I became engaged in May and was gathering everything to get ready to apply for a K1 visa for her from the Philippines. She is one month pregnant now. We are deciding still what to do and what is best for her. Can anyone offer a suggestion?

I am considering to return there in January so we can marry thats earliest i can go. I know that prcess will take longer if I go that route to petition her as a spouse and with our child. Or is it better for me to still apply for K1 as soon as possible and hope she gets approved before our babay is born( I am not optimistic about that).
Thank you

Go on with K1 probabaly best way. maybe by the time you're considering to return there would be close for her interview if you can file your petition soon. also include copies of paper for her pregnancy, another evidence. Good luck!

Thanks for your advise I had talk to make sure she is ok to go that way and thats our plan I am preparing K1 now. Can you tell me moer about what documents would be helpful about her prgancy, doctors note of course and I will sunmit notarized letter too. Thanks again

If the baby is born before you marry it will be illigitimate in the philippines. You will have to adopt the baby in the Pilippines even when you marry. To get a to get US citizenship from birth you will have to legitimize the baby in the usa then file the cousular report of the birth abroad. If the baby is born after the marriage you dont have those problems.

My baby was born a month before we married. I wish we had been married when she was born. There would have been several less things to deal with...

For me marrying first would have been the best option, but I'm certainly not going to say wheter it would be the best option for you.

One thing is is that new law only affect K1 and not K3's if thats the case maybe now K3 will be quicker. Can you do something like the milatary has been doing when a situation like this arises and they have a legal weddind via a video confrence and that way you get it done and legal asap and then file with out haveing to wait for your trip in Jan. As a world travler if that does not work haow about a 4 day road trip to PI go get wed come right back. Lastly I do not know her religious beleaifs but you can do a NON legal wedding that will cover all the emotional base for her in Jan and then make it legal in the USA.

Good Luck

A 4 day road trip cant be done. To marry in the Philippines you first have to get a affidavit of no legal impediment to marry at the embassy. When I was there the embassy in Manila was closed for 3 or 4 days because of a threat... once you have the affidavit you need to get the marriage license and then wait 10 days before the ceromony can take place.

I arrived Dec 1 planning to marry Dec 17, because of the embassy threat, and the holidays we were not able to marry till Dec 27. If you get married there its probably best to plan to give yourself a little extra time.... Also in my case it was definatety worth marrying there even with all the hassle and I got to be with my wife and baby a little longer.

But the idea of having to adopt my baby in the philippines still bothers me...if she could have waited a few more weeks
oh well..

Legitimation need not occur in the US. For as long as the US citizen father can prove that the baby is his biological child to the satisfaction of the US embassy, the child will be recognized as US citizen and will be issued a US passport within days. The embassy prefers that the USC accompany the child when registering the birth. DNA testing may be ordered if paternity is doubted.

To file Consular Report of Birth Abroad (CRBA), you need the following:

1) Baby's NSO-issued birth certificate
2) Evidence of US citizenship of the parent claiming US citizenship (passport, birth certificate, etc.)
3) Marriage certificate (if not married see legitimation requirements below)

http://usembassy.state.gov/posts/rp1/wwwhlegt.html
Legitimation Requirements

Persons born out of wedlock to U.S. citizen father and not legitimated by the natural parents' subsequent marriage can be legitimated under the Immigration and Nationality Act by one of the two methods indicated below, provided: (1) a blood relationship between the person and the father is established by clear and convincing evidence, (2) the father was a United States citizen at the time of the person's birth.

Legitimation Method 1 - the U.S. citizen father must submit evidence showing that he had legal residence or domicile in any of the U.S. states (after his child's birth and before his child's 15th or 21st birthday - see table below) in order to use the laws of the state to legitimate the applicant. This evidence may include driver's license, voter registration card, rental/mortgage/bank receipts, military records, old letters (with U.S. return address), etc. Legitimation requirements vary depending on the State legitimation law,

OR

Legitimation Method 2 - The person can be legitimated if:

the father (unless deceased) has agreed in writing to provide financial support
for the person until the person reaches the age of 18 years and,
while the person is under the age of 18 years -
the person is legitimated under the law of the person's residence or domicile,
the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath, or
the paternity of the person is established by adjudication of a competent court.

