I think that's a fair point and a good point of view. But it's pretty discouraging to see people from May at Vermont get notification that their RFE has already been sent out when people from March at CSC are still waiting waiting waiting.

Zethris, you're right. No one aside from people who were unfortunate enough to have their petitions recalled from the consulate have received any kind of official communication from USCIS indicating that we are affected by this. They seem to have taken the view from day one that not telling us anything is the way to go.

It may be that the majority of the applicants, they assume, are not DIY'ers like we are and aren't at this message board (or a few other competing ones) so they may think that lack of communication until an RFE arrives will lead the petitioner to believe this is all just a normal part of the process. Business as usuall. Very CIA/NSA skunkworks of them.

Honestly I would not be surprised if this is the case. The American Government plays on our ignorance all the time like this. Sneaking in laws, and policy changes without our true awareness. IMBRA is a sign of the times. But it's just one of many things that our government has been doing lately (last 12 years) across the board. Corporations own it now. So these slight handed new laws and policies will be more and more prevalent as the years go on.

I read in other threads about people from CSC getting an email saying their RFE has been sent.

Same thing with someone with a recalled petition.

They are probably just sending it to everyone.

There´s no way to predict when they will touch a particular case.

We have people from Vermont with receipt dates from March, April and May saying their RFEs are on their way.

I just want to know if they work on saturdays, even if they don´t take phone calls.

My status doesn´t change since my case was approved back in April.

I never received communication from USCIS or anybody. The Moscow Embassy called Diana in late May to tell her that her interview date had been cancelled, and that is the grand total of the official communications that have been received by both of us!!!

Also, when checking my status online on the USCIS webpage it is still saying the same damned thing it was saying in late March: This case has been approved....

Tuekros,

We started a thread for those of us with approaved NOA2 and cancelled interviews

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18011

I hope they will start sending out RFEs for K3 soon too....... Looks like K3 are stuck and nobody is getting any RFEs on them......

So finally the RFE´s are out. Great!

Hi folks. I don't post anymore, I have been married a year now and don't really have the need for VJ anymore, although I do monitor the process for some friends and out of general interest. This is in the New York Times today. If it should be in a more relevant thread, someone please copy it over to it, so people can see this. My personal take on this entire subject, well, I will put it under the story, if anyone is interested.



The New York Times
Printer Friendly Format Sponsored By

June 18, 2006
Change in Visa Paperwork Stalls 10,000 Trips to the Altar
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

WASHINGTON, June 17 (AP) — Wedding plans have been delayed for 10,000 American citizens seeking visas for their foreign brides and grooms as the Homeland Security Department works on new paperwork for their applications.

The form change was required as part of a law, enacted in March, to protect foreign mail-order brides from abusive American spouses. But Homeland Security missed a deadline three months ago, putting the visa applications of thousands of law-abiding couples in limbo.

The department said this week that it would send out additional forms to the visa seekers for more information that should satisfy the new law's protections.

But the bureaucratic entanglement has halted wedding plans for many couples.

"We were ready to get married this year, but I can't really make a date until we get the approval," said Bill Hall, 41, a construction foreman from Burlington, Vt. He applied two months ago for a visa for his fiancée, to emigrate from Canada with her two sons.

"We're just kind of here, in limbo," Mr. Hall said. "And it's kind of aggravating — it's a real simple thing they have to do, and they're making more of it than they need to."

He said his application, sent to Homeland Security in April, "never got approved. It's just sitting there."

All sides agree that the new law is a well-intentioned effort to protect women.

Spurred by stories of mail-order brides — largely from Eastern Europe and Asia — being abused by their American husbands, Congress approved new protections for the women in December.

The protections included amending the application form for visas to ask if the romance was arranged by an international marriage broker, and if the American citizen had ever been accused of a violent crime or convicted of three or more alcohol- or drug-related crimes.

President Bush signed the law in January, putting Homeland Security under order to draw up the new paperwork. But the forms were not finished by March 6, when the law took effect, resulting in the department shelving all spousal visa applications written on the old forms that were received after that date.

Chris Bentley, a Homeland Security spokesman, said about 10,000 applications were currently being held because they did not address the criminal or marriage-broker issues.

"They did not have all of the information needed to determine whether someone qualified or not," said Mr. Bentley, who works for the department's Citizenship and Immigration Services.

