On the recent what you need to discuss with your SO threads, (inheritence being a great one, something my husband and I are dealing with).... another very important issue one comes to mind: children!



Children is something on most couple's mind, but even more so I think for MENA couples. As children are a given...

To conceive or not to concieve (or at least for now)…

Islam does allow, as does other religions for birth control and delay in having children. But abortion is frowned upon. I have read several different agruement about when a abortion is haraam or not… some scholars I have read say abortion at any time is haraam, while others mention different variations like the abortion is allowed if the mother would be harmed having the child and others say abortion is allowed if done before the 10 week of pregnancy.

Generally (in my opinion) most MENA people want and think about having children soon after the marriage. And probably speak about it before even getting married.Ideally, if we lived in a prefect world it would be great to conceive soon after marriage, and continue to have as many children as pyshically possible… but we donnot live in a Utopia where there are no financial concerns, pyhscial issues and now-a-days women assume roles outside of wife and mother… many things come into play… and a couple may want or need to delay children.

And when the couple does agree it is the right time to have children or they just do not practice birth control and become pregnant… what happens?

I know I have had my O, *+#&(##*&^ I (think) I am pregnant moment… Having mixed feelings about it (but of course accepting what fate is dealt to me) …. My husband on the other hand much more happier then I.

And when the couple does get pregnant … the other issues like where the baby should be born, raised(many people may prefer their children grow up in their native country), what they should be named, their education, what religion they will be, what culture are they exposed to… etc.

I know from my life situation, I think about allowing my daughter to visit or live in her father's native country… where the laws state the mother have no right over the child after nursing and that girls as young as 12 are married off. Yes, I know it sounds harse and I hope most people there have common sense not to partake in this, but this is what the law states in that country.

And as I read the Family Law Code in my husband's country of Algérie any child born to Algérien national, whether in Algérie or elsewhere, that child is considered Algérien by law. And no child may be taken out of Algérie without both parents signing a contract at the local police station (which in many cases takes months to obtain) So with my husband I have talked many many times about children and what we invision.

I also, would like to hear from you ladies (or men) out that have children from previous relationships and if/how your SO plans to be involved in the parenting.

Many ME-ers and NA-ns agrue that Allah give us the rizk and we need not worry on finances, how to raise the child,etc…just have the children. But most of us living in this modern time and our SO coming to live in the USA finding a whole new culture and will find some disagreements on this issue…

I have stated what Islam's view on birth control and abortion, in the above, but my post is only centered towards Muslims…but every MENA couple. I invite everyone to answer.What do you all think?

We have discussed having children. At first I really didn't want any more, as I have a 12 year old and I always felt like that was enough.
After many many many many hours of discussion over months of time, I am actually now excited about the thought of having a child with my future husband.
I don't think I want more than one though, and he's okay with that.

We do talk about some details of raising a child if Allah blesses us with one, but we haven't discussed things in too much detail yet. It will come with time and I have no doubt that we will be able to work out everything that we need to.

As to my son that I have now, my fiance is very excited about being a part of his life and helping to be a positive influence where his natural father isn't.
My son is excited too, and I really think they will get along great.

Thanks for your comments Melly...
I am more interested in what MENA couples are thinking when it comes to down to birth control (and maybe even abortion)... since of course all MENA people would like children... and I htink generally in MENA timing is not considered... people have children whenever they conceieve...no planning is done.

Well, without going into any specifics, we do want children, but we have made plans to wait to do so until we are more financially stable. Islam has not really entered into any of our discussions concerning the timing.

Ah. Well, we have discussed that too. We don't want to have children right away as we really want to give ourselves time to get grounded in our relationship and make sure it's as firm as possible before we put the issue of children into our relationship. Children change everything, and we need to know who we are as a couple before we have a child so we can adjust better after we have a child.
I'm so chomping at the bit to have kids right now (I never thought I'd say that in my life!!!) that I hate the thought of waiting at this point, but it will be a few years still, insha'Allah.
We will use birth control until we are ready to have a child and after we have one, insha'Allah, we will use birth control after that.
He has stated that he does not want me to use any kind of birth control that has the very real possibility to do me serious harm and he was fairly insistant about that. I wouldn't want him to do that either if it was possible for men to use different forms of birth control like women do, so I can understand and accept that.
As to abortion... I don't think either of us feel that it should be done within the normal realm of things if it can be helped, but **** happens and as it is allowed Islamically, we are not against it when needed.
That doesn't necessarily apply to us as a couple and abortion, just in general about abortion.
I don't think i could have one, even though I only want one more child.

Same with us.

Henia I have a question. In the last question about birth control you say "we choose not to discuss it and leave it to Allah". Does that mean we're not using BC and having kids if God wants us to?

we plan to have children, have discussed it up and down, and now that we are doing sooo well. we plan to start next month, after my wisdom teeth are pulled

My husband and I have both talked about having children (and all the other topics having to do with children). And we both would like to have children. But where we differ is, that while we believe birth control is allowed, he has asked me to not use any (pills). I am of course not, but I am thinking if having children now is not the right time for us... why not? Also I would like to have 1-2 more children (maybe 3 if we are financial well off) I have one already... he thinks he as a "Muslim" and "Algerien" needs to have 4 more (other then my one) I have explained and explained to him, that we have to support them all and somewhere down the line educate them too. Finally understand my point...so I was wondering what you all have discussed.

