First I'd like to say thank you to everyone who posts here at VJ. This community has provided such valuable information and insights into this visa filing process.

In my research I've come across many who have had interview in Casablanca where the infamous "woman" gives a 221g without a reason. Then proceeds to send the file back to the states without the required 2nd. interview. My heart goes out to each and every one of you.

My question is this:

What can a spouse or fiance' do at the time of interview to jolt a sense of "legal" ramification into this woman.? How can I prepare my husband for this interview? Is it possible for him to show her the law as it is written to remind her of his rights and the legal procedure? In some cases the "evidence" hasn't even been looked at. Is it possible to INSIST she look at it?

I'm just completely frustrated at what has happened to so many for no reason.
Is there anything that can be done to avoid or deterr this action at the time of interview?

Libragoddess - hee hee I'm a libra too!, but to answer your question. I dont think there is anything they can do at that point. I'm not sure if it would help, but people keep referring to this lady as the "woman". Since we are saavy women here, I think we need to get this situation under control.

1. All applicants going through the Casa embassy need to make note of who they speak with and document everything! They should go in there calm and prepared (easier said than done) with a pad of paper and a pen and all the other applicable evidence they may need. When we talk to ta government agent here, we take note of their name and bagde/id nymber.

2. Make note of the date/time and document what happened.

I think once enough data has been complied, a complaint at the very least can be filed. But in order for this complaint to be valid, you will have to have this back up data. Espeically if there is a trend of a certain person doing the same thing all the time.

I encourage everyone going through any embassy to do this. Even though these embassy's are in other countries, its our tax dollars that pay for their jobs! There are always attorneys out there represnting groups of people when some kind of misconduct has taken place within our governments. It is our right as Citizens to bring over our spouses and fiances and family members. The least they can do is to give people the time of day when they have poured in money, time, and so many other things

DOCUMENTATION IS KEY!!!

I don't really know the answer to your question, but I wanted to make sure you were clear on what a 221(g) is... It's basically a document saying they can't issue the visa because they need more information. Going through Morocco, your fiance will almost definitely get one of these lovely pieces of paper, regardless of whether or not the interviewer is nice to you. The reason for this is that they issue them when they need to do "administrative processing," aka an extra security check they seem to do for men from Middle Eastern/North African countries. Some (actually most) of the 221g's we've seen are just for the security check and you need to wait somewhere from a week to a few months to actually get the visa. Other people have gotten the 221(g) requesting more documentation, for instance a police report or more photos or a video or things like that.

A few people have gotten the 221(g) form stating that their petition is being sent back to the US for further review, and I know this is what you're asking about. Just wanted to make sure you knew there were possible reasons for getting the 221(g) other than that.

Hopefully some of the people who hang out here who know more about that can answer that question.

Sharon

BTW, welcome to the forum, it's always good to see more North African people here, although I think we might be the majority anyway...

I would love to have my fiance go in there with a tape recorder but i think that would just piss them off and diffently slap him with a 221(g) sent back to the us. It seems like your dammed if you do and dammed if you don't. He not going through morocco but i heard they are getting more strict at the embassy in goergia.

LOL tape recorder! I wish!

I know for a fact there have been formal complaints filed against The Woman from as far back as 2 years ago and apparently as of yet nothing has come of it. I think in all honesty its very difficult to dislodge a career diplomat, and as Morocco becomes known more and more as a high fraud post I think its doubtful anyone higher up will rein her in.
I agree with Sharon, you need to be clear about what kind of 221g you are referring to. No male in Morocco gets a visa without a brief (hopefully) stint in AR for security checks, its standard practice and unavoidable. the best you can do is prepare your fiance in advance that its going to happen and that its not the end of everything. As for the petitions that get sent back, that just SUCKS and I am truly so sorry for everyone it happens to. My advice: cross every T, dot every single I, try to prepare yourself and significant other as much as possible and then just hope and pray for the best. Forewarned is forearmed. the worst thing about Casa these days is that the cases that really DO get sent back are so unclear about the reasons (at least so far) that its really hard for anyone else to learn from it and try to avoid it. Just stay here on the board and we will all try together to form a big body of knowledge

I understand what you guys are saying, but I don't see any harm in filing more complaints. It may not do any good in the near future, but its good to have on hand. If a president can be impeached, then a career diplomat can be dislodged.