He added, "It's certainly an inconvenience brought about by the new requirements of the law."

Homeland Security said it would send additional forms to the 10,000 couples to get answers to the new questions.

Senator Maria Cantwell, Democrat of Washington, criticized Homeland Security this week as getting cold feet about quickly processing the new regulations that she helped write.

"Security and safety should be their top consideration, but their long visa process delays are putting a lot of people's lives on hold," Ms. Cantwell said in a statement.

Mr. Hall said he was frustrated with the visa delays for people trying to follow the law at a time when the Bush administration is grappling with giving other benefits to illegal immigrants.

"I thought it was ironic," Mr. Hall said. "And I find it unfair."

END OF STORY.

Okay, me again. My knowledge of this deal is that it was done by people who really don't want to see men getting foreign women. They don't think it is fair, they don't like it. So they got it stuck in a law, and tough **** for you guys, you have had it too good for too long. You American women on this site can whine about this, tough for you, you are just collateral damage, they are willing to sacrifice you for the greater good of their principles. They probably think you don't really know what is good for yourself anyway, but it is the men that really **** them off. And what is amazing to me is that we can have some 10 million or god knows how many illegals in this country, and the authorities don't do squat, and yet they find a way to target this small niche of legal citizens who follow a legal process. And what is really funny, there are far more illegal men who bring in illegal women (from their countries of origin) to marry, and then have legal children, which gives them kings x, as our country does not go after the parents of U. S. citizens. Yet they ignore that, because they are illegal already, and as they have shown contempt for the laws, and the system has proven that they will not go after them anyhoo, what would be the point of messing with them? Really, one can see why it would be better just to forget about following the process, and instead just follow the Mexicans They really cannot stop the illegals, and don't even try. In my state, it is actually better to be illegal in some ways, as the system is overwhelmed, and so the authorities just ignore the minor infractions by the illegals. Legals are worth messing with, as they actually have to pay for their crimes. I followed the process, it is a total pain in the rear to go thru it, but looking at it now, I gotta say, it is getting awfully close to being to a point where it is too big a burden. And I think that is the future of this legal process, death by a thousand cuts, at some point, it is just too difficult to do (legally). Every step in the process is a total pain, and now this stupid IMBRA. I am already done, but I have contacted my so called representatives in government, who respond with stupid form letters (if at all) about different issues, as they don't have a stupid form letter for IMBRA. If you want to complain, give them an earful, I did, for you guys who are trying to follow the process now and in the future. My sympathies to you all, our government is ******* pathetic.

This article is now flying all around as it seems.

Has anyone noticed that the AILA processing date for Nebraska has moved to 5/29? What is this?? They move our cases to CSC, who's date is still 2/3 and then change the date for Nebraska by months??? I really don't get what they are up to.

I think no one is..
not even USCIS itself.

I wonder if they will respect the NOA1 dates.

They are not considering it to send the RFEs, that´s for sure.

Indeed, people ahead of us are getting it, as well as people not recalled.

I'll take issue with this. That is simply not accurate. As frustrating as everyone is feeling about the delays, let's be sensible about this. The days may soon be over for Mail-Order Bride services. That doesn't mean if you're an American dating a foreign woman, you can't bring her over. It just means if you bought her out of a catalog, you're going to have some 'splainin' to do to immigration. Illegal immigration is a whole other issue that is being debated and dealt with by politicans right now - let's not try to compare.

But NSC's date of the report is 6/15. CSC & VT are still on the date of 5/22. Soon, it will all become clearer methinks. pLus, as we have heard, NSC isn't doing fiance visas anymore...

Nope, I just found out they aren't. My friend who works at the lawfirm I am using as representation just came over for breakfast and told me that even though they were able to get them to start sending out RFE's sooner than 30 more days, the RFE's they are sending out are the ones they have on hand, and are most recent first which can take a month to get through. Then they will start sending us RFE's and will be processed in the order the RFE's arrive. So it's as if the NOA2 no longer matters. Once it goes back to the embasy, it will be put in the que in the order it was recieved in the very back of the line. So another 2-5 months wait once it arrives at the embasys before we get our interview dates.. So it's almost as if we haven't even applied yet. I expressed my outrage, and he explained that this is the kind of game they try to play. You ask them to do something and they do it half assed IF they even agree to it. So the next thing they are going to do is try to setup some meetings with some key folks (I have no idea who they are) at the DHS and work with them on implementing a true FIFO system to prevent this from happening again when they add other new hairbrained laws.




