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Visa denied for supposed false declaration of US citizenship

#16 rebeccajo

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Posted 25 July 2009 - 03:19 PM

QUOTE (esposadetucho @ Jul 25 2009, 06:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Either way you look at it, your wife pretended to be someone she is not. All the info that is posted in response to your OP is accurate. If you don't like the answers you received..... Sorry.


That's just really unnecessary.
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#17 LoveMyTico

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Posted 25 July 2009 - 03:22 PM

QUOTE (rebeccajo @ Jul 25 2009, 04:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (esposadetucho @ Jul 25 2009, 06:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Either way you look at it, your wife pretended to be someone she is not. All the info that is posted in response to your OP is accurate. If you don't like the answers you received..... Sorry.


That's just really unnecessary.



OK REBECCAJO.... good.gif
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Spoiler

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#18 Jaytee2009

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Posted 25 July 2009 - 04:38 PM

The statement of my wife pretending to be someone she is not is an offense that she may have violated, which typically allows for a hardship waiver of a 10 year ban. Of course I don't like the answer (being I feel it was incorrect), but sorry doesn't help.

Yes the only reason my wife left the country was to go to the Visa interview to gain legal admission into the US. She was never forced to leave, had no deportation or order of removal. This was a voluntary move on our part to right wrongs, and to better our life in the long run.

After hearing over and over again that she and other non-immigrants that have not been allowed in the country have no judicial rights, it almost sounds like when an undocumented alien is arrested, they should either immediatly be deported or given a punishment for the crime without any possible defense. --- This is just an additional statement that doesn't really concern me, but it just doesn't make sense that if caught in the country committing a crime, it seems undocumented aliens still have rights, but in the case that they are trying to right a wrong (the crime of entering the US illegally) on their own accord, they don't have any rights after what 1 interviewer decides to do.
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#19 canadian_wife

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Posted 25 July 2009 - 04:44 PM

What about filing an FOIA request to find out under what status your wife entered in when she entered when she was posing as a 16 year old (how old was she by the way?)? If it says she entered under the status of a citizen then it will be very unlikey that she will receive any sympathy from DHS and the lifetime ban will remain. If it comes back as something different, then maybe you can appeal the decision (although like Jim said, posing as a resident is also illegal - I am just not sure of the consequences).

http://www.state.gov/m/a/ips/

Good luck.
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#20 Jaytee2009

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Posted 25 July 2009 - 04:59 PM

Thank you for that link to the FOIA.
She was actually 21 when she came here.
We probably pinpointed the day she came in, but it is possibly off by a couple days. That is something that we probably want to try to research and remember in detail.
The posing as a resident isn't any big deal as far as CIS goes. The law about claiming US citizenship is the thing they get all heated up about.
We are really thinking though in this case that th person that got my wife in the country back then had a connection with the border patrol and that is why the entry was so easy, without her having to give explanations or show documents (though the driver may have).
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#21 baron555

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Posted 25 July 2009 - 05:27 PM

QUOTE (Jaytee2009 @ Jul 25 2009, 04:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The statement of my wife pretending to be someone she is not is an offense that she may have violated, which typically allows for a hardship waiver of a 10 year ban. Of course I don't like the answer (being I feel it was incorrect), but sorry doesn't help.

Yes the only reason my wife left the country was to go to the Visa interview to gain legal admission into the US. She was never forced to leave, had no deportation or order of removal. This was a voluntary move on our part to right wrongs, and to better our life in the long run.

After hearing over and over again that she and other non-immigrants that have not been allowed in the country have no judicial rights, it almost sounds like when an undocumented alien is arrested, they should either immediatly be deported or given a punishment for the crime without any possible defense. --- This is just an additional statement that doesn't really concern me, but it just doesn't make sense that if caught in the country committing a crime, it seems undocumented aliens still have rights, but in the case that they are trying to right a wrong (the crime of entering the US illegally) on their own accord, they don't have any rights after what 1 interviewer decides to do.



You really need an experienced immigration attorney and not us here.