Even if a complaint is not filed, it would good to have that information on hand. I mean even if they issue the 221g and they give you a reason. How can they even come to that conclusion after a one minute interview and they don't even look at your paperwork. I see so much negativity coming out of the Casa embassy which so many of you fall victem to. You never know how much difference one person can make.

They don't need to make it totally obvious in the interview that they are noting down the name of the officer that helps them. They definitly have the right to know the name of the person they are talking too.

Dear Libragodess:
It is so hard to relax when you deal with Casablanca...My fiance just went through with it last week..he did got the woman and one piece of advice that he thought would be helpful is that if one is to be interviewed by this individual to be careful with her french...he told me that her accent is very difficult to understand and in order to avoid any confusion or misunderstandings he had requested a translator...he told her that his French is not good enough and he is not familiar with English...he told her that the importance of this interview requires his complete understanding and the questions that he would be asked are of a very sensitive nature therefore he would like to deal with an interpreter...she obliged...besides that he mentioned that you simply have to be confident and know a lot of information about the the petitioner...she was asking questions as to the names of my parents...and asked him to write such information down...just be prepared, very prepared and confident...I know that it is much easier said then done but this is all that I can add to the topic...he eventually was given the 221g and was told that they would contact him within 2 weeks ...administrative review was marked as the reason of the 221g...as for the evidence she only asked about our e-mails...nothing else...she looked thru them carefully and was checking their dates...she asked about my knowledge spanish (language in which I speak with Jamal) - as I am of Polish decent...where did I learn it and such...so now we are just waiting and praying for a speedy and positive outcome and unification...I hope that it helped a little...be strong and good luck..
Dorothy

Just to clarify I do understand that the 221g is issued on every case.
I thank all of you for taking the time to give such helpful advice.
Really, having this support group is such a blessing.
Farid and I will do our best to continue gathering as much information as possible to prepare ourselves for the interview. Does anyone here know of a thread that speaks specifically of the interview in morocco? Like what kind of questions to be prepared for? Really your post ella74ny is so very helpful.

I would imagine that most questions are standard for any consulate, but as each of our situations are different, so are the questions. Be prepared for your fiancé to be knowledgeable about anything that would even slightly raise suspicion about your case. Good luck (And hope you don't get the wicked witch)

Every interview is different that I don't think they have just standard questions ready. My husband went through the K-1 process and he said his interview wasn't that long and it went really well. He went in there confident and very relaxed. He was the same for our AOS interview, these men have such will power and patience. Anyway, we went through every question we could think of for 2 or 3 weeks before the interview. The man knows more about me than I can even remember. We practiced and he could answer every question. I know they asked him to write my name and say it, of course, asked where I worked and what I did, my daughter's name, where we lived, how we met, how many times I had been to Morocco and when (I had only been there once). They went over our I134 very carefully and barely checked out all the evidence he presented to them. He did mention he had a "fiance ring" and was wearing it and they wanted to see it. When I read about other interviews, they all seem to ask about the same but different questions too. I'm sure others will give you an idea too. The burden is on our men at this point to make sure they realize our love and how true our relationships are and to make sure they are understood. I felt so helpless but Abdou carried us through. Good Luck! By the way, my husband didn't have the woman for his interview, thank goodness.

Doreen

Mar7aba Libragoddess !

You've already gotten excellent advice from the group (as usual )

I hadn't seen you before, so I just wanted to welcome you our ME/NA corner of the VJ world. I'll add you to the cheerleading thread.... we love to keep track of everyone's progress so we can encourage and cheer them on as they get to the interview and beyond !

Best of luck to you and your husband in your visa journey !



-MK

I can't agree more. Some interviews are hard and they really look at the evidence. Others (like my husband's) are perfunctory. Majid said that literally all the guy asked him was what my name was, how we met, and asked to see photos. Majid showed him one photo of me with his mother, both of us dressed in our Moroccan finest, and that was it.

