First, I want to say I do not want this to because a ranting thread. I am very happy that Salwa received her visa so easily today. I guess I'm just a bit {really very} confused as to why some of us going through Egypt have this administrative review/process that lasts so long? I have seen people get approved 4 weeks after their interview, Jean has been waiting over 4 months and Amy and I are quickly approaching 6 months. Salwa, I love ya girl, but how did you do it? Please do not take this wrong, but are only men placed on AR/AP? My head is just spinning out of control today. Wael is still "pending checks." I've contacted my senators, but they cannot do anything till Wael is off the checks. What to do, what to do?

I can't speak for Egypt but almost all Afghan and Paki men i know going through Islamabad had AR/AP of varying lengths and i don't know of any women who had... good luck and hang in there.

I am sure it has to do with that Salwa is a woman... I had heard that makes a difference.

I'd have to say that the fact that she is a female beneficiary has alot to do with her quick approval , Go Salwa!!! . There are several reasons why I believe so. First of all, its quite common for a women in the Middle East to marry and come to the USA. Culturaly thats normal. Also when a man comes from the USA and asks for a womens hand, he usually does so with the permission of her family. Most men don't need their families blessings to get married. When there is family involvment, things seem more legit to the embassy.

I am not trying to offend anyone, but I am only posting my P.O.V. which even really applies to me since I am divorced.

Men in the Middle East and their families tend to want a bride that has never been married, has no children, and the families ofcourse want one of the same race and religion although. Obviously with new generations these things are changing. But from a Consular's perspective it really has not. They look at things from a general perspective and not that of the beneficiary.

Women also go through less backround checks than men do. There is obviously alot profileing done for certian relgions and backrounds, they can deny that all they want but you know when your name is Mohammed or Ahmed, etc that you are gonna go through some scrutiny.

Salwa didn't have very many red flags in her case. She is a woman (never married?), Full blown wedding with family pics, 3 visits, no big age difference, same religion, etc.

Again, I don't want to offend anyone, but these are just the general views of Middle Eastern people. I honestly never pictured myself marrying a Middle Eastern guy, especially after my divorce. I never even thought it would be acceptable, but I guess our new generation is changing.

It has more to do with the directive b y the consulates of the T26 countries to perform the necessary checks on males from these countries between the ages of 18 - 45. This is well documented. If you get a name hit, your wait will be longer because often you have to be manually verified.

Women generally have no difficulties getting through.

First I want to say again... I am thrilled to death for Salwa. I know how she suffered and for her its almost over. Enshaa Allah and alhamdulellah.


Now... the truth. I have cried myself sick today. I am depressed and upset. Seen all my silliness earlier in the threads? Covering for the fact I want to break furniture. Yes, being female skates you right the system. Again Salwa PLEASE know this is not intended against you or in any disrespect. It's your good fortune and you have to say alhamdulellah.

Two years ago while I was in Egypt, a tourist bus was bombed by 2 FEMALE terrorists... muslim women with bombs under their dresses. This was infront of the Cairo museum. But I guess they forget that. They target only the men, and yes historically I suppose they have reason to do so. However I have read all the "rules and regulations" and such and such twaddle about how they have to view all equally. Well, we know the reality.

I realize I'm leaving myself open to be flamed and that maybe my views aren't so rational right now. I have good reason. Life for my SO has gone to hell and he really is between a rock and a hard place. We really need him to be able to travel asap but there is not one F*CKING thing I can do to help him and its tearing me apart.

I don't understand the logic in Egypt. I don't understand any of this F*CKING process. I just know what its costing my life and Mohammed's life. And all I can do is sit and wait............... and wait........... and cry some more... and drag myself through my life every day with this pathetic hope that *my country* won't let me down. It makes me want to vomit.

I apologize for my language but I'm finding at the moment I just don't care...

Then I found my solution! I'll put a wig and a dress on Khallid!

