OK...hhhhh
He can't request a visitor visa for me because he will be investigated by his government. I can't request it alone because I will get a gov't guide and he will be investigated if we meet. Sounds like a country from a novel...YES! Nobody has an idea what we go through. Furthermore he can't come out of the country because he won't be able to return (that will mean jail...definitely...and for no reason) What can we do?? Does it sound like a reason for a waiver?? I have more reasons but that's the main problem...keeping him safe and being able to meet are not compatible things. I need advice before submitting the I-129F.
Please help....
SaroryH

Why wouldn't he be able to return??

Can he not travel to a Libya friendly country nearby? Is there a money or military issue? I wish I had an asnwer but there are other petitioner's here with fiance's in Libya. I am sure they will have some good advice.





Iam sure you probably have seem this page. US travel to Libya has relaxed over the last year or so.

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_951.html

It is very very very very very very rare to succeed in getting a waiver for not having met within the past two years.

There's essentially two reasons listed in the I-129F: overriding religious/cultural prohibition that doesn't allow couples to meet before marriage. (unlikely since you've looked into meeting) And extreme hardship: severe medical, danger to the U.S. citizen, that sort of reason.

Someone who isn't as tired as I am will come along with the URL, but there's only one case I can think of where someone was approved: the petitioner was on kidney dialysis or something like that. It's theoretically possible, from what you sketched of your situation on the other thread, but very very very very very very very very very very very very very unlikely. (And that's just to get to the NOA2, let proving a viable relationship without having met.)

Could the two of you meet in a third country? You probably can't get to Libya, but maybe there's a neutral site where you two could meet (Egypt? Tunisia?) The U.S. barely has diplomatic relations with Libya. In any case, in a number of the denied waivers the adjudicators have cited failure to prove that meeting in a third country isn't possible, so that should be an option you should explore (aside from the advisability of meeting in person the guy you plan to marry.)

I agree - I think that the odds of you getting a waiver are basically 0% - and not to pry but would you want to bring someone here having never met them? I know there are other people with fiance's from Libya and I think that one has even gone to Libya to visit. As has been said travel to Libya has been loosened - I'm not sure why he would be jailed upon return but maybe you can provide an idea/answer (USCIS will need an amazing and well documented one if you decide to go the waiver route). There must be some 3rd Middle Eastern country you could meet in, such as Egypt or Tunisia as has been said. Then again who knows Khadaffi is weird and I really am not a scholar of Libyan policy procedure! Whatever you decide to do - best of luck!

Yes there is a military issue. We don't know what to do. The main thing is that if he does come out to meet, he cannot return. Then he cannot stay in the country we meet because it will have a time limit before someone misses him back home(you know what I mean) and the visa will take a long time.



Yes, I know it sounds weird. Our families were reluctant in the beginning but, now they know and support us.

Sorry if I missed this but have you guys already met in person?

Are you comfortable with petitioning for someone you have never met in person? I guess I personally couldn't do it. Not only is it impossible but I just can't imagine being engaged and having someone come to live with me and to get married without meeting him in person first along with his family.

I understand that it is not an easy country for him to go in and out of but there has to be some way. I know someone who went through Libya I think met in Egypt (I think).

Good luck,

Sarah

It's not for us to judge whether or not its weird. I think you are likely to have difficulty waiving the 2 year meeting rule, but you never know. Can you afford to lose your $170 plus other expenses? Maybe it would be wise to invest in a consultation with a lawyer familiar with these kinds of issues before filing.



Ii hope someone here can offer more support and answers. Wishing you well on this journey

No we can't judge but I brought up the point about being comfortable with it because sometimes I get an idea in my head then when an outside party talks to me about it or makes a comment that helps me decide what to do. Good luck.

I can respect the issues at hand but want to say one thing. Sometimes we can get swept up in the heat of a relationship and not slow down long enough to think things through. You can sit 24 hours a day with someone on the internet, they can be the most wonderful human being on the planet, but I can assure you when you meet face to face you will discover you had some preconceived assumptions about them that you could never know the reality of without actually meeting. It was that way for me. Mohammed was a bit different in person because you just can't convey every nuance over the internet or telephone even with cam or voice. Sure he was the same personality, but I was much more comfortable getting to know the total package.

I know well what it feels like to yearn and long to just be together. You want to hurry and start the visa process because in these countries it can be a lengthy wait sometimes. But if there are red flags in his history that will make traveling to another Muslim country difficult, they will definitely reappear during the visa process. You may want to simply address those with a good attorney as was suggested. I think in this situation his red flags would make a waiver impossible to approve.

I understand your concerns and frustrations and I sure wish the best for both of you.