I pray for you and for everyone that you get lucky, but I agree with Doreen, try to anticipate the questions, make sure your partner knows all the details of the application (timeline, your parents' names, your phone number by heart), and some have suggested that if there is a family connection (your partner has family already in the US) or money being exchanged that you downplay that, as it might make it look like you're being paid for the visa.

Sharon

I would make sure your husband is aware of any information that is in the application, in detail. My last husband before Abdel was also Moroccan, and of course I had to put information about that in the package because I sponsored him. I explained in a supplement sheet that we were divorced because he wanted children and I didn't, but I guess I hadn't explained that to him well enough before I married him.

I had been married 3 times before so the CO asked Abdel about each of my marriages and why they failed. They also asked him about the baby issue.

When I first started coming here a guy posted about his wife not knowing he had been married before when she went to the interview and she was caught off guard. Be sure your husband is aware of any previous marriages you've had, and if you weren't married to your child's father, discuss that with him in detail too. The more he knows about you and in detail - emotions, reasons, whatever you can relay to him, will help him to be able to deal with very prying questions.

Wow!!! Thanks to all for the excellent advice and insight. And thank you for adding us to the cheerleading thread I feel so warm and welcomed!

Last night I stayed up till 1:30am reading the entire 19 page thread to the 221g cases being sent back to the states and this morning while driving to work, I got the idea to also include as part of our "evidence of relationship", refrence letters from my friends and family each stating thier relationship to me..how long they've known me and a few supporting facts as to why they know and feel our relationship is valid and true. Almost all of my friends and family memebers have actually spoken with Farid by web cam or on the telephone when he calls at work. I remember reading someone (sorry I haven't remembered the member's name) stating that they did this after thier application was sent back to the states. So I'm thinking that by adding this it can be yet another proof of the relationship. Along with the photos, the phone bills, the video, the emails, the messenger logs, the love letters by snail mail, ect.

Has anyone tried this before? Do you think it is a good idea for him to get reference letters as well from his friends and family and of coarse have them translated? Is it worth the effort on both parts?

I erred on the side of "too much evidence" and I'm certainly not regretting it one bit. Abdel was here in 4 months and 3 weeks from the day I filed (I think. My memory is getting fuzzy now that it's behind us.)

Do they pat you down at the embassy? If I was going through morocco I'd wire tap myself and ask for names, nothing like that kinda evidence!

Hello everyone,

I have not been active at all on VJ for awhile. But decided to just come check in. It looks like a lot of folks have posted good advice and replies to this thread. I just wanted to reiterate what others have said and share our experience - I'm not sure why it seem like many people are getting this 221g coming out of Casablanca. It seems strange, and perhaps the Embassy has a reason for doing this. When my husband went thru his K-1 interview there (granted this was in April 2004 - so a lot could have changed there since then), it was very simple and easy. Maybe he didn't get this woman that all of you are talking about - in fact I think it was a man who intereviewed him. But in my mind the reason why he had no issues is because our case was clear, not complicated, well documented etc...For those of you who might have more complicated situations (for whatever the reason), the more documentation the better obviously. And for your guys, they just need to go into the interview with a clear head and calmly. It is so hard to predict what they are going to ask you. My husband's interview was less than 10 minutes. They asked him basic questions - how he and met, confirm that we are getting married within the 90 days, and what he is planning on doing when he gets to the US for work. It seems like we were really lucky compared to the vast majority of you, who seem to be having to go thru this 221g thingy. I'm not sure why...it is strange.

Anyway - I wish all of you luck.
Sita

This is such a great group of people, very helpful and encouraging

i haven't been here for a while, but i DO know this woman you are talking about. my husband had the displeasure of being "interviewed" by her. i use quotes when saying interviewed because she basically asked the same question over and over again: "why don't you speak english?"
someone mentioned a translator before...... good luck with that. there seems to be a LACK of translators there. when a moroccan woman (a secretary or something; NOT an "official") finally stepped in to translate, the conversation was very one-sided. this "helpful" woman did NOT translate what my husband was saying/asking. she only translated the questions Kim asked. he thinks that the translator even condensed some of his answers.
as for evidence..... being prepoared is the best solution. but also be aware that in our experience NOTHING was looked at. my husband had folders of pictures, telephone calls, email, letters, etc etc etc.......... NOTHING was looked at at all! when my husband told the translator that he wanted to show her the evidence, the "translator" took it upon herself to answer , "she (kim) didn't ask for that...."