No in many ways that statement is accurate. There are many politicians who are exactly that way regardless of mail order or not. They are so xenophobic that they will be making it harder and harder to get anyone here. What StevenJinky said was just one group of the many xenophobe's that are causing such problems for us.

this is vey disturbing, I must say I felt the anger rush through my whole being upon reading this post. these half-brained morons

Yeah, my fury kind of shows with the bad writing I typed. Maybe when I calm down i'll edit it and type it out a bit better. But I don't see that happening any time soon.

Hi Top-Gorilla, You certainly covered all the bases and I could not agree more. IMBRA has nothing to do with protecting women, and everything thing to do with social engineeering in an attempt to block men from marrying non-US women. You are right, women petitioners caught in this toxic legislation are considered by IMBRA backers to be collateral damage.

The law is targeted to a tiny, sub-set, niche corner of marriages. The true evil of this law is found when one looks at who is exempted from compliance:
"The Non-Profit": a traditional matchmaking organization of a cultural or religious nature which offers its services on a non-profit basis under law". There is not one shred of evidence that these organizations have a lower rate of spousal abuse cases than couples that met through any other circumstances! This special-interest exemption is pure social engineering, and has no basis in reality.

What really pains me is that I, as a man, have always identified as a feminist. Indeed, I put myself in harms way in Mobile, Alabama, Pensacola FL, and Jackson MS back in 1993-94 as a regular volunteer clinic escort for the women trying to enter the besieged womens clinics. Remember the murders of Dr. Patterson? Dr. Gunn? Dr. Britton? This law, IMBRA, has flipped me 180 degrees, and I feel like I have been stabbed in the back by the feminist movement. I never have felt driven to use words like that before.

The backers of IMBRA are trying to murder our right to marry who we choose. The migration of the human race over the face of the earth, and to inter-marry with other tribes and cultures is as old as the human race. Were it not for inter-marriage none of us would be here today. It is an evolutionary truth and a basic human right.

If the IMBRA backers REALLY wanted to help women, they would have worked to change conditions in the very countries that have an atrocious record of womens rights. Not target a tiny group of people willing to endure months and sometimes years of DHS and USCIS's convoluted and broken fiancee visa process. Some of our fiancee's are at risk every minute because of the countries that they live in - the IMBRA backers admitted as much!

Yes, IMBRA drew its support from those that believed the "Mail-Order Bride" fantasy to be true. We here on VisaJourney, know the "Mail-Order Bride" does not exist. And we know that to be a derogatory, ugly description. Comparable to any racial epithet.

Thanks for your post Top-Gorilla, I think there are a lot of people that feel like you. And as more innocent visa applicants get caught in IMBRA's deadly undertow, action will be taken to strike this terrible legislation.

[quote name='zethris' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:39 PM' post='258363']
[quote name='Aquelunya' post='258355' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:33 AM']
[quote name='zethris' post='258341' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:32 AM']
[quote name='rlt' post='258227' date='Jun 18 2006, 09:51 AM']
I think no one is..
not even USCIS itself.

I wonder if they will respect the NOA1 dates.

They are not considering it to send the RFEs, that´s for sure.
[/quote]


Nope, I just found out they aren't. My friend who works at the lawfirm I am using as representation just came over for breakfast and told me that even though they were able to get them to start sending out RFE's sooner than 30 more days, the RFE's they are sending out are the ones they have on hand, and are most recent first which can take a month to get through. Then they will start sending us RFE's and will be processed in the order the RFE's arrive. So it's as if the NOA2 no longer matters. Once it goes back to the embasy, it will be put in the que in the order it was recieved in the very back of the line. So another 2-5 months wait once it arrives at the embasys before we get our interview dates.. So it's almost as if we haven't even applied yet. I expressed my outrage, and he explained that this is the kind of game they try to play. You ask them to do something and they do it half assed IF they even agree to it. So the next thing they are going to do is try to setup some meetings with some key folks (I have no idea who they are) at the DHS and work with them on implementing a true FIFO system to prevent this from happening again when they add other new hairbrained laws.