My husband and I have both talked about having children (and all the other topics having to do with children). And we both would like to have children. But where we differ is, that while we believe birth control is allowed, he has asked me to not use any (pills). I am of course not, but I am thinking if having children now is not the right time for us... why not? Also I would like to have 1-2 more children (maybe 3 if we are financial well off) I have one already... he thinks he as a "Muslim" and "Algerien" needs to have 4 more (other then my one) I have explained and explained to him, that we have to support them all and somewhere down the line educate them too. Finally understand my point...so I was wondering what you all have discussed.

My husband and I have both talked about having children (and all the other topics having to do with children). And we both would like to have children. But where we differ is, that while we believe birth control is allowed, he has asked me to not use any (pills). I am of course not, but I am thinking if having children now is not the right time for us... why not? Also I would like to have 1-2 more children (maybe 3 if we are financial well off) I have one already... he thinks he as a "Muslim" and "Algerien" needs to have 4 more (other then my one) I have explained and explained to him, that we have to support them all and somewhere down the line educate them too. Finally understand my point...so I was wondering what you all have discussed.

Sorry I do not know why my reply came up 3x and also why my orginal post was posted 2x...

Without any regard to any religion, we both want kids and we don't plan on waiting. Neither of us have issues with using birth control but are not planning on using it until after finish having kids. We have similar views to raising our children so thankfully that has not been an issue. The ony issue we have at the moment is that I was 3 and he wants 4 or 5 , ask me after the first one and that number may be reduced dramatically.

You are probably right JP. Some men, I think over romanticized/idealize the idea of having children. Hopefully will grow out of it and realize its realities.

I left Jordan because I was pregnant. I wanted that child to have USA citizenship, which opens most doors. My DH agreed after I stated my reasons. Tho he said he had the right to name the child. Which is what we argued about. I wanted names that were the norm in both places. We had settled on Summer for a girl but for a boy, he wanted a family name. In his family you have five or six names to choose from... and all the men are named those. UGH!

As for birthcontrol, It was the first time I had been on any in my life. It was the sixth month on it and I got pregnant. We called the baby the antibiotic baby. We wont use birthcontrol again as I dont like it and wish for God to choose like I had done before. Just like God choose for me not to carry that baby full term. There is a reason for everything I believe.




Wendy

we descused it when we got married and agreed to wait one year to make sure the marriege is stable. the year came and went and then he said...wait til im working. now he is working and i am still on the pill.

to tell u the truth i think he has fears about it since im 41 now. the chances are higher for downs syndrom..etc. when he was in saudi arabia his patients were disabled people and he hated that so i think he is afraid of that.

Not all MENA people want children. That's a stereotype. I know lots who didn't want them and didn't have them.

We had settled on Summer for a girl but for a boy, he wanted a family name. In his family you have five or six names to choose from... and all the men are named those. UGH!

I laughed out loud when I read this! We have about five family names too and nearly all have them. One of my aunts rebeled and her kids have different names.

Very interesting topic. Before we got married I had a son. He was 6 months old when I met my husband, and 15 months old when my the two of them met. We lived together for almost 2 months as a family and I saw how good of a father my husband would be. I was on birth control when we lived there for 2 months, got pregnant and miscarried. When we got pregnant this last time I was also on birth control (different kind though). So let's just say we're very fertile lol. My husband initally wanted like 6 kids or more, I was like "hmmm 2 is plenty". Now that we have both of the boys he also has decided that's enough. The realities of life here, day care, diapers, and general living expenses takes a lot and he knows that to have any more would be a big financial strain. Whether or not we used birth control was not an issue. We both agreed that obviously if we didn't want any more kids we had to do what we had to do. Now that we have two, we're discussing sterilization, however he doesn't want to be the one to do it - rough spot for us right now. I'm not really dying to go through a sort of big surgery and I feel like hey I'm 22 do I really want to give up my chance of ever having a baby again?? We have discussed that down the road if the situation is right we would like to adopt a little girl from Morocco but we'll see. I would really love a little girl to add to all my boys

When we were discussing kids, I believe my husband made a comment about wanting enough for a football team Now we're down to 2 or 3, once we're financially stable. I'm looking forward to raising bilingual, bicultural muslim kids. Huzzah!

I'm kind of confused about the last question. The option for us would be we both disagree with birth control. I didn't see that one in there at all.

We agree that we want to raise our children that we have together (not including my children from my previous marriage) as muslims and that we want as many children as Allah blesses us with insha Allah as soon as I get my tubal ligation reversed.

Moh and I have discussed having children and how we plan on raising them on several occasions. He goes back and forth about wanting to have children right away after he gets here (isa). I'm more liking the idea of waiting about a year or so. I want him to have time to adjust to life here, find employment, develop a relationship with my sons (and vice versa), etc. Last time we discussed it we agreed on waiting about a year. His family would've liked me pregnant already and we did in fact "leave it to God" on my last visit but apparently he didn't think it was good for us at the time. Alhamdulillah! We plan on raising future children the same way I've been raising my sons all along. He and my ex have similar views on raising children in accordance with Islam and culture. About the number...well that's up to God of course but I wouldn't mind one or two more. Mohamed agrees.

Mohamed and I have also discussed how he'll fit into raising/caretaking of my sons. He realizes they already have a father and doesn't want to be their father. He would rather have a sort of friendship with them. We have talked about discipline while they're in our care. I would handle most of it but if he felt they weren't responding to me he'd step in. My boys tend to respond better to men. He plans on spending lots of time with them particularly during the summer when they're off school. When he does find employment we plan on working different schedules so that one of us can be with the boys while the other is working. He's excited about this idea. I'm confident that he'll be a great dad/stepdad.

That is rather amusingly funny... antibotic baby.

oops sorry about not including that option, thought I did. But my question rfers to if you and your SO agree or not to use birth control (at any point and in any form) or not at all.