OK, heres the deal.

I am an US citizen. My fiance is a UK citizen. We are getting married in August in London, and our plan is that she will come back to US with me after we get married.

Should we start a fiance visa (K1 i think) now or should we do the K3 once we get married. Which will be the quickest way? Usually, british citizens arent required to have a visa to visit the US for 3 months or something, so she will be able to come back with me while its processing and return to UK for the interview right?

Please inform me of what the best way would be and wheather she will be able to come here under the tourist thing while this is giong on(becuase she is UK citizen)

thanks a bunch in advance

-sorry about double post, my browser is weird

It all depends on your time schedule...have you checked the What Visa Do We Need? section?

im not sure what u mean by time schedule. we will be gtting maried regardless in august. so should we do the K3 after marriage or pretend like the marriage never took place and once she is in the states, we do the K1 visa...

You will need to do the K3 if you are getting married in the UK.

If you're married, you cannot get a fiance visa. You cannot apply for a K3 spousal visa until you are married. So if you are set on having a legal marriage take place in England in August, then between now and then, you have ample time to educate yourself, but not much to do, paperwork wise.

There no "pretending" with the United States Federal Government. If you would like, you can apply for the fiance visa now, have a ceremonial, NON LEGAL wedding in the UK (ie: don't sign a thing, but do the fancy dress, etc etc, yadda yadda).

A UK citizen in good standing (most UK citizens) can enter the US under the Visa Waiver Program - which allows the UK-er to stay here for 90 days. Then the Brit either files for an extention or goes home. Or there is the B2 tourist visa option which allows, normally, up to a 180 day stay.

But realistically, you can't just get on a plane and expect to come make a life here permanently after marriage without taking steps toward SOME kind of paperwork first.

A smart thing to do at this point is to take a week , read all the guides and FAQ and timelines here at VJ. Go read as much info you can at both travel.state.gov and - importantly - www.uscis.gov.

Then, once you understand the options available to you, compile more detailed questions that you haven't been able to answer on your own, and ask us.

best of luck!

If you want to really know whats best: Do it the right way - lying/pretending a wedding didn't happen and coming here on the tourist 'thing' could come back to haunt you in ways you won't find humor in.

Have you considered getting a CR1 visa instead of a K3? It takes a bit longer though, but allows you to go in having done all the immigrant visa nonsense in London instead of adjusting status over there. You can work straight away, which is also a bonus.

And...if you've been in the UK long enough (anyone recall what the new rule on length of residency is -- is it still 2 years?) you can do Direct Consular Filing through the Embassy which is even faster than filing through one of the US Service Centres for a CR1. Or so I am told -- I'm doing DCF right now and it seems to take ages, but that's just because I want to go home NOW!!!

Just a word of advice, echoing everybody else -- do not hide anything from the USCIS, the Embassy or Uncle Sam in general. They will find out sooner or later, and immigration fraud, especially in the current political climate, is not something you want to get done for. The penalties are real and severe.

Good luck -- do some research now and get your ducks in a row before August, read the guides and visit the USCIS website. This is a fantastic site, a real treasure trove and you'll get info and support here you wouldn't get anywhere else!

Yep, I was going to the ask the same thing about how long the OP has been in the UK - assuming they're in the UK. The official rule for direct filing (it's not DCF though since there's a USCIS office in London) is 2 years resident in the UK, but many people are finding that their petition is accepted if they've been in the UK for 11 months or more. I was in the UK for 19 mos when I sent in my petition, and they're currently processing it.

Hello! Are you currently living in the UK? If so, how long have you been in UK and on what kind of visa? If by August you'll have been in the UK on a non-tourist visa (such a student or finance visa) for 11 months or more, you should file the 1-130 with the USCIS office in London. That goes quickly (usually 6 months if there aren't any snags) and will result in a CR-1 visa for your wife, which has some great advantages. At her first point of entry to the US with the CR-1 (she has 6 months to enter after receiving the visa), she'll receive a temp stamp in her passport which will serve as her greencard until the real greencard comes in the mail. All you'll have to do after that is removal of conditions about two years down the line.

