advice.

Thank you so much!.

Not sure why you haven't seen the CR1 visa, that is most likely what you will want. Tourist is impossible for her, k1 probably won't work if you're living in Vietnam. CR1 is the visa route most common for you. I don't think k3 happens very often, I certainly haven't heard about it or read about it on here. I would imagine you have to adjust status also which will make it more expensive I think.

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Not sure why you haven't seen the CR1 visa, that is most likely what you will want. Tourist is impossible for her, k1 probably won't work if you're living in Vietnam. CR1 is the visa route most common for you. I don't think k3 happens very often, I certainly haven't heard about it or read about it on here. I would imagine you have to adjust status also which will make it more expensive I think.

I've seen the CR1 visa, but to my understanding, this visa most certainly is an immigrant visa, and we do not wish to immigrate to the US. Is it possible we could get the CR1 visa, go the US for a short period, then return to the US? Would that affect her chances of immigrating to the US in the future if we didn't stay and settle?

what you are not understanding is that in order for your fiance to get a k-1 you have to sponsor her and be domiciled in the US. It isn't as easy as applying, getting approved and you are on your merry little way. You need to study the guides at the top of the page and understand the difference in visa types and what is required from each. If your fiance has a good job to go back to with proof there is a good chance that she will be approved for a b-2.

Well, the folks over in the B2 visa forum of this website have disagreed with your assessment of her chances of gaining the B2 visa. Having read all of the visa types (and re-read), it appears she will almost certainly be denied the B2 visa. In fact, her association with me further dooms her chances as she is seen as a 'potential immigrant'. Even though we could immigrate via proper channels if we so wished (we don't). She works as a pharmacist here and makes about $400 a month, which is a LOT of money in Vietnam but is paltry when compared to US salaries.

I've read the guides quite extensively, and maybe you haven't read them as closely.... Let me quote for you.

Guide on K1 from Captain Ewok: http://www.visajourney.com/content/k1guide

What is a K-1 Fiance Visa?

A K-1 Visa (also known as a Fiance(e) Visa) is a nonimmigrant visa Visa issued to the fiancé(e) of a United States citizen. The K-1 Visa allows the visa holder to enter the United States for up to 90 days during which time they may get married and file for Adjustment of Status (to become a Legal Permanent Resident of the US). After filing for Adjustment of Status they may reside in the US beyond the 90 day K-1 Visa validity while their Adjustment of Status application is processed. While the K-1 Visa is legally classified as a non-immigrant visa, it usually leads to important immigration benefits and is therefore often processed by the Immigrant Visa section of United States Embassies and Consulates worldwide. If the non US Citizen fiancé(e) has a child (under 21 and unmarried), a K-2 non-immigrant visa may be available to him or her. Be sure to include the names of the children on the I-129F petition.

It says we "may" file for Adjust of Status (AOS), not that we *must* file. It also says that the K1 is legally classified as a non-immigrant visa (we don't want to immigrate), it usually (not always) leads to immigration benefits. I know it is anathema to almost everyone on this forum, but we do not wish to immigrate to the US at this point in our lives.

Another quote from the K1 Guide:

Who is Eligible to File?

U.S. citizens who will be getting married to a foreign national in the United States may petition for a fiancé(e) classification (K-1) for their fiancé(e). You and your fiancé(e) must be free to marry. This means that both of you are unmarried, or that any previous marriages have ended through divorce, annulment or death. You must also have met with your fiancé(e) in person within the last two years prior beginning the K-1 Visa petition process (filing the I-129F). This requirement can be waived only if meeting the non US Citizen's fiancé(e) in person would violate long-established customs, or if it would create extreme hardship on the US Citizen.

It says it is for US citizens (me) who will marry a foreign national (my fiancee). We must be free to marry (we are). We must have met in person within the last two years (double-check that one). There is not one single listed requirement that we *must* immigrate or that I *must* live in the United States. In fact, there is no information pertaining to my particular situation what-so-ever. If the information were there, then I wouldn't be posting and asking for assistance. If this information is not factual, maybe we could petition the forum to update it to be a more accurate representation of what the K1 visa actually is. Are you sure that you went to the top of the page and carefully read every single visa? I did.

You can go re-read another guide here: http://www.visajourney.com/content/compare Which once again does not say that immigration to the US is required to file the K1, only that we are free to marry and I'm a USC and she a foreign national. It says we must file for AOS if she wishes to become LPR (she doesn't). So, if I missed something, if I didn't read carefully enough, if there is an additional link you could provide, that would be great. But I feel I've read quite carefully and it appears we are entirely within the confines of the K1 structure for us to go to the US for a destination wedding. Although, as I said, it's quite possible the information on the VJ guide is wrong.

And also, so you understand what people mean by not having a "celebration ceremony' Anything that looks or smells like a wedding, even if it isn't registered, is a wedding to USCIS and the consulate. At least once a month we see couples here who are denied for these so-called celebration ceremonies.

Duly noted, and thank you for the heads up. This is certainly a factor we'll have to take into account. May I ask how the USCIS or consulate finds out about these shindigs? I'm assuming it's facebook and social networking, am I right?

A k-3 is only for married people with a pending i-130/cr-1, and they are rarely issued.

The guide here: http://www.visajourney.com/content/compare is clearly outdated regarding the K3 visa. As others have said, the K3 is being rejected at the NVC so it appears unlikely we'll go that route.

Thanks again everyone for your feedback and assistance. Certainly the US government wouldn't make us chose between immigrating and never being able to go see my family, right?

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