Seriously, I am happy so Salwa, but I do understand Jasmines point of view. She and I have been talking for a while. She does not post here much because her son is very, very ill with leukemia. I did speak with Jasmine and she said I could tell all the girls on the the forum here because her son is in need of a lot of prayers. His cancer was in remission only for a year and came back even worse than before. She has tried expediting Waels visa for emergency reasons, but because of dear ol Cairo, they won't see to it. Wael wants to meet her son, her son meet him and they all have a little time together before her son passes. Yes, his cancer is that bad. Jasmine has always been a quite one on the boards here. I can't even begin to imagine how or what she is feeling right now. Being separated from the man you love, knowing your childs time on earth is very limited and knowing that the 3 of them won't be able to spend time together as a family. As much as I want Khallid here with me now, if I knew Khallid was getting his visa tomorrow, I would rather Wael get it so they can have a little time together.

I do understand how differerent families in the middle east are. I'm divorced, the only red flag I really know of. Oh yea, I suppose kids are a red flag too. I can't forget that woman asked Khallid why'd he ever want to marry a women with 2 kids! (HAG) Khallids family could care less what religion I am or the fact that I've been married before and have 2 kids. As far as names go, I'd love to see how many people in the U.S has my name! LOL! MILLIONS! In all seriousness, I just wish things were black and white across the board. No "oh you get your visa today, you get yours in 4 weeks, you in 8 weeks and who knows when they heck the rest of you will get them."

Let's all pray for Jaz and her son.

I know how you feel. I hope we can all get through this in one piece, mentally, physically and with still a marriage to come back to. It is criminal what this process does to familes.

Red flags have to do with the validity of the relationship. This has very little (if at all) to do with the AR/AP our guys face. The AR length is based on the checks that have been ordered, as you all know. I just wanted to make the distinction because if red flags were holding up your visa, then they would request action to be taken (additional info/RFE) or your petition would be sent back for verification.

Jasmine, my most solemn prayers are with you, your son and your SO. I pray to god things move for you as soon as humanly possible. You deserve this.

And I apologize for my outburst. I'm not handling things so gracefully presently. Sorry.

So would it be accurate to say that a consular could put you on AR/AP because of red flags?

[quote name='just_waiting' date='Aug 1 2006, 06:32 PM' post='348770']
[quote name='Zoloft Needed' post='348636' date='Aug 1 2006, 08:33 PM']
Two years ago while I was in Egypt, a tourist bus was bombed by 2 FEMALE terrorists... muslim women with bombs under their dresses. This was infront of the Cairo museum. But I guess they forget that. They target only the men, and yes historically I suppose they have reason to do so. However I have read all the "rules and regulations" and such and such twaddle about how they have to view all equally. Well, we know the reality.

[/quote]

These are many female terrorists and suicide bombers, but when its looked at from a big picture, the men outweigh the women.

All I am saying is it is more appropriate to ask for further information/rfe or return the petition, vs using AR/AP to review red flags. At least I have not seen that used, but sheesh, we can only guess I suppose.

Two years ago while I was in Egypt, a tourist bus was bombed by 2 FEMALE terrorists... muslim women with bombs under their dresses. This was infront of the Cairo museum.


In the eyes of Department Homeland Security the FEMALES were victims of the irrational teaching of a MAN. Please do not get me wrong , because I understand your frustration. However, we can not change the sterotypes that are place on the middle east man. Do I think the process is fair??? NO

Do I think that our government is trying to protect the country from another attack? Yes
Do I think they are doing it effectively? NO, they are actually causing more people to hate us than love us.
Do I think the immigration process is fair? NO

We should understand that Allah has a purpose for everything. I'm in the same position you are in because my fiance got his visa in May (after waiting for 2 years) and we planned to have our wedding shortly after his arrival to the USA, unfortunately he was denied entry and had to return back to Germany. Needless to say, he quit his job and gave up his apartment before his travel to the USA. He returned back to Germany the next day homeless and unemployed and I could not help him.