If you're currently in the US, an option would be having her visit you and do a court wedding in the states and then you can start an 1-130 right away. In the UK, you would do a non-legal ceremony (also negates the need for a UK fiance visa). It's perfectly fine for her to enter the states, marry you and then leave. She would need proof of ties to the UK - such a mortage/lease and letter from her employer or a uni if she's a student.



I just noticed this comment - do not do this. It's illegal and could land you and your future wife in huge trouble.

I'd do a lot more research before getting married regardless of the paperwork...
Unfortunatly it will take time regardless. Nothing involving any of the visas will be a cut and dry, easy peasy process. But once you get started it doesn't seem to take all that long...just some patience.

Like someone mentioned having a dressed wedding with out the legal paperwork would probably be okay but I'd be careful about pushing the limits. Pretending anything is a risk I wouldn't take. No one wants to be banned from entering the US....

Good luck.
Research Research. Research

Was in a similar situation to the OP, except I'm the UK citizen and my wife was the US citizen. She was already living and working in the UK before we met and got married. We went the IR-1 route through the US embassy in London and it was pretty quick. Feel free to look at my timeline and ask me any questions if you are looking to do this! Would be happy to give you any advice I can!

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

Londonspod

Everybody here has given you excellent advice. Please take all of it into consideration.

I have not lived in he UK for over a month, for those who were asking.


so lemme repharse my question:

-so, my fiance and I are not married yet, and we will not be having a legal marriage.

heres what I want: not to be seperated from her after we marry (at least for not over 2 weeks). we already bought a plane ticket for her to come over in the same flight as me. it is for roughly 85 days. we went with the fact that usually UK citizans can freely come to the US without visa

so would u recommend: we wait until we get married in august, file for the K3 in london, have her come over with me in end of august and return to UK, and then come back, and repeat until things get approved...

or would u reccomend: (im not sure if this is the correct procedure): that we apply for K1 now (would we do it now? ) and then have our non-legal marriage in august and have her still come over to the US with me in the end of august until end of November, while the K1 is pending? -- would there be a benifit in this, just becasue we would be starting the process about 4 months before we would be able to start a K3. would she recieve her visa quicker?

thanks a lot. sorry if i seemed confused about many of these things

master4g,

My suggestions:
- learn the difference between a wedding and a marriage, and find out whether or not a wedding creates a marriage in the locale where you plan to have the wedding
- read the VJ Guides and Visa FAQ, and the appropriate 'How Do I' pages of the USCIS web site. You need to know more about visiting the USA and immigrating to the USA than "or something".
- the visa waiver program (and B2 tourist visas) are for people to visit the USA for a limited period of time, they are not for people to move to the USA in advance of obtaining the proper visa for moving to the USA.

Yodrak

You need to familiarize yourself with your options because you've got some suprises in store for you. Here's one bit of advice: visa first, everything else second I highly doubt she's going to be able to use that ticket for more than just a visit.

The guides are definitely helpful. You'll get a better understanding of the process from them.

Like Yodark said, the VWP and tourist visa aren't for people to live in the US while a visa is pending.

You can't do this - "so would u recommend: we wait until we get married in august, file for the K3 in london, have her come over with me in end of august and return to UK, and then come back, and repeat until things get approved..."

You can't file anything in London unless you meet the residency requirement - which you won't if you haven't been in the UK on a non-tourist visa for 11 months or more. Also, you wouldn't do the K3 if you were able to file in London.

I am almost positive that she will not be allowed to enter the US after being married on the VWP for 85 days. They would have no reason to believe that she would return. It would definitely look like she intended to immigrate as she does intend to immigrate eventually.