Just because she went back volunterally may not mean anything. You have a complicated case for sure.
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Phil (Lockport, near Chicago) and Alla (Lobnya, near Moscow)

As of Dec 7, 2009, now Zero miles apart (literally)!

#22 JimVaPhuong

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Posted 26 July 2009 - 01:19 AM

QUOTE (Jaytee2009 @ Jul 25 2009, 02:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
After hearing over and over again that she and other non-immigrants that have not been allowed in the country have no judicial rights, it almost sounds like when an undocumented alien is arrested, they should either immediatly be deported or given a punishment for the crime without any possible defense. --- This is just an additional statement that doesn't really concern me, but it just doesn't make sense that if caught in the country committing a crime, it seems undocumented aliens still have rights, but in the case that they are trying to right a wrong (the crime of entering the US illegally) on their own accord, they don't have any rights after what 1 interviewer decides to do.


That might make sense if being denied entry to the US actually constituted a punishment. It doesn't. Nothing changes for them. They were in their home country before they applied, and they remain in their home country afterward. When the CO says "no" they don't put the applicant in jail! The US government is not convicting them of anything. The applicant is asking the US government for a privilege, and the US government is saying "no". I think what has you so upset is the reason they are saying no, and the fact that there is apparently no opportunity for her to ask again for the same privilege again.

And I'm confused why you think the US government should extend any "judicial rights" to a Mexican citizen living in Mexico. Does the Mexican government extend any judicial rights to you, a US citizen living in the United States? The situation might be different if you were actually IN Mexico, just as the situation would be different for your wife if she were actually IN the United States. When an illegal immigrant goes into the office of an immigration lawyer, most of those lawyers will tell them NOT to leave the country. The reason is because they will receive a ban, and will have no legal recourse to appeal it when they're outside the US. Although your wife's situation is not good, she does have YOU in the US to go to court on her behalf.

For the third time, hire a good lawyer.
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#23 justashooter

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 01:28 PM

QUOTE (Jaytee2009 @ Jul 24 2009, 05:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My wife is not guilty of their supposed crime - Even murderers have appeals.


she's guilty of EWI (entry without inspection) in the least. at worst, she is guilty of falsely claiming to be a USC. she was a legal adult when she chose to sneak into the US, and is responsible for her action at the time.

move to mexico if you want to live with her.
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#24 jpaula

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 02:01 PM

QUOTE (justashooter @ Jul 28 2009, 08:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Jaytee2009 @ Jul 24 2009, 05:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My wife is not guilty of their supposed crime - Even murderers have appeals.


she's guilty of EWI (entry without inspection) in the least. at worst, she is guilty of falsely claiming to be a USC. she was a legal adult when she chose to sneak into the US, and is responsible for her action at the time.

move to mexico if you want to live with her.


Unhelpful and flippant response. The point is, if she were found inadmissible for an EWI and overstay, they are both waivable. Furthermore, CDJ has the pilot program and a very high approval rate for such waivers. The problem here, as the OP seems to realize, is the false claim of US citizenship which is not waivable. It is an important distinction and one that may be helpful for others to understand as well as many face it so perhaps we can use this thread to encourage decent info rather than snide comments.
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#25 baron555

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Posted 28 July 2009 - 02:12 PM

QUOTE (jpaula @ Jul 28 2009, 02:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (justashooter @ Jul 28 2009, 08:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Jaytee2009 @ Jul 24 2009, 05:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My wife is not guilty of their supposed crime - Even murderers have appeals.


she's guilty of EWI (entry without inspection) in the least. at worst, she is guilty of falsely claiming to be a USC. she was a legal adult when she chose to sneak into the US, and is responsible for her action at the time.

move to mexico if you want to live with her.


Unhelpful and flippant response. The point is, if she were found inadmissible for an EWI and overstay, they are both waivable. Furthermore, CDJ has the pilot program and a very high approval rate for such waivers. The problem here, as the OP seems to realize, is the false claim of US citizenship which is not waivable. It is an important distinction and one that may be helpful for others to understand as well as many face it so perhaps we can use this thread to encourage decent info rather than snide comments.