Hmmm where is Veiled Princess Layla...her SO is also from Libya :.............Laaaaaaaaaaaaayllllllllaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa whereeeeeeee aaaaaaaaaaaaaare youuuuuuuuuuuu?

Hi
Though my husband is jordanian, he was working in libya most of the time we processed, and with his work contract (not military, but still with the gov't) it was difficult for us to plan travel together, but it was still possible. I don't know specifically what he did for permission to travel, but it all started with convincing his employer that he intended to return.
Maybe he can get something in writing from his employer that he is absolutely not allowed to exit libya. Its easy to prove you can't enter libya......is a waiver impossible? who can say. its not the standard "its not convenient enough" hardship, so who knows.
I'll tell you this tho, valid us visa or not, if he doesn't have permission to exit, his passport aint leaving libya. Do you know for sure that he could exit anytime soon anyway? Is waiting til then to meet not an option?
I'm sure you'll figure something out

VP is an honorary Egyptian girl, even though here sweetie is Libyan. See if you can work out meeting in Cairo, fantastic city.

You will find wonderful supportive people here who offer thoughts in your best interests!

Had this thought about the possibility of a wavier-



With the current status of diplomatic relations between teh US and Libya, it does create a unique situation. My understanding is that the USC citizen needs to obtain a visa for travel to Libya but can only obtain it through a third country. There are other difficulties as the OP expressed- usually someone in Libya has to issue the invitation. If your fiance truely has extenuating circumstances that cause hardship to you that might not be easily explained here, you might be able to prove a waiver is appropriate.



I think the trick with such a wavier is that it has to be written out so precisely that facts are presented to support the USCIS guidelines. This is when a well qualified lawyer might be a great benefit to your case. If I were you, I would be hesitant to write the wavier myself. I would want a stronglegal agrument to adress it in terms USCIS would acknowledge.



Worse case scenario is the waiver asking for the exempting from having met is rejected. You would then have to find a different avenue to move forward. Given the difficulty being in Libya creates for the two of you, I imagine it is going to difficult the whole way through- especially when it comes to security checks after the interview level. You fiance might find himself on a list which could prohibit him from entering due to the problems the US had had with Libya in the past. I don't want to frighten you. I just want you both to understand the difficulties you MIGHT face.



Also I was just wondering is your fiance Libyan? a Libyan citizen?





Good luck!

If you read between the lines..her SO is a memeber of the military of Libya. He would have to defect in order to leave. Guess they dont allow their military out of the country. I think the background investigation of hime, if he did decide to leave would take years!!

Yes that's my thinking also...hard to keep track of this debate as it is going on in two different forums!

I wonder how long military service is required in Libya. In Egypt, it's 2 years, but many people can get out of it. However, once you're in, you're stuck for those 2 years. During that time, you're not allowed to marry a foreigner either.

If it's only a few years, then I guess they'd have to wait until he's done.

As I stated on the other thread, I think (and mybackpages confirmed) that Libyan visas are processed through Cairo, so he'd have to leave at some point to go for the interview, and then go back to Libya while waiting for AP. I can't imagine they would hand him the visa right after the Cairo interview.

Maybe best to find a lawyer who has experience dealing with visas for libyans.

This is what has me perplexed. Why would he be permitted to leave Libya, but not permitted to re-enter ? Is he a foreign national living "under the radar" ? If he is a "persona non grata" to the Libyan government, it seems they would arrest him at the first opportunity -- even when trying to exit the country. And even if he managed to obtain a K-1 visa (which is nigh impossible without meeting the requirements already mentioned,) he would still be detected by Libyan officials at his point of departure from Libya.

Also, if there are issues that prevent him from being allowed to return to Libya, it's possible that the same issues might also exclude him from eligibility for a U.S. visa.

Is there a possibility of him seeking political asylum ? Might be worth investigating.

Without getting a waiver (which is unlikely at best) his best option may be to leave Libya permanently, and then wait out the visa process (which could take upwards of a year or more, and is in no way guaranteed to be successful) in a third country.

Wishing you the best.



-MK

One more thing...



The Libyan government keeps very close tabs on its general population as far as communication with the "outside" -- they know who is calling who, and who emails who. If they are interested enough, they will make it their business to know every word that is exchanged.

If the OP's fiance is indeed a member of the Libyan military (as has been speculated) then the goverment already knows about his relationship with an American. He would already be under "investigation."

There must be more to this story than is being said.

This situation would be way too complicated for my liking. I'd simply step away from the computer (assuming you met online). I know easier said than done but this friggin process is hellish enough without any more complications.