Do you have a UK visa or have you been visiting her as a tourist? I think that you should seriously consider getting a UK fiance visa (if you don't already have one) and living in the UK with her until you're able to obtain her US visa. Getting a UK visa is simple and quick - the only painful part is paying for it. So what I would imagine is that you obtain the UK fiance visa, live in the UK with her, get legally married in the UK in August, adjust to a UK spousal visa, and then move to the US together when you've obtained the CR-1 visa for her. In fact, it could be a great experience for you both to spend some time in the UK together. If you went to the UK on the fiance visa next month and stayed in the UK, you could apply directly to the London office next April. Then it would be approx six more months before you had a CR-1 visa. This would mean that you were not separated for any period of time, and that you did have to deal with the hassle of filing at a US center and the hassle of K3 and adjustment of status.

Let me see if I can help. The language of immigration is specific and you will need to learn some of it. Which is why everyone is asking questions that you thought you have answered. Please read the guides and think of it as learning a new language.

Here is my Caveat, I am going to recommend what I would do if I were in your shoes, i do not know the laws in the UK, but in my cursory looks while we were deciding where we were going to live, this is what I thought I read. I am not a lawyer nor an immigration expert. (but i did sleep at a Good night inn last night)

Now for my recommendations, Being that you have the wedding planned you may want to consider getting married in London, if you do not have anything holding you here, get a job there (which i think you can get the temp permit in two weeks), file for the Visa (i believe it would be the K3 I130 and I485). I am not very well educated on the K3. Then come back to America together.

If you need to come back to the States, you might be separated for a bit, even up to a year, but you will eventually get to be together.

That last sentence should say - "did not have to deal with the hassle..."

I'm trying to figure out how you, a USC, are going to get married to a UK citizen, in London, in the first place.

To get legally married in the UK, he would have to obtain a fiance visa first. After the marriage, he'd get a settlement visa which would allow him to work. What do you mean by a temp permit for work that he could get within two weeks?

He wouldn't have to get the K3. The I-130 would result in a CR-1 for her, and the I-485 would only be needed if she came on the K3 and they had to adjust status for her.

Just echoing what everybody else has said: if it is possible for you to come and live in the UK for a while, do so. It really is a lot easier to get a UK fiance visa than a US one, and that way you can live with your bride-to-be (and later, wife). You say you don't want to be separated from her for more than 2 weeks -- it's an admirable and understandable sentiment, but for most of us here it is impossible. We've fallen in love with someone from another country and we have to play by USCIS rules in order to be with them. Unfortunately, these sometimes seem arbitrary and unfair, like not being able to just keep using the VWP over and over again until your visa is processed. They will notice a pattern and your fiancee could be barred from entering the US. (This works the other way too -- I have an American friend who basically lived in London for five years with her boyfriend, and would go over to France for a week every time her tourist visa was about to expire. Yup, UK Immigration found her out and deported her back to New Jersey.)

Please do consider living over here for a while -- it's definitely an experience! I've been here 11 years, and although I may gripe about it and want to go home, I have been on balance very happy and wouldn't have spent the past 11 years in the US for any price. You'll get the experience of living in another culture, which can also help you be sympathetic to your fiancee when she makes it to America. Not to mention how it looks on your resume... But I digress. The most important point I think you can take from everyone's comments above is that you do not want to give US Immigration any cause to deny your petition. Play by the rules, even if they seem ludicrous, tick all the boxes, be patient, and, above all, cherish the love you two have, because it will give you the strength you need to get over all the hurdles.

ok, I was not sure. Thank you for you suggestions.

But I knew it was easier to get the finance and subsequent settlement Visa's in the UK.

Good point. I was thinking, probably very naively, that they could marry there (just like someone could come here and marry), and that's a separate question from whether they could remain. But thinking about it now, I know England has a lot more picky rules about where and when marriages can be legally performed - so there's no reason to think their requirements for foreigners wouldn't be as particular.

With all respect to the OP, I think he knows pretty much nothing about how to go about any of this. Zip, zilch, zero. But I guess everyone starts somewhere. I wish him luck, though. As everyone has suggested: research, research, research!!!!

My understanding is that they cannot. Not without a valid fiance visa.

I found it very easy to get fiance and resident visas in the UK; the applications were straightforward, no in-person interview, no medical exam. Then again, I haven't had to deal with it since 2002 so it may have changed since then.