I didn't thinkt he comment was unhelpful and flippant. That MAY be the ONLY option left in the end.

The unfortunate part was that they were allowed into the US back then. If they had been stopped and forced to return then this wouldn't have happerned. You may also not have then met your wife. I pray that your appeals are heard.
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Phil (Lockport, near Chicago) and Alla (Lobnya, near Moscow)

As of Dec 7, 2009, now Zero miles apart (literally)!

#26 spookyturtle

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 03:01 AM

Somtimes a waive thru is done at the border, no documents are checked. This still counts as an illegal entry for an undocumented person. In this case, it sounds to me like she admitted at the interview that she claimed to be a citizen when she entered in 2001.
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#27 Milan Kudrak

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Posted 03 August 2009 - 03:30 PM

QUOTE (JimVaPhuong @ Jul 25 2009, 12:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Jaytee2009 @ Jul 24 2009, 11:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Thanks for the responses. Unfortunately, so many people make assumptions about the way things were probably done, and what the laws probably say.

A US citizen can be a parent to a US legal resident. Ex 1. If the child was born abroad and a certificate of citizenship was not issued, but they became a perm legal resident. Ex 2. The whole family was perm legal residents and the parent became a citizen but the child didn't yet. Ex 3. It is a stepmom.

Yes the statement in the Visa interview is sworn. The basis of the decision though was mearly hearsay and the declaration my wife gave in the interview did not include her ever saying she had claimed to be a "US citizen" as the visa interviewer tried to ask her.

I have thought as one of the many possibilities about saving money and moving to Mexico, but I can't bear thinking of that much time being away from my family.


This isn't what you said in your original post. You didn't say she claimed to be an LPR (though this is also illegal). You said "resident of a citizen mom". In fact, you said it twice. There is no such legal status as "resident of a US citizen".

Today, every US citizen, including children, would need a passport or other legal travel document to enter the US. The rules were different in 2001. A US citizen did not need to prove their citizenship in order to cross the border. They only needed to show identification that proved they resided in the US, and declare that they were citizens. Minor children of US citizens could enter without identification if they were with a parent. You said that only the driver showed any documentation, so this is obviously the method which the CO suspects your wife used to enter. The questions the CO asked were intended to get your wife to admit that this was the method used to gain entry, and not necessarily to get your wife to admit that she claimed to be a US citizen. Being guilty of posing as a US citizen would not require your wife to have actually said anything to the CBP officer.

"Hearsay" is when someone makes a statement about something which was said by somebody else. In other words, something they "hear" somebody else "say". It sounds like the CO's decision was based on a statement your wife said, even after significant prodding by the CO, and not a statement she claimed she heard someone else say.

Your arguments, while well intentioned and sincere, don't change the fact that your wife was in the back seat of that car posing to be a 16 year old US citizen daughter of a US citizen parent. If she had been posing as the LPR daughter of a US citizen parent (which, as you point out, is technically possible - and still illegal) then she would have been required to present her green card, or her "mother" would have been required to present it on her behalf. It's very unlikely she would have gotten into the US without identification unless she was posing as a US citizen minor child traveling with her parent. Whether she knew at the time that she was doing this is irrelevant. Whether she admitted to the CO that she knowingly did this is irrelevant. What the CO was trying to confirm was whether this was, in fact, the method used to gain entry into the US. The fact that you don't believe your wife actually admitted that she claimed to be a US citizen to the CO doesn't change the fact that this is how she got across the border.

Due process does not apply here because nobody's rights have been violated. Your wife, who has no legal status in the United States, asked the US government to grant her a privilege, and they denied it. She has no legal access to the US judicial system, so she has no recourse. However, YOU are a US citizen. YOU can take this to court. Get a good lawyer.