It is human nature to wonder why me. Instead, focus on the fact that Allah knows all and there's a reason we have to wait a long time to be with our SO and just maybe we are going through this test to be a better wife, friend and companion for our future spouse. The entire process is very difficult, however the end is near and soon you will hear some good news. Inshallah

Please don't take it the wrong way, I am only asking. In my opinion, certain "red flags" can encourage them to put the case on AR/AP instead of 1. denying it without viable proof or 2. issueing a visa. You know the "get it off my desk" mentality? I mean I know for certain that the Consulars have to have an understand of the culture and traditions of the countries they work for. So maybe when they see something "unusual" in their P.O.V., it may just push them to do that.

let me explain since Iam Egyptian and that was my case ...The Co wanted to make sure to see my family approval in my wedding JB it's not common at all for ME women to marry Americans " who are not from Egypt originally" My husband is a native American citizen so that's very rare in my culture and that's why I get chased with a lot of stares from people when Mark and I hang out..
Second I think My job has to do with approval to Iam a physican n and doctor get a good life in Egypt any way and they can easily travel around the world so that somehow excluded I married my husband for a visa! that's why I didn't get AR ..
for the AP I didn't get because Iam a female and as I said before it's very rare for women to marry western men because of cultue and women can't marry here without their family approval ...another reason that Egyptian men has very reputation of marrying American women for Visa ..everytime i went to the embassy for something I see Egytian young man marrying an American woman or American woman asking for help after her Egyptian husband has dumped her ..the Economy in Egypt is fallin apart so lots of Egyptian men do that to escape thier bad circumstaces..But of course not allof them is this way but Most are this way ...That's why MEn esp. FROM EGYPT will go through this...
Another reson I speak English very well that's why the CO was comfortable and smiling all the time becasue she can see I have no problem talking and communicating with her in English...
I am sorry for all those who Go through AP/AR I hope it will finish soon
Amy and Jean ..I am praying for you
Salwa:)

Sorry, I know sometimes I write VERY flat, which may come across as *brisk* ... its not intentional, I am multitasking.

From what I have witnessed, anything is possible, but with the requirements for AR/AP, and all the other agencies involved, and the *triggers* needed to initiate a check, I would doubt something like an age difference would be included in your length of AR/AP. They have other much different avenues to utilize in those circumstances.

This is what I meant, when I said its more common for women to marry and come to the USA. Many men go back home to find a "bride" so the Consular is used to seeing women go through. I know your husband is not Egyption, but a woman coming to the USA is still more common than the other way around.





I would tend to think that alot of undeserving people end of on AR/AP for reasons that can't be so easiely explained. I would agree that an age difference shouldn't make a difference in AP or AR but then from what I have seen people get handed that 221(g) paper faster than they can figure what hit them and sometimes without looking at proof. I think it would be a possibility that there is some profiling going on there regardless of what is written. And Salwa is abcoulutly right about the economy, its not good there and the fact that she has a good jod does make a difference.

Jean yeah I know I heard that and that was horrible but those 2 females was wearing black like saudi Arabian women and I doubt they are highly educated ...so I don't look like neither of them .

and Jean I really don't feel sad or annoyed from your words My god If I was in your place I would feel really WORSE..so realy god be with you









Yeah I have never married and my husband has the same job for 7 years and I am a doctor and speak fluent English











Amy My relatives and my uncle get annoyed when he knew that Mark was married before and My parents didn't tell them that Mark has a child he adopted with his ex-wife because they may gloat at us ..People thinkin here SUCK ,,

I forget to add that those kind of woman would never agree to marry a native american citizen or even any western men because they already hate western culture ..My friends all are very nice and not terrorist and no hate Us or Europe but they will ever marry any western man because marrying a man from thier home country means SECURITY..besdies communications is nto about langauge only it's about how the couple both of them see things

Ya think? LOL I'm a nurse practioner working for 13 years and Wael is a physician working for 10 years. Wael speaks fluent english, french and of course arabic and I speak fluent spanish, french and I'm working on the arabic. If job status were the case, he should've received his visa months ago. Salwa, will you need to continue your education once in the states? We've researched and Wael will have to take about 2 years more of college to practice as a physican in the states.


