Hi all, I have a quick question about the I-864 form.

First, here is my situation. Last year (2006) my wage was $18,815 (due to being unemployed). I have to sponsor my wife and my coming child, so I have to meet the $21,462 guideline.

Now the questions. How much minimum does my co-sponsor need to be making in order to be able to co-sponsor?

The friend who is co-sponsoring us made over $70k last year. He was employed this year up till August, and since then he has been unemployed. Would that effect anything? Would it be ok if he made a certain amount of money from January to August? If so, how much minimum?

Thanks for reading my questions and thank you in advance for your help. -Jas

Are you employed NOW? and if so what is your income NOW?

Yep, let's take this one step at a time. The sponsor you mention has no income. They need income enough to meet the 125% poverty guideline for their own household plus the intending immigrant. Currently unemployed will not cut it, if it comes to light.

It is far better for you to be the sponsor. Perhaps your current income is sufficient, even if 2006 wasn't. Or just get a second job so it is.

Well my current income is $65,000. I had mentioned that and provided all the proof's for that. However, the counslor did not care about that and concentrated on the 2006 only.

Did they say you needed a sponsor? Or were they just looking for last years tax return?

It's typical for the consulate in India to request copies of the 1040.

Well I had supplied my 1040's. They said I need to do a co-sponsor and fill out I-864.

So she had the interview and the CO stated this? Did he confirm it with anyone else?

Were you there?

It's difficult to help you without a more complete picture of what is going on. If your current income is sufficient, they really should approve the visa.

Please tell us what happened at the interview as completely as possible. Also, when did you start your current job and what evidence of income did you show? I know you said "all" but I don't know what that means. We need a decent picture of the circumstances to give meaningful advice. The Consular Officer saw the whole picture. We haven't.

Where do things stand now, exactly. What was requested? Did you receive a blue slip? What did is say?

I also don't get why a Consular Officer would request an I-864 instead of I-134 for a K visa. It's actually not allowed to do so.

Hi, I know you are the Guru at this. You have helped me in the past also. So here goes...

We had our interview today. After speaking to the Indian gentleman first, my wife was called up in front of the US Counselor. The gentleman asked her to take an oath and took finger prints. He went thru the various papers we had submited and after about 5 minutes he said everything looks good, except he needs an I-864. He said that for my 2006 they cannot use the unemployement as income. Please take a look at my 2006 tax return figures below. For my current, I am working 2 jobs. One job I am getting $30k and the other 35k. I submitted I-134 with Employment Verifications for both jobs and included 3-4 recent pay stubs for both them. I also included a letter from my bank manager and my balance in my checking showing over $5k.

He also said that we cannot go by the $17,112 requirement since my wife is 8 months pregnant and we have to go by the one for 2 people at $21,462. If you look at my wages for 2006 below, you can see that I still would have been able to sponsor my wife with my wages...however he put a wrench in with the requirement for 2 instead of 1. How can they count 2 extra people where there is only physically 1? In the end he handed over a letter which asks us to get a co-sponsor and fill out I-864.


Wages: $18,815
Unemployment: $13,025
Gross Income: $31,840
Taxable Income: $23,390

Anyhow, that is all that I think you might need in order to get the whole picture. Let me know if you need anything else.

PS I was there with her for the interview.

One thing more: Your profile indicates K-3, so why are we talking about I-864? K-3 uses I-134 at the consulate for the visa.

K-Visas use I-134.

I-864 is for Green-Cards, either through an immigrant visa (IR-1 CR-1) or adjusting status in the USA (I-485).

From: 9 FAM 41.81 N4 DOCUMENTARY REQUIREMENTS (The foreign Affairs Manual used by all consulates)
http://foia.state.gov/masterdocs/09fam/0941081N.pdf

The only reason I would see an I-864 being used in a K-3 case is when the CR-1 (I-130) reaches the consulate shortly after the K-3, and the consulate dropping the K-3 in favor of the CR-1.

Jas -

India has some unique requirements regarding financial support that neither pshbrk nor I are that familiar with.

You might want to research this consulate a bit for familiar issues.

I do think some of the CO's requests are odd and that is why I asked you if he confirmed them with any of his peers or a supervisor.