[quote name='StevenJinky' post='258251' date='Jun 18 2006, 10:11 AM']
[quote name='top-gorilla' post='258031' date='Jun 17 2006, 10:23 PM']


Well zethris (and everyone else who got recalled) I urge you to take my advice and apply for an Expedite Request when you send in, or even before you send in your RFE. (see my post: Lost Link) If we get denied it will be more fuel for your class action lawsuit fire.

However, there is so much conflicting information out there please don't take offense if I take your breakfast conversation with a large grain of salt. But by all means keep digging!

omg. Tin foil hat much?

We live in a bubble here at VJ. Just because the vast majority of poster here are legit, there are no abuses? No mail order brides? How will innocents be 'caught in IMBRA's deadly undertow'? (you're a great writer btw!). If innocent, nothing to worry about.

This small group of 1100 (have some perspective) have been temporarily burned, but future filers? The immigration agency has a long history of hiccoughs like this---one of them launched this website as a matter of fact (google TSC prisoners).

I really think that the social engineering theory is paranoia. Sorry to disagree so firmly, but using that argument, how could you call for US legislators to re-engineer the economies and culture of multiple countries around the world instead of doing what IS in their own power---making a US law that affects specifically the people it is intended for?

[quote name='Cigarovich' date='Jun 18 2006, 12:24 PM' post='258417']
[quote name='zethris' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:39 PM' post='258363']
[quote name='Aquelunya' post='258355' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:33 AM']
[quote name='zethris' post='258341' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:32 AM']
[quote name='rlt' post='258227' date='Jun 18 2006, 09:51 AM']
I think no one is..
not even USCIS itself.

I wonder if they will respect the NOA1 dates.

They are not considering it to send the RFEs, that´s for sure.
[/quote]


Nope, I just found out they aren't. My friend who works at the lawfirm I am using as representation just came over for breakfast and told me that even though they were able to get them to start sending out RFE's sooner than 30 more days, the RFE's they are sending out are the ones they have on hand, and are most recent first which can take a month to get through. Then they will start sending us RFE's and will be processed in the order the RFE's arrive. So it's as if the NOA2 no longer matters. Once it goes back to the embasy, it will be put in the que in the order it was recieved in the very back of the line. So another 2-5 months wait once it arrives at the embasys before we get our interview dates.. So it's almost as if we haven't even applied yet. I expressed my outrage, and he explained that this is the kind of game they try to play. You ask them to do something and they do it half assed IF they even agree to it. So the next thing they are going to do is try to setup some meetings with some key folks (I have no idea who they are) at the DHS and work with them on implementing a true FIFO system to prevent this from happening again when they add other new hairbrained laws.

[quote name='StevenJinky' post='258251' date='Jun 18 2006, 10:11 AM']
[quote name='top-gorilla' post='258031' date='Jun 17 2006, 10:23 PM']


Well zethris (and everyone else who got recalled) I urge you to take my advice and apply for an Expedite Request when you send in, or even before you send in your RFE. (see my post: Lost Link) If we get denied it will be more fuel for your class action lawsuit fire.

However, there is so much conflicting information out there please don't take offense if I take your breakfast conversation with a large grain of salt. But by all means keep digging!
[/quote]
Hey Cigarovich,

I may possibly send in an expedite request this week. I'm still studying the actual process. Let's keep in touch with this. It does appear that that original memo that was released about the recall was worded in such a way as to not blame the USCIS for the error, although we all know it was. Keep digging yeah~!

I also just sent an email to my rep and I will call them tommorow.

I disagree with your law firm because I don't believe that this law firm has that much power to direct the USCIS. Who paid for the breakfast? Further, the USCIS had the RFE template approved on June 13th, 2006 by the OMB. Following that they will reduce the template into the format required to get the needed information(s) from the specific applicant, then they will mail them out.

In my estimation the 1100 applications will completed soon (starting June 19th, 2006) and will be done in block and sent back to the embassy within two (2) weeks of the receipt of the petitioner's response because most of these people have paid the $100.00 to the respective embassy banks and done their medical which expires in a year.

There seems to be misunderstanding of the intent of IMBRA. The intent of this act is to have your foreign fiancé fully informed of whom you including your criminal background if any. Upon which she has to decide whether or not she wants you no matter how bad or how great you are. That decision is totally hers. So the best medicine is full disclosure before you apply for her.