Well said JimVa Phuong. You are absolutely right.
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#28 godfrey

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Posted 05 August 2009 - 12:41 AM

Going back to mexico was big mistake if she came here illegally,i wish you all the best
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#29 sachinky

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Posted 26 October 2009 - 01:36 PM

Did anything happen with this case?
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03/27/2009: Engaged in Ithaca, New York.
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#30 luv2uallday

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Posted 14 November 2009 - 11:14 AM

QUOTE (Jaytee2009 @ Jul 24 2009, 03:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Please help anyone that knows anything about this or the process to fix it.
This being my first post here, I hope it isn't too long. I have asked a lot of people and am trying everywhere for an answer. Feel free to ask me questions or clarification as the only thing I really want is my family here with me, like normal people have.

I am a US citizen. I'm 26. My wife is 28. We have 2 children and have been married for over 6 years. Currently they are in Mexico staying with a relative until this situation is worked out. I had only been out of the country once before the trip to get my wife's visa in Juarez - I really can't just go live there. I have 2 jobs and a business here, one of them in the government. Unfortunately, my wife came here illegally in a car in 2001 not knowing english. She was in the back seat posing to be 16 years old, the resident of a citizen mom who was driving. Her 2 younger sisters were also there in the car.

We knew that if the visa was approved, we would need to file a hardship waiver. That was all ready until my wife came out of the Consulate and told me she was denied. Section 212(a)(6)(ii) ... when I read this, it was like I fell off the planet.

The unfortunate part is that we had a lawyer with 30 years experience who gave us no forwarning to this possibility or of her needing to have found out the details of certain things before going into the interview and having to answer "I don't know" to one of their questions.

At the visa interview last week, she was asked how she got to the US. She explained how and everything. She said the only thing she said to get across the border to the border patrol was something with the word citizen in it. The consulate official then asked her if she had said "US citizen" and my wife responded that she didn't know. So she got a denial with no possible waiver.

We consulted with here middle sister who was in the car and 15 years old when they came over together. She remembered that they claimed to be residents of a citizen mom. They never touched or saw documents. The didn't get stopped or interviewed at the border. This sister is willing to write a notarized affidavit, risking deportiation. She was in the car at the time of the supposed violation. As far as the probable situation of her coming in as a citizen with no documents, I assume that since she claimed to be a resident, that the coyote driving (her mom supposedly) showed some documents, but my wife didn't see them or pay attention to them as it wasn't really her issue as she posed as a minor, they probably weren't going to question her.

Now I am trying to see if there is a motion, appeal or other waiver that is possible. I have been told no by the Visa information line. It seems that until laws change, there is never in my wife's life going to be a chance she can come in the US. I have only been told by the visa call line that there isn't any reversal. I don't understand this. If it is really true that there are no motions, appeals or waivers, then this isn't a democracy. Who governs the government? This is why we have a 3 part government - legislative cannot enforce and police cannot make laws - there is always a court above the last court. It seems as if these interviewers are the judge, jury and excecutioner. The issue is that I am not looking for a waiver. I am specifically stating that this interviewer speculated based on the lack of information available during the interview on the part of my wife. The issue was the judgement of this interviewer. My wife is not guilty of their supposed crime - Even murderers have appeals.

I feel like the country is guilty of treason against me. The penalty for treason I believe is death. ...And that is about how I feel about a country that will force the seperation of a young family with 2 kids. This country is dead to me. If this isn't resolved, my life is over. People say marriage, divorce and buying a house are the most stressful and biggest things that happen in a life. They haven't even fathomed anything like the forced seperation (similar to divoce) or forced move (into a poverished country where a very white american like me can't even think about working in a decent paying career).

PLEAS HELP. I am being destroyed and have never felt this unstable or cried this much in my life.


Unfortunately, people are right. There is no waiver or ways to reverse this decision. save one. A private bill submitted in congress by your representative and voted yes for can grant your wife a reprieve. BUT those are rare and for extenuating curcumstances. You can try but write to your rep and senator. see what happens.

You may also both can plan to move to canada. You two can have a nice life there. That's an option. Again I'm sorry for what has happened. But the crimes of yesterday can change your life today. it is what it is. I just wish it wasn't this and a better world but it's not.

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