Interesting blog I found. Especially regarding the first two questions.
http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/10things/?p=229 (Illegal Job Interview Questions)


My husband said he had been on here and found that some people were getting turned down upon hearing that they were not from the US. Especially when showing their Greencard or EAD card. From my understanding, if not for security purposes, this is illegal!!

Anyone have any say on this or having an articles or other blogs stating a legal immigrants right to work?

It seems some companies are asking the "Illegal Questions" and then discriminating against people.
What should a person do if faced with this? (besides the fact that they may not want to work there anyway if they are such idiots anyway).

(Sorry if this topic has already been started. I couldn't find anything in the search. Thought it would be a great topic to bring up. (BTW.. T-Mobile is a GREAT company to try for as they have no problem with Greencards!))


PS. Remember some companies CAN ask for only US Citizens due to security purposes. Makes sense...

ALSO POSTED UNDER "MOVING HERE & YOUR NEW LIFE IN AMERICA"

Interesting blog I found. Especially regarding the first two questions.
http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/10things/?p=229 (Illegal Job Interview Questions)


My husband said he had been on here and found that some people were getting turned down upon hearing that they were not from the US. Especially when showing their Greencard or EAD card. From my understanding, if not for security purposes, this is illegal!!

Anyone have any say on this or having an articles or other blogs stating a legal immigrants right to work?

It seems some companies are asking the "Illegal Questions" and then discriminating against people.
What should a person do if faced with this? (besides the fact that they may not want to work there anyway if they are such idiots anyway).

(Sorry if this topic has already been started. I couldn't find anything in the search. Thought it would be a great topic to bring up. (BTW.. T-Mobile is a GREAT company to try for as they have no problem with Greencards!))


PS. Remember some companies CAN ask for only US Citizens due to security purposes. Makes sense...

"The anti-discrimination provision of the Immigration Reform and Control Act provides that an employer cannot discriminate because an applicant is not a U.S. citizen. Therefore, the applicant cannot be asked question about nationality at the time of the interview or on a job application." http://www.mypersonnelfile.com/hi_interview.php

Admin: Please feel free to combine with my other post and place in the correct forum. I didn't know which forum to put it under. Thanks!

http://www.lectlaw.com/files/emp34.htm

"Under IRCA, when hiring, discharging, or recruiting or referring for
a fee, employers with four or more employees may not:

- Discriminate because of national origin against U.S. citizens, U.S.
nationals, and authorized aliens. (Employers of 15 or more employees
should note that the ban on national origin discrimination against
any individual under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964
continues to apply.)

- Discriminate because of citizenship status against U.S. citizens,
U.S. nationals, and the following classes of aliens with work
authorization: permanent residents, temporary residents (that is,
individuals who have gone through the legalization program),
refugees, and asylees.

Employers can demonstrate compliance with the law by following the
verification (I-9 Form) requirements and treating all new hires the
same. This includes the following steps:

- Establish a policy of hiring only individuals who are authorized to
work. A "U.S. citizens only" policy in hiring is illegal. An
employer may require U.S. citizenship for a particular job only if it
is required by federal, state, or local law, or by government
contract."

Stop bleating and get on with it, if you dont want to be here then go back

^ winner of the Most Helpful and Understanding Post Award ^TM

Hey this is the country of free speech ya?

Unfortunately this happens all the time, especially if the applicant has an accent. It's totally unfair and illegal but it still happens. It also happens against women and all we can do is raise hell about it. Will it get something accomplished? Probably not, employers will do whatever they want.


Diana

Happens all the time. They are allowed to ask if you can legally work in the US and ask for proof of that fact. By showing proof you can work it sort of gives away you are not a US citizen.

My experience was being offered a job that made no mention of a requirement to be a US citizen. Then being ask if I was as it needed security clearance, told I couldn't be offered the job as only US citizens could get security clearance. When I said in my previous job in England I had both UK and US security clearance and the US one was still current and to a much higher level than they required and I was able to prove this they insisted the job was only for US citizens. I smile when six months later I see they still advertising the job.

Other than that in my line of work all I seem to be given interviews for were jobs paying about $9 where one of the requirements states the ability to speak reasonable English is desirable. No thanks I'd rather get paid nothing and do what I do now a volunteer blood courier for the American Red Cross, at least they treat me with respect.

that's what I was exercising; you got a problem with that?