This is a little daisy for those whose petitioner whose applications have been approved and their fiancé’s invited for an interview. They are forced to disclose these bad records to their fiancé even if they don’t want to because the cat is out of the bag already. I think the RFE meant for these 1100 petitioners must have a place to give these guys a face saving means of backing out because one does not give up his constitutional right to privacy to marry a foreign wife especially without notice. That may be why it taking a little longer to send these ones out.

The best thing is to call your congressman, remember the November election is near and every vote counts. Use your power in the ballot box, call.

Immediately my @$$!

[quote name='Cigarovich' date='Jun 18 2006, 12:24 PM' post='258417']
[quote name='zethris' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:39 PM' post='258363']
[quote name='Aquelunya' post='258355' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:33 AM']
[quote name='zethris' post='258341' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:32 AM']
[quote name='rlt' post='258227' date='Jun 18 2006, 09:51 AM']
I think no one is..
not even USCIS itself.

I wonder if they will respect the NOA1 dates.

They are not considering it to send the RFEs, that´s for sure.
[/quote]


Nope, I just found out they aren't. My friend who works at the lawfirm I am using as representation just came over for breakfast and told me that even though they were able to get them to start sending out RFE's sooner than 30 more days, the RFE's they are sending out are the ones they have on hand, and are most recent first which can take a month to get through. Then they will start sending us RFE's and will be processed in the order the RFE's arrive. So it's as if the NOA2 no longer matters. Once it goes back to the embasy, it will be put in the que in the order it was recieved in the very back of the line. So another 2-5 months wait once it arrives at the embasys before we get our interview dates.. So it's almost as if we haven't even applied yet. I expressed my outrage, and he explained that this is the kind of game they try to play. You ask them to do something and they do it half assed IF they even agree to it. So the next thing they are going to do is try to setup some meetings with some key folks (I have no idea who they are) at the DHS and work with them on implementing a true FIFO system to prevent this from happening again when they add other new hairbrained laws.

[quote name='StevenJinky' post='258251' date='Jun 18 2006, 10:11 AM']
[quote name='top-gorilla' post='258031' date='Jun 17 2006, 10:23 PM']


Well zethris (and everyone else who got recalled) I urge you to take my advice and apply for an Expedite Request when you send in, or even before you send in your RFE. (see my post: Lost Link) If we get denied it will be more fuel for your class action lawsuit fire.

However, there is so much conflicting information out there please don't take offense if I take your breakfast conversation with a large grain of salt. But by all means keep digging!
[/quote]

oh absolutely! none taken. I understand. I had wished that, that which I have been doing could have had more of an effect, but this is a 6 headed hydra beast and unfortunatly I can seem to only fight 2 heads at a time. At the very least, I could say I helped to hopefully shave of 30 days from their intended time to begin sending RFE's. I just wish we had the foresight to request it was the RFE's that are being sent out now were based on the NOA1 and 2.

They are going to keep trying. I have good friends who are doing this all for free. But tick one more thing on the list of complaints on the class action should there ever be one.

[quote name='zethris' date='Jun 18 2006, 01:39 PM' post='258444']
[quote name='Cigarovich' date='Jun 18 2006, 12:24 PM' post='258417']
[quote name='zethris' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:39 PM' post='258363']
[quote name='Aquelunya' post='258355' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:33 AM']
[quote name='zethris' post='258341' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:32 AM']
[quote name='rlt' post='258227' date='Jun 18 2006, 09:51 AM']
I think no one is..
not even USCIS itself.

I wonder if they will respect the NOA1 dates.

They are not considering it to send the RFEs, that´s for sure.
[/quote]


Nope, I just found out they aren't. My friend who works at the lawfirm I am using as representation just came over for breakfast and told me that even though they were able to get them to start sending out RFE's sooner than 30 more days, the RFE's they are sending out are the ones they have on hand, and are most recent first which can take a month to get through. Then they will start sending us RFE's and will be processed in the order the RFE's arrive. So it's as if the NOA2 no longer matters. Once it goes back to the embasy, it will be put in the que in the order it was recieved in the very back of the line. So another 2-5 months wait once it arrives at the embasys before we get our interview dates.. So it's almost as if we haven't even applied yet. I expressed my outrage, and he explained that this is the kind of game they try to play. You ask them to do something and they do it half assed IF they even agree to it. So the next thing they are going to do is try to setup some meetings with some key folks (I have no idea who they are) at the DHS and work with them on implementing a true FIFO system to prevent this from happening again when they add other new hairbrained laws.