What blows my mind about this whole thing is that when my ex was stalking me, harrassing me, beating me, the authorities would shake a finger at him. It wasn't till he tried to run me over with his car that the tried to "protect" me. Now I'm being told my government is "protecting" me? BS! Sorry, that is my thought for the day. My sons dying wish is to see papa Wael. Seems I am asking too much.

Ya think? LOL I'm a nurse practioner working for 13 years and Wael is a physician working for 10




I didn't say my Job is the reason it's one of the reasons ..I had lots of evidences with me ..that's why The intevriew was not that easy as I said she checked on every single evidence I had and never say ENOUGH .. she saw everything I swear..I also had like 150 photos of Mark and I together and 2 ablums with Egagemnt and wedding photos and honey moon photos and photos with my family

yes I have to study again in USA to be able to work as a doctor ..

Profiling is correct. Its part of their workflow. Just out of curiosity, who are the undeserving people who end up on AR/AP? Is it the same as underserving people who had their NOA2's revoked due to IMBRA?

Even with all that has been said, Its too hard to compare apples and oranges and be able to figure out why it happens sometimes and sometimes it doesnt.

From what I have seen and heard, there is no pattern, no given tell-tale signs, and in some cases you would have better luck betting in Vegas that to figure out the outcome.

I mean given that Salwa is a Dr., you would think that she would get a visitor visa quite easily as she has shown meaningful ties to her country. If you go by what the book says, she should have gotten the visitor visa.

I think it comes down to timing, mood, luck. In my case, for the last 5 weeks I have heard of people in Jordan getting their interview dates moved up and yet we have not recieved a call. I have no explanation as to why and you know what, to be honest, I am fine with the outcome. I think focusing on who got what and why just makes it harder for me.

All of our cases are so different sometime I wonder if I am here for the friendship or information....

Never even asked for our evidence

IMBRA can't be compared to a 5 min interview which ends in a 221(g). What does even have to do with IMBRA?

There are many people that went to the embassy with all their proof which was never even looked at. That to me is undeserving. I don't think protocol is followed in all cases.



That is undeserving....

Oh may be that's the mistake you made because she never did too in my interview but Iam the one who told her to see them ! and that's why she started to check on all of them she never asked fo any evidence untill i gave it to her..


Jb you are definetely RIGHt about my visitor visa because she denied me for no reason and i had the papers from my school and Minitry of forgein affairs signed to prove I must come back since by then i didn't graduate yet and i "must" have had come back to get my degree in Egypt other wise i will never be able to be a Doctor!!

Yes it seems like you have to force your evidence on the CO... brining little pictures and evidences out while telling the story and keep it coming.

exactly that's what i did ...because i read on VJ so many people go to the interview and never being asked for evidences and then get REF for evdiences!!! so I forced her to see all my evdiences

[quote name='jordanianprincess' date='Aug 1 2006, 11:14 PM' post='349002']

Never even asked for our evidence [/quote]

That is undeserving....
[/quote]


At face value I would have to disagree. I don't know the details around the interview, so maybe I am speaking out of turn, BUT if the beneficiary is from the T26 country and is male between the ages of 18 - 45 he is subject to AR.

Now if we are talking about a returned petition without the acceptance of evidence, THAT is a major problem, and we have been seeing it in consuls such as Casa.

Again, I don't know the specifics, but sounds like typical AR, no?

I think there is alot of truth to this, add in the fact of being nervous, maybe not speaking english so well, and yes it becomes an issue

Also I dont think many go in there with the expectation that they are going to run the interview.