Hey I just thought it was a good topic to bring up.... Chill out ...

I thought people should be aware of their rights as it was brought up in another forum that someone was rejected due to the fact their "insurance company" couldn't cover non citizens or something like that.... LEGAL immigrants should have the ability to get jobs and not be shunned just because they have a different accent. (btw, I'm the american born)
Right now, the main thing the US wants our new immigrants to do is learn the language (if they haven't already) and work! If people are being told they can't work because they are not from the US than how can immigrants contribute to the USA and truly become "Americans"? (I also understand those immigrants -wives OR husbands- that don't work due to there spouse making enough money, I don't mean to make them sound any less american--just making the point about those that want to & need to work).

blue, I am as chilled as the proverbial cucumber; the above is a JOKE (see the smilies? they indicate my mood )

I think she was referring to KTMMAN.

yeah, even if they don't openly admit they'd rather hire a US citizen than a legal immigrant, how can you know if that's not the case?

I've been applying for tons of jobs that I'm prefectly capable of doing since I got my EAD and haven't had any replies. I'm also wondering if the fact that all my work references are abroad is a deterrent since employers probably don't want to bother having to contact a company/supervisor in a foreign country.

How do you know that is the case?

The truth is that employers rarely get caught red handed discriminating against any applicant for any reason. Employment in the USA is mostly "at will". Meaning that employees can be hired and fired as necessary. There are all kinds of laws against discrimination, but such charges are very difficult to prove unless the guilty confess or a disgruntled employee reports them with evidence.

From my experience I see quite a lot of foreigners working in the USA, so I don't believe discrimination against foreigners is a widespread and common problem.

Just because someone applies for a job doesn't mean they will get it. I have applied for many jobs in my lifetime that I was qualified for, but did not get. I never knew why I wasn't hired. And I'm an American born citizen. That's the breaks.

When I received my GC, I too applied for a number of positions without any success. I listed my nationality on my resume which is more common in the UK, and I do believe this hindered my applications. I actually visited a recruiter who had the gaul to tell me that employers might think I couldn't spell properly, seeing as I was British. I got a little angry and told her that my country invented the language so I had a head start there. I'm sure there are great employers here in the US who have a very open policy when it comes to recruitment, as it should be. I actually work with two Brits now, quite by accident, but very enjoyable.

Well, you couldn't spell "gall", so maybe the recruiter was right after all?

I’ve absolutely no doubt that discrimination based on not being a citizen is alive and well out there, some obvious and other’s not quite so obvious.

I applied for a ton of jobs after I for my GC and the first thing I noticed is that it’s hard if not near impossible to end up not working for close to minimum wedge to start out. It felt like no one here wanted to touch me when it came to jobs. I was an IT person back home, qualified about 5.5 years experience on the job and all I got was an interview that centered on my not being an American and about my citizenship and if it could pose problems?

It’s annoying, frustrating and very difficult to find a first job over here. I think I was discriminated against because I didn’t have any US job history at all, I wasn’t a citizen and not many places wanted to waste their time…

I did eventually get a job; not a job in my field but it’ll do. I was very lucky I started at almost double minimum wedge. I got promoted 6 months in. Almost a year later and I can’t wait to get out and back into what I did back home.

*waves to Aidan*

But this a website and the law of free speech does not apply, especially if said website is not based in the USA. Members here must refer to the TOS of VJ and that states that you should not make comments in a Post either direct or implied toward another member that are purposely designed to upset, antagonize, make fun of, belittle, or otherwise instigate an argument that takes away from the personal enjoyment of the Service by other users.

Telling someone if they don't like it then they should leave is not nice, is it?

Everyone has different experiences. My husband is from India and is working at his second job in the US, a well paying job. He hasn't had any problems.

Well I pray my fiance doesnt have any problems

Um, if it is not legal to discriminate against non-USC's, then why does the US govt specify that someone must be a USC for many of their job openings?

www.usajobs.gov

Also, TSA is advertising in our area and specifies USC's or US Nationals. What is a US National?

Thanks,

Maya

And don't get me started on the whole evolution of language and the UK did not "invent" the language we speak today.