[quote name='StevenJinky' post='258251' date='Jun 18 2006, 10:11 AM']
[quote name='top-gorilla' post='258031' date='Jun 17 2006, 10:23 PM']


Well zethris (and everyone else who got recalled) I urge you to take my advice and apply for an Expedite Request when you send in, or even before you send in your RFE. (see my post: Lost Link) If we get denied it will be more fuel for your class action lawsuit fire.

However, there is so much conflicting information out there please don't take offense if I take your breakfast conversation with a large grain of salt. But by all means keep digging!
[/quote]

oh absolutely! none taken. I understand. I had wished that, that which I have been doing could have had more of an effect, but this is a 6 headed hydra beast and unfortunatly I can seem to only fight 2 heads at a time. At the very least, I could say I helped to hopefully shave of 30 days from their intended time to begin sending RFE's. I just wish we had the foresight to request it was the RFE's that are being sent out now were based on the NOA1 and 2.

They are going to keep trying. I have good friends who are doing this all for free. But tick one more thing on the list of complaints on the class action should there ever be one.
[/quote]

You mean the RFEs they are issuing now are not about IMBRA?

If you choose to attempt to "protect" people, and men are just as deserving and in need of protection as women, then anybody entering into a relationship must have a background check and the results disclosed to the potential suitor.

How in the world can it make sense to target only people who are applying for fiancee visa's?

To single out romances than begin via bar meeting, church meeting, email, online chat, marriage brokers, grandma's introduction, it does not matter. This is inarguable: Predators and bad people exist in our midst. They are not exclusive to some ambiguously described "International Marriage Broker". Predators exist in your neighborhood and mine.

The answer is not to make this a society were we may soon be required to "present our papers" in order to exercise our freedom to communicate, associate and god forbid maybe even marry.

The answer is disclosure and education. There are bad people in the world, it is full of risks. We cannot, and will never legislate them all away. Indeed, many foreign countries already have requirements that prospective brides attend mandatory education of the potential risks in regards to their suitor.

The answer is for each of us to exercise due diligence in who we associate with. There will always be men and women that choose to plunge into circumstances that are not good for them. To attempt to target this with broad-brush legislation is to cost all of us yet one more freedom, and burden us with yet more bureaucracy.

Existing laws, when enforced, deal perfectly well with actual crimes. To attempt to act presumptively, with no proof that is even possible in the case of IMBRA, enters us into a "Minority Report" type world. Prevent the crime before it happens, because we can see that it will happen. That is total BS in the case of the IMBRA law. There is no proof the law will prevent anything except preventing people in love from being together.

There is no basis in fact, nor precedent, that what IMBRA requires will have any beneficial effects for the people it purports to help.

Enforce existing law, don't enact new law.

Welcome to visajourney.

This law firm is over 180 years old, and does have quite a few people in political positions of power. Regardless of that, you seem to have the wrong impression of what their "clout" is doing. It's not directing the USCIS. I made the breakfast. This lawfirm is working WITH the USCIS through political means and pressures well played short of outright lawsuits. Yet.

Just because the template was approved on June 13th, doesn't mean it wont take the beureuacratic 30-60 days to become "official". Then another 30 days to sit on it before sending it out.

Your estimation is actually 9000 applications too low. over 10,000 are currently effected. If left to their own devices, we would not see any RFE's until mid July or beginning of August. However, that has been changed due to the leveraging that my friends, and many of you have been able to accomplish by contacting your congressmen and key officials in the DHS, and USCIS directly. (eg. your calls helped them to have an open ear to the right people, which is hard to do.)