SaroryH,
My husband is from Libya and he took a bus to Cairo to meet, marry and spend a three week honeymoon with me. They don't even have to get a visa or anything to travel to Egypt, he just had to have his passport from Libya.

I believe there may be some underlying problem that would prevent him from crossing the border to Egypt, Tunisia or Algeria (all of which should be perfectly safe for you to travel to). I got from your posts that he has a problem with the military... I hate to be the bearer of bad news but if he has avoided his military obligations then he's not going to get a visa much less a waiver.... one reason being that he has to get a paper from the military later on in the game to take to the embassy and if they won't give him something saying he's cool with the military then he's not getting a visa.... the second problem will be when it's time for his interview... if he can't leave the country to meet you in one of the coutries mentioned previously then how's he going to go to Tunis for his interview and go back home to wait for the one-three month standard wait from Tunis (up to a year for any ME/NA country I believe)??

If you really wanted to, and have the money for it, you can go to Libya now... you have to book your entire trip through an approved travel agent but I think it's possible. I would not recommend that since there is no US embassy there and I wouldn't want to get myself stranded in a foreign country alone in the event that he's not what/who you expected. I'm not questioning your relationship I'm just keeping it real and I think most of us were a little nervous the first time meeting our SOs in foreign lands... I believe there is a thread about registering with the embassies and such once you arrive open now.

See if he can go to Egypt or one of the other bordering countries... Egypt is my recommendation because Tunisia can tend to be a little on the expensive side for the average Libyan, and because I've been there and had a great time!!!! The shopping is awesome!!!!! Although I'm sure a few of the ladies here will disagree and recommend Algiers instead

Maybe he just needs to go to the military and arrange to make up time he's missed (or whatever problem he has with them) and they'll clear up whatever problem he has with them?

I agree with VP about it being easy to get into Egypt..that is if he doesn't have military problems.

My husband worked in Sallum which is on the border of Libya and Egypt. Libyans and Egyptians entered and exited both countries pretty easily from my understanding.

Every Libyan male is a "member of the military"


Yousuf has mandatory military service every year.... it does not prevent him from coming and going as he pleases as long as it's not while he's preforming said services.

Libyan visas are processed through Tunis.

I was just asking my husband about this situation with Libya last night because his cousin is married to a Libyan (man) and is living in Libya. He had no problems leaving Libya to come to Morocco to visit several times. There also is a man from our mosque who is from Libya. I'm not sure the auspices of how he came to the US but I do know that he can never return to Libya or he will be imprisioned, maybe it was asylum or some other reason that he left. So then my question is - is your fiance ready to never return to Libya - ever? As a few have said if he is having problems traveling even to other ME or NA countries how is he going to A) get out for the interview if he does get the visa, leave the country? So maybe if these circumstances are as severe as has been implied you would be better offer to petition for an asylum visa vs. a fiance visa? I think I would contact an attorney.

to the OP's credit, I know for real that you don't have to be a bad guy or have a suspicious situation for your travel to be restricted out of libya, and for many, its just not an open border.
if he wants out, he needs to get permision, and you cant help him with that. he has to do it and if he feels he has reason to avoid getting permission...end of story because they are not going to interview him discretly by phone. he will need to get into tunisia if the process got that far...and don't forget his police report or good conduct report, he'll need that too. My only point is that no one can help him do this, and if he thinks he can just get a visa and leave....at least the op is doing homework before filing anything.

Yes, he is a Libyan citizen and we hired an attorney today. Well the restrictions to Libya were removed but the US have not opened an embassy as it was announced in 45 days.We are scared but everyone here has been very nice and supportive. I will appreciate if you continue to post and help us and also if someone that has gone through something similar with a Libyan citizen can post. I guess our journey will be somewhat harder than others. Will try to plan for Cairo then, although it poses a great risk.




Yes, we did hire an attorney today. An yes he is prepared to not return ever.

Good luck and let us know how things progress. I think the lawyer is the best route, but they can make mistakes too. Learn as much as you can and stay in contact with him. He works for you after all



I can't imagine taking this difficult journey you are about to begin. You are in my prayers!

I posted on the other thread ... go meet in thailand..

Hello everyone! Wow i have been reading this thread and all i can say is... WOW. Sounds like to me that this girl needs to step back for a minute and think, is this man telling me everything? Samir and i are looking at this thread and have no idea why he is saying he cant leave and re-enter. Something sounds fishy here and the only advice i have for this woman is be careful and dont pursue this any further. Also how can you be engaged to someone you havent met yet? I just dont get it. Please for your own safety do not go to Libya.

It was the military issue - doesn't sound fishy to me.