And the Americans didn't "invent" the English they speak today either.

GUH!

This job market is complex and quite competitive. First thing you should do is to learn to sell yourself as successful americans (degree'd or not) do. Forget your home country resume formats. This is not your country. Read Resumes that knock 'em dead and Cover letters that knock 'em dead. Work on your resume before tossing it out from a plane.

I hate wasting my time, thats why when I get contacted for a job first thing I ask is, Is there a citizenship requirement? Have you noticed my experience is related to this or that and not to this specific sector/area? Sometimes people get confused. I do want to work, I just don't want me or them wasting our time.

Don't even think about discrimination, get yourself a winner attitude. Noone will be convinced on how valuable you are if you are not convinced either. Don't get scared by comments, ask as straight as you can what are the problems and offer reasons why they are not problems. Reference your strengths there where your interviewer is pointing out a weakness. If finally you don't get the job, ask for feedback. You have to learn something from that experience.

I hope this helps someone here.

Best luck

Jess

Of course I'm not expecting to get contacted or hired at the first place I applied at, and I expect lots of rejections before I get a job. I'm just surprised that I haven't even been invited to interviews at any of them.
Some might not find my qualifications to their needs, but I wonder, if references and proof of past experience are a must in applications (as seems to be the case) how many employers would be willing to call a foreign country to speak to a past supervisor?

I think in a way it's natural that people will go to the easy option and hire a national instead of a foreigner.

I guess the hardest is getting the foot in, and once you get a first job, the rest will come easier. So good luck to us all on the hunt!

ha lol - you got me there. My deefense however is that I woz very tyred when I tiped that post !!

I was simply annoyed with the recruiter, and was lashing out. I wasn't rewriting history. My understanding, and I could be very wrong, is that the English language is of German origin, dating back to around the fifth or sixth century AD.

I guess if you show up at the interview wearing a turban and some ugly beard, and have never shaved in your life, then they may have a point.

Or if you show up with all kinds of body piercings and tatoos, which may be appropriate in your country, that you probably wont get the job.

If you have trouble with English and you have been here for 10 years, then I guess you may have a problem.

If your culture is to never take a shower, or only bathe once a year, then you may have a problem.

If you dont assimilate the culture and the standards of grooming here, then you may have a problem.

If you smell like a goat, then you may have a problem.

Or if you have a huge chip on your shoulder you may have a problem.

I guess I am just lucky to get the job (in the same field and industry as my previous work in my home country) on my first try. So far, my co-workers and the HR are very welcoming and professional. As far as the interview & legal presence are concerned, the HR and the interviewing panel did ask me if I have acquired security clearance in the States and if I am authorized to work here. I was expecting the "illegal questions" as I was prepared to rebut them but the company knew their business very well and respects diversity. Science & Eng'g. is more lenient of diversity.

A positive attitude does accentuate a well-structured resume. Good luck!

Aw.......Mike was making a funny I think.......

Mark spent some of his time on visits here ( before we filed), looking up potential employers here and contacting/visiting them.
He kept in contact with a couple of them whilst he was still in Holland and every time he visited me.

He took pictures of projects he had completed in Holland to show the potential employers what exactly he was doing there; gathered references,and when he finally got his visa approved and his GC he started work straight away doing basically the same job in the same field as he did in Holland. He is doing very well, and I am so very proud of him.

He told me he has not come upon any "discrimination" per se- just lots of curiosity;mostly it's been all positive for him.

Yes, it's West Germanic, and originally there were two forms, Anglo-Saxon, and Anglo-German, which mixed (but was never a truly mixed language). There also became some Scandinavian influence, from close relations with the Scandinavians, and English really became a "borrowing" language (there are Latin influences as well).

But Old English is practically unrecognizable to us today (as in, I'd need a legend to decipher it).

I just get annoyed by that perception of certain people that the language "belongs" to a certain country and that they "invented" it. Language evolves - Spanish spoke in Spain is very different from that spoken in South America, the same goes for Portuguese in Brazil and Portgual. And English in different countries as well, and neither form is more valid than another - they have just evolved from the same common origin. And I'm sure you know all that, but it's a battle in all languages that have spead to different areas of the world. And it's one of my soapboxes.

The Fox always had a way with words.