With some of the red tape cut, and seemingly about to getout of this tunnel once the RFE's were sent, many of us were hopefull that we would see them next week or so. Instead, people have been noticing those with NOA1's and 2's much later than theirs getting notifications of RFE's. While many of us who were closer to the Marth 6th deadline haven't even heard word that we have been "officially effected" yet. (Such as myself)

Fast foward to today, reality strikes, and the real reason why those of us who have May and some April NOA's are getting RFE's sooner than those of us who have been in the process for 4 months to a year or more comes out. Thats not to say we should give up, or that I will have my "hounds" back off. Quite the contrary. If we can keep calling to keep the walls soft against the words spoken by them and those they can get to talk to the powers that be at the USCIS, they may see a way to make it fair for all. Or at least implement a new system of cataloging for future use so future petitioners don't have to suffer like this with future changes.

The complaint is not against IMBRA itself, it has it's usefullness. But it also has it's flaws in terms of the obvious political agenda it's writers and passers have. So the misunderstanding about the law doesn't exist. What was said is true. Just as much as the good parts of it that will help protect incoming fiances in the future. The major problem with it, is not the law itself, but how it is being implemented. The way they are doing it is reprehensable.





[quote name='rlt' date='Jun 18 2006, 12:51 PM' post='258463']
[quote name='zethris' date='Jun 18 2006, 01:39 PM' post='258444']
[quote name='Cigarovich' date='Jun 18 2006, 12:24 PM' post='258417']
[quote name='zethris' date='Jun 18 2006, 07:39 PM' post='258363']
[quote name='Aquelunya' post='258355' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:33 AM']
[quote name='zethris' post='258341' date='Jun 18 2006, 11:32 AM']
[quote name='rlt' post='258227' date='Jun 18 2006, 09:51 AM']
I think no one is..
not even USCIS itself.

I wonder if they will respect the NOA1 dates.

They are not considering it to send the RFEs, that´s for sure.
[/quote]


Nope, I just found out they aren't. My friend who works at the lawfirm I am using as representation just came over for breakfast and told me that even though they were able to get them to start sending out RFE's sooner than 30 more days, the RFE's they are sending out are the ones they have on hand, and are most recent first which can take a month to get through. Then they will start sending us RFE's and will be processed in the order the RFE's arrive. So it's as if the NOA2 no longer matters. Once it goes back to the embasy, it will be put in the que in the order it was recieved in the very back of the line. So another 2-5 months wait once it arrives at the embasys before we get our interview dates.. So it's almost as if we haven't even applied yet. I expressed my outrage, and he explained that this is the kind of game they try to play. You ask them to do something and they do it half assed IF they even agree to it. So the next thing they are going to do is try to setup some meetings with some key folks (I have no idea who they are) at the DHS and work with them on implementing a true FIFO system to prevent this from happening again when they add other new hairbrained laws.

[quote name='StevenJinky' post='258251' date='Jun 18 2006, 10:11 AM']
[quote name='top-gorilla' post='258031' date='Jun 17 2006, 10:23 PM']


Well zethris (and everyone else who got recalled) I urge you to take my advice and apply for an Expedite Request when you send in, or even before you send in your RFE. (see my post: Lost Link) If we get denied it will be more fuel for your class action lawsuit fire.

However, there is so much conflicting information out there please don't take offense if I take your breakfast conversation with a large grain of salt. But by all means keep digging!
[/quote]

oh absolutely! none taken. I understand. I had wished that, that which I have been doing could have had more of an effect, but this is a 6 headed hydra beast and unfortunatly I can seem to only fight 2 heads at a time. At the very least, I could say I helped to hopefully shave of 30 days from their intended time to begin sending RFE's. I just wish we had the foresight to request it was the RFE's that are being sent out now were based on the NOA1 and 2.

They are going to keep trying. I have good friends who are doing this all for free. But tick one more thing on the list of complaints on the class action should there ever be one.
[/quote]

You mean the RFEs they are issuing now are not about IMBRA?
[/quote]

Yes they are, except for the normal RFE's that come about when they do regular RFE's during a petitions process. (Need more pictures/evidence, missing information, request for originals etc.) But the majority of the RFE's logicaly would be from the IMBRA effects. However, becauswe normal RFE's are also being processed, there may be some of us who get one not related to IMBRA (but might later).

Honestly, I doubt USCIS would do that after stating they will expedite the recalled petitions, I think the reason people that aren´t recalled ones got RFE e-mails first is ´cus we must remember there are many people working on these files, and maybe someone started faster, that´s why the RFEs aren´t coming in an especific order. At this point when they used the word immediatly I trully believe they´ll work faster.