Key word is being "subject", but not everyone gets it. There are no patterns that can be followed

I also think Christian males get it too really easy.because I know someone he is male and he had DCF and he got approved the same day and got teh visa without any Ap or AR even though...so listen to this they married in the 14 Feb and they filed a DCF 2 weeks later so that should be at the beging of March and he ahd his intevriew in 24 April I think and he was approved the same day and got the visa too....
his wife is a friend of Mark's friend that how we get to know them

Not everyone gets it for AS LONG as others, but trust me, everyone gets it. Even those who are approved on the same day. I guess I just happen to believe there are patterns

How do you get AR when you are approved same day?




I agree with this as well, for some reason in the Middle East the passports are branded with the relgion.

Some people are approved the same day and get their visa the same day... how can they ensure picking up their visa the same day if they go on AP/Ar?

deleted.

Its on the passport and birth certificate

JP...yeah.. read that too late...

he didn't get any Ar or Ap...he was approved and the visa was sent to him at his home....
although he filed in Cairo embassy for DCf and he get the interview after one month and my intevriw took 2 months to be schduled after I sent my package!!!!

Jasamine,

I'm deeply sorry for what you're going through. My heart goes out to you. I have added you to my prayers. To have your son sick and going through this process is just beyond anything I can express...

I understand everyone's frustration... we all deserve to speak our minds.

I understand what you mean Jean since my fiance is in a similar situation. He is between a rock and a hard place and I can't do anything to help him. It's soooooooooooooo frustrating.

I just don't understand this system... My fiance and I are both from Iran, we're Moslems, and we've been out of Iran for years. We speak the same language... we are from the same city... BUT because of his first name being a religous name he has been on AP since May of last year. Our case hasn't even make it to the consulate. How much checking can they do when all they have is a name and a birth date. They don't even have his fingerprints... Obviously we had a name hit and GOD knows how long more we're suppose to wait. AND no one can do anything about it... Sometimes I just want to scream...it's not fair...

So I understand how you feel... I told my guy our places should have been reversed... then I probably be here by now ... I'm soooo happy for all of you who have your visa... It gives me hope... I wish to GOD that we have some movement soon... The waiting drives me crazy.

Best to all of you and please pray for us who are still waiting.

Jasmine, hang in there...

Salwa congrats again... you worked hard for this

and everyone else keep posting

Yasi

the names too ..chrsitian has very diiferent names than Muslims

1-2-3 DRAW

You are right about that Salwa, My husband met this guy from egypt and he's christian and he got his K3 approved very quickly. He told my husband it didn't take too long for him to get his visa..

have to add as soon as my husband heard the egyptian guys name he knew he was christian. Guess they just know the difference.

What kind of name would you say Balamane is?

Really? my man just turned 46!!!! Take him off the AR guys

Yes, last names are a big tell-tale signs but more so for arabs. I'm not quite sure if a Consular would know all the names, I sure don't. Too many!

I am sure there are a myriad of reasons I am not familiar with, however the simplest example would be, no name hit, no TAL trigger or level of education concern, military background (where applicable).

I am just giving examples. Like I said, I do happen to believe there is a pattern.

ouch.

My parents have many Egyptian Christian friends and they seem to have relative ease in obtaining tourist visas. My parents will send a letter of invite that of course mentions their religion in some way, and next thing you know they are here. The have ties to Egypt, but nothing overwhelming (bank accounts, job, apartment).

And as Salwa mentioned, Egyptian Christians often have distinctly different names.

Rebecca

Yeah but my birth certificate says Iam Muslim ..and the translation too

Yeah Rebecca what you said is very true ..that's why I noticed in the embassy by being there 3 times ..Christian is definetly getting it so easy ..do you see any one here in ME from Egypt and married to Christian and waiting on AR/AP I doubt it!!!

I think the "name hit" is valid. But level of education is questionable, Zoloft said her man is a physician. What do you mean by military backround? Do you mean they served or did not serve?

I mean I can definitly see some things people have in common, but no patterns, but then again we only what is told here on VJ. Maybe if we knew all the details we could come to a better conclusion.?