Because the CO asked him for it.

I bolded the portions of my original answer that you didn't completely address. Please look at any paperwork the CO gave you and make certain it actually says I-864. Consulates are forbidden to use those for K visas because they are a binding contract with the sponsor. By the time you adjust status, you current employment will qualify you as the sponsor (I think it does now too.) so you would be the only person needing to be on the contractual hook.

If indeed, they are going to want the second sponsor then an unemployed sponsor can't state in the present tense that their income of X is derived from occupation Y. so won't qualify. You'll need a qualifying sponsor, if you can't get them to accept you. That's why I asked how long you've been on your current job(s). What are the jobs, by the way. That could be an issue too.

You think I should go in tomorrow to the embassy and question it? Should I go and try to speak to a supervisor and ask why I am being asked for a I-864 when I already filled in a I-134 as required. Also if I am sponsoring my wife and my wages for 2006 are over $18k and for 2007 are 65k, why am I being asked to get a co-sponsor? What do you think? In the mean time I am getting my co-sponsor to sign the docs and he will courier them over to me today and then I can go with that I-864 on Monday to the embassy....

I'm not sure I agree with pushbrk's ascertation that the consulate cannot ask you for the I864. But I do agree with him that what they want should be in writing.

I also agree with him that an unemployed sponsor doesn't cut it. That's material misrepresentation.

Should you go to the consulate for clarification? I don't know. Didn't they give you something in writing as to what they specifically want?

I wouldn't go so far as to say that India makes up the rules as they go along, but I do know (from my readings) that they sometimes request information other consulates don't.

Hi, here is the letter:

Are you sure you are being processed for K3?

when did you start your current job

I started my 30k job in January

Where do things stand now, exactly. What was requested? Did you receive a blue slip? What did is say?

Please see the image file in the above post. No blue slip, just the document in the image above. Thanks

Thinking the same, sometimes the CR-1 case reaches the consulate shortly after the K-3, and the consulate will toss the K-3 and interview for a CR-1 visa, an this requires I-864.

From what I know, yes...My interview letter says "Preference Category: K3 - IND"

Oops, the image went into the first page...here it is again...thanks

Still not correct in using I-864 for a K-3.

PER US Consulate Chennai
http://chennai.usconsulate.gov/fiance/fiancee_visas.html (Page applies to all K-Visas)

Yes, it's better but it is only one of the items still not answered. I think they gave you the wrong form and that they will accept an I-134 instead but yes, I would go into the Consulate, if possible and clarify whether they are really requiring an I-864 for a K visa. Note: the blue slip indicates the "I-864" you submitted didn't meet the requirements but you didn't submit an I-864. You submitted an I-134.

The image file is of a blue slip. If you showed evidence of year to date income, you should have been fine. I would definitely get back in there and challenge this, if possible. They may not let you do anything other than what they've requested but I-864 is definitely WRONG for a K3 visa.

It might look like a blue colored doc on here, but it's a pure white paper. I took a pic with my digital and uploaded it so it looks a little blueish. However, I do agree. It seems that the I-864 is wrong for a K-3 Visa. I did submit an I-134 but they gave me this in return. I am going to go to the embassy tomorrow.

Will this help you agree?

9 FAM 41.81 N4 DOCUMENTARY REQUIREMENTS

b. K-1 and K-3 applicants are subject to INA 212(a)(4) and must demonstrate to the consular officer's satisfaction that they will not become a public charge. The Form I-864, Affidavit of Support Under Section 213 A of the Act cannot be required. Applicants may submit a letter from the petitioner's employer or evidence that they will be self-supporting. The Form I-134, Affidavit of Support, may be required when the consular officer deems it useful.

Oh, I wasn't disagreeing with you in principal. The FAM (as you illustrate here) is clear.

Long through the years on VJ there have been members who have maintained some consulates require the I864 for the K visas. And it's been bandied about a lot as to whether or not they really do - or can.

You and I both know the CO can ask for whatever they like. They maybe SHOULDN'T, but they can try. Thus my comment.

Treat the I-134 like a mini I-864 and use the same financial evidence.

In our case this what the I-134 included.

• I-134 signed and notarized.
  