For more info on consular report of birth abroad and acquiring US passport, click here: http://usembassy.state.gov/posts/rp1/wwwha003.html

Once, the child has a valid US passport, there is no need to include him/her in the petition. On a remote chance that it is not possible to file a CRBA, a child born while a K1 is pending can still be included in the petition by informing the embassy.

Sorry

patiently waiting

you are dead wrong

The ONLY way a child can be legitimized by an american citizen is either through the judicial process or through filing the proper forms in the fathers home state...

Geezer,

The Manila Embassy website that I cited speaks for itself.

Your argument supports Legitimation Method No. 1, no quarrel about that. But you also have to consider Legitimation Method No. 2. "Persons born out of wedlock to U.S. citizen father and not legitimated by the natural parents' subsequent marriage can be legitimated under the Immigration and Nationality Act by one of the two methods indicated below x x x

PW

Yes it would be easier but just for getting child citizenship is not necesarry.Our son was born couple of months before we get married and we don't have no problem getting his u.s. citizenship. all we did is bring our marriage license to NSO and have the baby legitimized without no problem at all. as long as you have evidence that suffice everything you'll be fine. we should get our child u.s. passport in PI before coming here (u.s.a.)but since my husband can get his u.s.passport to me(as evidence) coz he was out of country that time then we decided we'll be getting his citizenship once we get here and we did.

Patiently waiting The statute is clear. For a baby born now you muct use legitizimatization method 2. Which states "the person is legitimated under the law of the person's residence or domicile."

JR I'm glad it worked out for you. But for me it was very important that I file a consular report of the birth abroad with the embassy and my daughter was recognized as being a us citizen at birth.

We are in a similar situation - I filed the fiancee' visa in Feb. Mommy's interview is in Manila, probably early October. The baby's due date is Aug 20 though. I will file a CRBA for the baby as soon as I get the NSO certificate. Be sure your name is on the certificate and keep documentation that you both were together at the time conception. You will also need another affadavit of support notarized in the US or their are a few notaries in Manila acceptable to the US embassy(see their website).

We(all 3 of us) will have to attend an interview at the embassy, separate from the fiancee' visa interview. Looks like the baby's US passport and Mommy's Fiancee' Visa will arrive about Mid October so we can all travel to America on Columbus Day -- Hooray.

I like the back plan of being able to add the baby's name to the finacee visa application also.

The Health care system in the PI is scary. The best hospital I could find is Makati Medical, the Best ob-gyne Doctora I could find is the one Lea Solanga used for her recent delivery. Looks like it will cost about $2000 US to have the baby there. Mommy lives in Olongapo so it is an all day bus ride to Manila for each doctora visit. As the due date approaches, Mommy will have to live in an apartment near Makati Medical - another $900 in rent.

So for about $3,000 out of pocket, you can get some decent medical care and control much of the risk of giving birth in a 3rd world country. Of course if my government had seen fit to expedite legal immigration they way they are trying to expedite illegal immigration, and, given the infant lortality ratyes in the PI, my little family would be off to a much better start and our baby would have a much better chance at survival it the baby could be born in the US under my health care insurance which woul only cost $10 out of pocket per visit instead of $3,000 usd.

Yes! the embassy in manila give us a copy of consular report of our child being born abroad and was recognized as a u.s citizen at birth.

JR We are talking about a K1/K2 visa. About birth of child before marriage. A k4 is for child of spouse..not child of fiance. Thats why I said at the beginning for me marrying was the best option.

Yes geezer, the statute is indeed very clear and it says right there that a person can also be legitimated if "the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath". Legitimation "under the law of the person's domicile" which is the route you took, is just one of the options and not the only way, as you said.

I cite again the US embassy website where I picked up the info and highlighted the relevant info:

http://usembassy.state.gov/posts/rp1/wwwhlegt.html
Legitimation Method 2 - The person can be legitimated if:

-the father (unless deceased) has agreed in writing to provide financial support for the person until
the person reaches the age of 18 years and,

while the person is under the age of 18 years:
-the person is legitimated under the law of the person's residence or domicile,
-the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath, or
-the paternity of the person is established by adjudication of a competent court.