I am, too.

This is all going to end in tears, I can just see it.

Why? The UK fiance visa is easy to obtain for legit couples.

While the USC is already in the UK?

And I'm asking legitimately, because I don't know.

I didn't think it was clear the USC was in the UK - maybe I've just gotten confused. At any rate, he could easily go home to apply and then return.

Did I miss where the OP says he's currently living in the UK?

I just re-read the thread - he actually says that he' hasn't been in the UK for over a month.

he didn't. he stated that has has not lived there for over a month. I want to think that he meant that he has not visited for over a month.

well, if he can't legally marry there, then i think he's actually in good shape because then he can apply for the k1 now and just have the party over there and then continue the process.

Welcome to VisaJourney!! I'm glad you found your way here!!

There is so much to absorb and learn when you are in this process. At times this process can also drive you to the brink of insanity! But there are many wonderful people here who will give you great advice and help you along the way. I know it is all so overwhelming when you are starting and don't really know what to do. That was me several months ago, I was lost and clueless about this whole process, I have learned so much here and I still have much more to learn.

Finding VJ was a lifesaver for me, and I hope it is for you too.

what dou guys think about this.

we file for a fiance visa (K1) for the us right now.. than i go to london in august and have my non-legal/non official marriage and then she comes back to the US with me in august for the 3 months with the visa weiver program, and return in november. all this time, we remain "engaged" . and when my fiance returns to UK in NOV, she stays there until the interview comes and after that passes she comes here and we have a court marriage to make it official.

Works fine - just bear in mind all the potential pitfalls and the precautions I PMed you about. See all the 45million other threads about fiances visiting the US during the K1 process. You should be fine but BE EDUCATED AND PREPARED. Removal before she even gets in the country is no fun on the heart or the pocketbook.

That would involve being apart for more than two weeks unless you have enough money to live and not work in the UK.

I'm not sure how this non-legal wedding to going to work. In the states, we couldn't have had a minister do the ceremony without the legal bit. What type of ceremony are you imagining? Or are you really just talking about a wedding reception type thing?

As long as no documents are signed and nothing is registered, I don't think you can accidently end up married. I know in the UK, marriages can only be legally performed at registered sites. So do it at a park not on the registry. Don't sign a thing. Have a friend read the vows. Make it look like a wedding, but have it not be a marriage.

In the States, if your minister wouldn't do it without the legal bit, that's different than an inability to do it without the legal bit. To be married in most states - at least in mine - you need to send in a form with witness signatures, etc, attesting that the vows were exchanged and the marital contract is executed. Don't sign or send anything in and you aren't legally married.

What we did to avoid the pitfalls of USCIS is have a "betrothal" service in Scotland.

Where all of the ceremony occurred and we promised to go to the US and Get married.

It did require allot of intervention and coercion from religious leaders to get Annie's minister to understand this.

Had I to do it all again, I think I would have moved to the UK, got married, and then do the CR-1 (i think that is the right one)

Then move to the US

Ahhh, the best laid plans of mice and men!

I think my comment was a bit misleading - I didn't mean that they might accidentally be legally married. I meant that they might have trouble getting someone agree to do a ceremony when there wasn't going to be a legal marriage at that time. Your suggestion of having a friend who isn't legally able to marry two people lead it is a good idea.

Ok, two things;

-getting an non-offical marriage to happen shouldn't be a problem for me. I think I already have the man for that

-secondly, me moving and staying in England while this process goes on is somewhat out of the picture, wouldn't really work for me unless i get married in over a year (and im not waiting that long)



anyways, i would like to take this moment to thanks u guys again. Thanks a lot for making my life simpler

I see that nobody has mentioned the possibility that the UKC might be denied entry on the VWP, as she has no job, I assume, that would let her just up and leave for 3 months.