• SIMPLE Tax transcripts from the IRS for past 3 years, (Redundant for the (1040,W2,1099) but are free from the IRS http://www.irs.gov/faqs/faq1-6.html
  
• Photo copy of IRS form 1040, and W2s for past 3 years (Not necessary if you provide the transcripts)
  
• Letter from my employer stating annual salary, job responsibility, and that is full time, on company letterhead.
  
• Photo copies of past month or so of pay stubs up to a few weeks before the interview.

The employer letter, and recent pay stubs ar to establish current income.

Yeah, we're on the same page. Another thing you said, I want to stress again and explain why we're right.

A currently unemployed sponsor cannot truthfully say they now earn the money shown on last year's tax return. So, for the unemployed sponsor to say, "23. My current individual annual income is: (whatever is shown on last year's taxes)" could become problematic.

That said, if it was my wife and I lost my job a month before she needed an affidavit of support, I might do exactly that but on an I-134 (for K3) not the legally binding I-864.

That's why I'm suggesting the OP do all in their power to get approved based on their own income which, as stated, is abundantly sufficient.

i agree with pusbrk. delhi embassy just gave you the wrong form. they don't need I-1864 for the K-3.

can't u let them know that the baby is not due till january...so your household size is just 2 for now. by the time the baby is born you will file for AOS, and submit the I-1864 with a co-sponsor.

Hi, all. I went to the embassy today. I spoke with a guy over there, who said that I-864 can be submitted, but an I-134 is what is required from my co-sponsor.

So basically, I still need to have a co-sponsor and have them either sign and fill a I-864 or I134. They would not oversee the unemployment and they are counting as if the baby is born and I have to support him/her also. So I would need to follow the $21k Poverty. If I only had to sponsor my wife then the $17k would have been fine, since my $18k wages for 2006 would have covered it.

Also, he did not care that I have a $65k income for this year...I even took supporting evidence of facts like:
Section 213A Act which states "If you are currently employed and have an individual income which meets or exceeds 125 percent of the Federal poverty line for your household size, you do not need to list the income of any other person."

I also had the 9 FAM 41.81 N4 Documentary Requirements.

However, he refused to even see these things and said that there is not point of arguing. He said it's best to do whatever the CO said.

Well what can I do. I have already had 2 people co-sponsor me and they mailed out the stuff by courier to me today. I should have the docs by Monday for I-864 that I will submit. I cannot go thru with the I-134 now...since I will again have my co-sponsors sign and send those out...and they won't get here till Tuesday or Wednesday and my wife is flying on Friday the 9th....so it's probably best for me to just stick with the I-864 now...and submit and hope things work out.

By no means am I angry at the people at the consulate...however I am just stressed out because of my wife being pregnant. I just want to be there to see my first baby being born.

Well.....that's India for you. What a pain.

What was the position of the gentleman you spoke with? Do you know?

Of course you're stressed out. Anybody would be. I really hope things get sorted for you and your wife soon.

Yeah, thanks for your help all....

Now I am waiting for the docs to get here from USA and then I will go to the embassy directly to submit rather then the VFS office. A lady told me I can do that in my case, however the last guy I spoke to yesterday said they won't accept them...and the papers will take longer to process then my flight date

Hey one more question. I have a co-sponsor who has signed the I-864, however he is a business owner so he has used his business name and showed the company taxs rather then personal, would that work?

Also as a backup plan, if I wanted to get another co-sponsor. What would I need to do for a I-134 with a co-sponsor?

Please stop asking the same question in multiple threads. A person is a sponsor for family visas.

Thank you all for your help. I just wanted to inform you all that my wife's VISA was finally Approved!!!

Thank you all for your help, as this wouldn't have been possible without you all. I especially want to thank the following people:

pushbrk
neel06
rebeccajo
Jigi
Nutty
trailmix
lennon
kim-786
jasman0717
dimp123
nimble
chakaas
Urge To Race
ras001
archie07
pbgirl
C and J
wahrania
maya62
albden
ohioindian
Erika's husband
AnneiyAndJacky

Thanks to everyone else also that I forgot to mention

Congrats again!!

Well, that's really good news. Glad to hear it.