It doesn’t matter if baby is K2 or K4, illegitimate or legitimate. If one of the parent is a US citizen and paternity is acknowledged, then he/she will be issued a CRBA. CRBA is a requirement for issuance of US passport. No CRBA, no US passport.

Geezer, I’m sorry if you have to go the route of having your child legitimated under the laws of your residence or domicile. You may have been advised wrongly. There is an easier way. As you can see, we have a few members here who were able to get US citizenship for their children without going the route you took.

To Brian and Marie, the arrival of your baby will hardly affect your petition. You have the option of having the baby recognized as US citizen (the best option) or you can amend the K1 petition and include him/her as K2 later.

Persons born on or after 11/14/86 can ONLY use method #2...

Exactly. We are talking here about children yet to be born so that definitely covers them.

There are 3 requirements for legitimization under method 2

1. the father (unless deceased) has agreed in writing to provide financial support
for the person until the person reaches the age of 18 years

2. while the person is under the age of 18 years the person is legitimated under the law of the person's residence or domicile

3. the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath, or the paternity of the person is established by adjudication of a competent court.

All three need to be met not one or two of the three but all 3.

Miller v Albright 523 U. S. 420 at 431 (1998)

I don’t think there would be a competent court in the Philippines that would hear a case wherein the natural father petitions for the adoption of his natural and biological child. That is absurd. If your name is recorded in the birth certificate as the father, then the child is yours.

No wonder you unnecessarily dealt with a lot of things. You misunderstood the requirements.

You only needed to meet one of the three. Don’t you think it’s rather absurd to have to go through all three legal processes just to acknowledge paternity of your child?

You also posted the requirements differently than how the embassy website posted it just so it would suit your argument. This is how the embassy website posted the requirements:

"Legitimation Method 2 - The person can be legitimated if:

1__the father (unless deceased) has agreed in writing to provide financial support for the person until the person reaches the age of 18 years and,
2__while the person is under the age of 18 years -
____1. the person is legitimated under the law of the person's residence or domicile,
____2. the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath, or
____3. the paternity of the person is established by adjudication of a competent court."

and this is how you posted yours which would make it appear that indeed you have to fulfill all 3 requirements:

"1. the father (unless deceased) has agreed in writing to provide financial support
for the person until the person reaches the age of 18 years

2. while the person is under the age of 18 years the person is legitimated under the law of the person's residence or domicile

3. the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath, or the paternity of the person is established by adjudication of a competent court."

Anyway Geezer, believe what you want to believe. I don’t wonder anymore why you had such difficulty having your baby recognized as a US citizen.

At any rate, let's see what happens with tomnjas when they register their baby. Do keep us posted with developments tomnjas.

The above case mentions a Fil-Am child born in the 70s who sought US citizenship after she reached the age of majority and involves other issues that are complicated (American father was not around when child was born, birth certificate was left blank for father's name, nationality left blank, father did not have contact with child or child's mother, American father acknowledged child belatedly after she reached age of majority).

This is a different case than what is being discussed here.

In the US the Supreme Court says what the law is... not posters on a forum. It you look at the case at the page I cited Mr. Justice Stevens enumerates what the requirements for legitimization are these are what I posted and you chose not to believe.... You may disagree but I think Ill take the word of the United States Supreme Court Justice.

Also the Philippine family code provides at Art. 165. "Children conceived and born outside a valid marriage are illegitimate, unless otherwise provided in this Code." If the poster was to qualify under these exceptions then they would not have a problem, I did not.

When we registered the childs birth the civil register quite clearly stated that I would need to adopt even though the child bears my name and I acknowledged paternity on the birth certificate.

This discussion illustrates the problems with taking advice on a forum. An opinion that works for one or even the majority most likely wont work for everyone.

Sorry... But I'm going through the K3 process, and it's deflinitely affected by the new IMBRA. Maybe not directly, but the delay IMBRA has caused our K3 is insane! And now I've got an RFE pending because of it. Argh!

To the original poster, sorry for hijacking your thread. This has become a discussion thread between me and geezer and I apologize. This will be my last post on this thread.