good news........... he was approved!! however, he left the consulate NOT understanding what the outcome was. the whole process was very frustrating , not to mention belittleing. all she had to do was look at my job info in the paperwork.... or read .... read just about anything that was in her folder. my job is a french teacher, AND i work for a french company..... put 1 and one together and it's obvious that we communicate in french. she prefered to ask him (again, again, again) WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY he didn't speak english if his fiancee was american.

in short........... GOOD LUCK. be prepared, but if something goes wrong, don't feel as if you've done something wrong. i know these words aren't very comforting, but it will happen.... you will be together.... even if it just takes a bit longer.
chin up!!!!!!!!!!! we're all here for you..... we've either been-there-done-that, or we're in the same situation.

Going through Casablanca is a tough one, especially if you get the woman we did. Yes, every single case and its details are very different. However...more often than not this woman is returning petitions for further review. There are very few who actually get through her with a visa the first time around.

Your husband/fiance will not know the name of the officer in Casablanca, they do not devulge this information. If he happens to take note of the bade ID...good for him. My fiance never saw an ID number. We only knew who interviewed my fiance because of the way she signed the 221g...even that is not consistent (e.g. Kim; Kimberly) and there is never a last name given.

This CO is not looking at the additional "ongoing" evidence of the relationship. My fiance had a ton of our emails, letters, phone bills and she only wanted to see more photos which were provided. He tried to give her ALL the evidence but she refused to look at it. It is nearly the same with all the return cases I am familiar with.

It would seem to me if she has any question whatsoever regarding the relationship, beneficiary or petitioner the petition/application is returned to the US for review no further questions asked...and she is giving no reason to the beneficiary or stating the actual reason on the 221g. She only notifies them of the petition/application return via the 221g and that is it.

My only advice is to insist on her taking all your evidence...insist it proves your relationship is true and valid. Stay confident, remember it is the burden of the beneficiary to prove the relationship, not just the original petition and evidence submitted with it. Definitely watch her wording and the speed at which she is talking, she does have a thick french accent also watch the changing of wording and asking the same question worded differently, she will definitely try to confuse the beneficiary.

As for a translator...I would not be telling my fiance/husband to ask for one unless you communicate (documented) in the language being translated to the consular officer. This is a huge red flag to them and they will use it to return a petition. Even then this is a sketchy process with Casa. I know many people who have used a translator for arabic not just with Kim, but other COs at Casa, and they were sure that not all of the information was passed on correctly. Remember as much as possible about the interview...it is not likely the beneficiary will even be able to "take notes" on all the back and forth.

If given a 221g for for evidence, photos, anything and a request to return to the consulate...make a copy of that 221g paper asking for the evidence and keep it. When they return to the consulate with that evidence that paper will be taken from them and not returned.

I wish you much luck with the interview.

~Kiya~

I think that the advice given has been excellent (as always!) I would like to let you know that it is not definete you will recieve the 221g (odds are good but you might not) My fiance did NOT recieve this, he went and got his visa the following day. Also another woman and her husband were there for a K3 visa the same day and he got his visa the following day as well. I know it's best to be prepared but I just wanted to let you know that he could very well get it easily. Also, if he can speak English, I think it's truly the best, it shows them he is very serious about coming to and living in the US where we speak English (especially with all this immigrant mumbo jumbo in the US right now). Just wanted to hopefully make a little spark of possibility for you!

Amera
oh and ps. - WELCOME!

I agree with everyone..its so hard to tell. just make sure that you have tons of evidence. My husband had an interview of 10 minutes with a really kind man. They really ended up talking about BBKing more than us and it was an easy experience. I had also been living in Morocco for 2 years with my fiance while I was working there so our evidence wasnt as typical...we had years of my records being there. Just be confident, and calm.

Good Luck,
Sarah