A bit OT, but sort of related... Jinky had an interview at JC Penny's today and was told that she was hired, pending a background check. What exactly are they going to check her background for? To make sure she hasn't had any convictions in the 7 months that she's been in America?

My wife was already working at the Catholic school in our neighborhood for over a year and she came home with a paper to sign giving the school the right run a background check on her to investigate if she was a sexual predator. And they made her pay for it! I was livid. They wanted this background check, but they wanted her to pay for it or she loses her job? I told her to do what she wanted, but if it were me...I'd tell them to "go to hell". I had no problem with the background check, but I thought it was utterly sh*tty for them to demand she pay for it. She paid and stayed.

Too bad the Catholic church hasn't been as aggressive in screening their pervert priests that have cost the parishioners millions of $$$ in settlements.

she had to pay for the background check? that's fukced up man..


Steven.. all retail stores do background checks, independently of it the employee is USC or furriner.. as a matter of fact, retail stores make background checks, credit checks, and drug tests.. the shack does that even with the temporary xmas people.. again, for security, they won't hire someone with shoplifting, or with bad credit either..

JCPenney started doing background checks around November of 2004, shortly after I was hired (worked there 2 years and missed having to undergo a background check). It's on all employees, and yes, that's what they're going to do.

Which is kind of funny, because I worked with a girl there who'd been caught stealing from the register at Bath and Body Works but B&BW never pressed charges...so she worked the register in the men's department.

I had bad credit and they hired me Then they gave me a credit card!

I know JCPenney does NOT do drug tests.

I was going to say that if a company won't hire someone with a poor credit score, that's discrimination. I understand the logic behind screening applicants with bad credit, but it's taking information that is private and using it for a different purpose than its original intent.

the shack does it.. and, you have to sign a consent form that they're checking your credit.. besides they don't mind a poor credit score or no score.. they care about BAD credit score, which is not the same.. the logic I think is that if you have a gazillion of unpaid cards, and collection agencies bills and stuff, means you're not enough responsible for a job.. which I think is kinda reasonable... also they mainly use it to catch an applicant lying..

They can ask what languages you speak, and this usually tells them where you are from...

you have a good point, but the thing that would have annoyed me in the interview that was mentioned is the use of 'properly'... as soon as something is said that implies one is 'right' and another 'wrong' it's a problem; why can't we use more neutral language about such things?
and as an English and language teacher for more than twelve years, it's one of my soapboxes too

What about driving record (other than jobs that require you to drive)? Voting record? Income tax forms? Hospitalization records? Medical prescription records? These are private information, separate and unique records for their various purposes, yet if collected on a single applicant by a potential employer could give a more descriptive evaluation of an applicant. Do you see what I mean? One could logically reason a benefit to employers by collecting such information, but my concern is that if the information is private and unless something like a clean driving record is required for the job, should remain private. Otherwise, a Right to Privacy is pretty much meaningless.

All three jobs I've held for the last 8 years required FBI and credit checks. I don't think it is unreasonable to screen people in that manner in this particular line of work. And I take comfort in knowing that my all of my staff has passed these checks.

That said and back to topic, I first entered this line of work when I was still an immigrant and there have always been lots of immigrants in our offices. I don't really remember ever having worked at any place where there weren't people from various countries speaking with various accents. If there are companies that rather keep it all "in the family", so to speak, it's their loss. I certainly wouldn't want to work there.

When the government screens people for security clearances, one of the things they check is their credit history. People who are in debt tend to be easier to corrupt.

I am not sure if such reasoning would fly for a friggin' retailer, but I'm not sure it would count as unlawful discrimination unless they were using 'poor credit score' to only screen out applicants of a certain race or gender or creed or somesuch.

Anyhow, it's illegal to discriminate on national origin, but unless the person is dumb enough to write it down or has a history of it, it's going to be hard to show, especially if they can point to something like weak language skills to cover their butts. And you'd still not end up with a job you'd want there anyway! There are plenty of places that don't mind accents and aren't afeared a' furriners, so don't worry about the idiots.

What if every employer started doing credit checks? How are people with bad credit histories supposed to break out of the vicious cycle?

Why would every employer want to go through that trouble? They do it where necessary.
It's not an easy and inexpensive thing to administer for an employer.