Geezer, you and I are both posters and VJ members know that we are not lawyers here and we talk only about our own experiences and that our knowledge are limited but can be expanded by learning from other people's experiences. VJers have the option to either follow or ignore the advise. We do not make the decision for them. Therefore to be safe, I always support my advise with links to the website where I get my information. And the one that I linked in this thread is that of the US Embassy in Manila who I assume still follows the laws of the United States of America and the United States Supreme Court.

We are actually reading the same law but the two of us interpret it differently. People here have had their children recognized as US citizens without having to go through what you went through. I have two Fil-Am nieces who were recognized as Americans without so much ado. They were recognized in a few hours and passports were issued in a few days. They only needed to be acknowledged by their American father.


Note the words, unless otherwise provided in this Code. You would have qualified if you were advised wisely.

Art. 177-181, Executive Order No. 209 of the revised Family Code of the Philippines provides for the legitimation of illegitimate children. Here’s the link to our revised Family Code.
http://www.chanrobles.com/executiveorderno209.htm


Don’t take what some government people tell you at face value. Sometimes they don’t know what they’re talking about. I’m sure you’ve read all about the horror stories in the “misinformation line” of the USCIS, NVC, and other US government agencies.

On how to legitimize a child, here is the link http://www.census.gov.ph/data/civilreg/birth.html

Read “What is legitimation and who can be legitimated?” on requirements and procedures to follow.

The birth certificate of an illegitimate child will be annoted by the words “Legitimated by Subsequent Marriage" indicating the family name which the child shall bear by virtue of the legitimation.

I couldn’t agree more!

As I’ve said Geezer, do what you have to do. All I’m saying is that there is an easier way to having a child recognized as US citizen. Our VJ members have the option to do it your way (which was difficult as you’ve experienced) or they could choose to do it another way (which I believe is easier and less stressful).

And with that, I'm out of this thread.

PW

Wait a minute! But after taking a second look at the law, can someone please confirm that what I’m looking at right now is how the law should be interpreted? It is not the father’s domicile that is in question, but the child’s! (italics mine)

while the person is under the age of 18 years:

-the person (child) is legitimated under the law of the person's (child’s) residence or domicile
-the father acknowledges paternity of the person (child) in writing under oath, or
-the paternity of the person (child) is established by adjudication of a competent court

If it is what I think it is, we know now where the confusion lies.

I'm done with this thread also, I'll just cite what I'm relying on ...the primary evidence requirements for legitimation is contained in 8 CFR 204.2(d)(2)(ii) which reads:

Primary evidence for a legitimated child or son or daughter. A child can be legitimated through the marriage of his or her natural parents, by the laws of the country or state of the child's residence or domicile, or by the laws of the country or state of the father's residence or domicile. If the legitimation is based on the natural parents’ marriage, such marriage must have taken place while the child was under the age of eighteen. If the legitimation is based on the laws of the country or state of the child's residence or domicile, the law must have taken effect before the child's eighteenth birthday. If the legitimation is based on the laws of the country or state of the father's residence or domicile, the father must have resided—while the child was under eighteen years of age—in the country or state under whose laws the child has been legitimated. Primary evidence of the relationship should consist of the beneficiary's birth certificate and the parents’ marriage certificate or other evidence of legitimation issued by civil authorities.

The embassy web site is much like this discussion. It states the portion of the statutes that apply to the majority of the petitioners. However, as you can see from the regs there are actually 3 acceptable methods of legitimation. What works for one may not work for all...... and thats all I have to say

Just wanted to close out that the CRBA process for a child born before the K1 visa was approved was fairly simple.

Just be sure the UCS's father's name is on the NSO Birth certificate -- which must be on Security Paper, complete the forms and affadavits(you can even get them notarized at the USE and on good days, if you bring the baby with you during the notary, you might even get an appointment the same day), send in the forms, call ACS at the USE make an appointment, bring pics and docs of your relationship at the time of conception AND your baby to the appointment(yes, they do look at the child's face etc for similiarities to the USC father).

Probably the most important document is the one the USC father signs acknowledging paternity and support until age 18.

We all flew to the US in October, the Baby on a USA Passport and the Mother on a K1 visa. the Baby will have a sibling in November..all's well that ends well.