For the benefit of the OP, in order to gain entry on the VWP, your fiancee may be asked for pretty extensive proof that she will return to the UK. Having a K1 visa underway can either hurt or help, because although it shows that you are trying to do things through legal channels, it also shows that she ultimately has immigrant intent. Some things people use to show that they intend to return are evidence of a work commitment, a lease on a flat or homeownership, dependents reliant upon them longer term.... If your other half can just come over to the US for 3 months, she may not have any of these long-term ties to the UK. "I'm visiting my fiance, but I'll leave after 87 days" is probably not going to cut it.

If your plan is to have a "wedding" in the UK and have her over here as a visitor while she waits for the K1 to be processed, you must also consider what will you will do if she is denied entry at the POE.

I mentioned it, but the OP didn't respond to it. I said - "I am almost positive that she will not be allowed to enter the US after being married on the VWP for 85 days. They would have no reason to believe that she would return. It would definitely look like she intended to immigrate as she does intend to immigrate eventually."

we will still be "engaged" when she comes here . its not uncomon that i go there fto meet her, then she comes back to meet me here

MargotDarko, sorry if this is OT, but you mentioned people being resident in the UK for at least 11 months before you can do DCF. I had a 2 year LLR visa which began in December 2004. In September, 2006, when I called the UK embassy helpline and then the USCIS London office, they told me I wouldn't be eligible for DCF until I received ILR in January. If I attempted to file directly, the forms would be sent back and I wouldn't receive a refund.

I'm slightly annoyed to find that I might have been able to stay in the UK with my husband while this process was going on. We've received bad information several times from the embassy, with the not-much-help-line being the main source of misinformation. They actually told us on three different occasions that my husband should enter the US on the VWP and then adjust status. The third time we rang, we asked what we should said at the POE, and they advised us to lie. Brilliant.

Ah, well. It's all water under the bridge now, I suppose.

Yes, it is very annoying that they say one thing officially but do quite another thing in practice. I almost didn't attempt to file with the London USCIS office, but I was talking to people at www.diveintoamerica.com and many people had more than 11 mos but not ILR and had their petition processed. Like I said, I had 19 mos (most of it on a student visa and part LLR), and they're currently processing my petition. But I know if I had called they would have said I had to have ILR.

And holy cow! That's crazy being told to enter on VWP and adjust status! I'm really glad you knew better.

And?

There is no guarantee that she will be admitted as a visitor - even if you are only "engaged". If she has been using the VWP frequently, that makes it even more likely that she will be subject to rigorous questioning at the POE.

I'm sorry that you don't like the idea, but it is important that you consider what you will do if it happens. Entry to the US is not a god-given right; it is a privilege which can be revoked at the whim of an IO at the POE.

I'm new to VJ having just returned from the US after meeting my fiance for the first time. I've found the message boards exceptionally helpful so far since the transition from being in love with a USC to actually making plans for a lifetime with them is a huge learning curve apparently.

After reading this board I'm somewhat confused as to what the best course of action is with regards to which partner goes where. Clearly, most of us would agree that the less time we spend apart is advantageous. However, from reading the threads I realise this is not always practical or possible.

After visiting the US we decided that it would be preferential longterm for me to live there, taking into account family support networks and the simple fact that I thoroughly enjoyed being there with him and his friends and family. My career is also transferrable, whereas his prospects are less firm currently...for a variety of reasons. So, I have looked into the K1 process in fine detail.

Having said all of this, when we initially talked about the future we did discuss the possibilty of him moving over to the UK. Since, it's going to take many months for us to gain a K1 visa, I wonder from the comments in this thread whether people who have already started the K1 process actually wish they had applied for a fiance visa in the UK then converted that to a spouse visa whilst living in the UK together when both parties were legally able to return to the states.

I have not started any process yet, having only returned a week ago, but I would like to get all the facts in order before I commit either way. Can anyone clarify the position on relative timescales of the fiance visa application for the US and comparitive timescales for the reverse situation bearing in mind that both he and I wish to live in the states ultimately.

Thanks!

It's ok, I got my answer. The USC would not be entitled to work on a UK fiance visa...so it's not a viable option.