I think this upcoming week we´ll hear good news to the recalled petitioners and to the rest of us as well, there will be RFEs rolling out.

Someone stated this earlier - it's not just that you want to marry someone, but you want to bring them into the U.S., and that is an immigration issue, and to a larger extent, a social issue. If requiring you to disclose how you met your fiancee is social engineering then so is any rule or regulation established in deciding what immigrants we let into our country. Secondly, Mail-Order Bride services do in fact exist and anyone who doesn't believe that is simply in denial. The law hasn't made that illegal since it is difficult to clearly define just how much a marriage broker is marketing foreign women to American men. It's just requiring petitioners to state whether they used one or not. How is that harmful to anyone who sincerely wants to marry someone out of love?

Er.. just got a phone call. Apparently I wasn't supposed to say what I heard because it's not yet officialy documented. Just something he found out on Friday during a confrence call before going home. LOL oh well. I felt you all should know anyways becauce technicaly everything we say here is hearsay anyways.





I hope you are right, but with the news to the contrary, I gather they don't care about order anymore. Everything is a big semi ordered pile right now to prevent as much loss of records as possible. They never had anything like this happen before at this scale. So they don't have measures of order implemented for such a recall to keep everything like this in the exact same line as it was before the recall. They are processing what they have closest to hand right now and it just so happens to be the most recent applicants and NOA's

Some of our cases haven't even arrived yet (Such as mine, it's still apparently waiting at the embassy to be sent to the NVC) It is their hope that once it gets back tot he embasies, that maybe they could sort through the hundreds, rather than the thousands to bring back some order to the que. But unfortunatly, unless they halt the entire process in the mean time, there will be many who get processed before us that had a later noa date due to the fact of the time it will take for our cases to finally get back to the embasy with the requested evidence.

A straight line is always the shortest and quickest path. So it is for those with later NOA's it seems.

By the way, the expidite service could be an idea. But technicaly they arent' admitting an error (even though the memo said they were in error) so we may not be elegible for it. Worth a shot though.

Of course things like that will happen, but once they get an RFE from a recalled petition I am sure they´ll expedite the cases they recognized as one that had been previously approved.

So basically, we would be better off starting from scratch with the new I-129F.

I doubt that, Mike, I am still betting you guys will be expedited.

what i want to know is why are the k3's being dragged into this. I hope they dont send any RFE's for k3. I mean k3's are already married and plus they are not even going through USCIS(the four agencies). they are goign directly through NBC, NVC

And arent these cases processed by different people. LIke departments, or are they all mixed into a bunch.

L&L I guess I missed it. Could you remind and link me to where USCIS made that statement. And while we're at it does anyone still have the link to the original statement of the recall (the one where they state the petitions were approved in error) from a few weeks back. I'd rather not wade through 90 pages to find it

The link is here: http://travel.state.gov/visa/laws/telegram...grams_2927.html

And as Mike said, I would be feeling better if I had just filed the new I129F now than applied in March and being in my situation.
I think there´s a good chance we´ll wait as much as anyone applying now will.

somone wrote (sorry, accidentally deleted the part that stated who, and don't care to start over)
Someone stated this earlier - it's not just that you want to marry someone, but you want to bring them into the U.S., and that is an immigration issue, and to a larger extent, a social issue. If requiring you to disclose how you met your fiancee is social engineering then so is any rule or regulation established in deciding what immigrants we let into our country. Secondly, Mail-Order Bride services do in fact exist and anyone who doesn't believe that is simply in denial. The law hasn't made that illegal since it is difficult to clearly define just how much a marriage broker is marketing foreign women to American men. It's just requiring petitioners to state whether they used one or not. How is that harmful to anyone who sincerely wants to marry someone out of love?
[/quote] So then I write the following...
well, let's see, it has now cost about 10,000 couples about 3 months, which according to my math equals about 5,000 years of human lives. How many years of human lives have been improved with this thing do you figure?

By the way, on the so called "mail order bride" issue, I am assuming you all have read the fine print on this. For reasons that are unclear (to me anyway) certain internet meeting sites are exempt, while ones that charge men but not women are not. The non exempt ones have such a burden put on them, some of them have quit serving Americans. Others have quit doing business. For a resourceful person, he can merely look around and find different venues to conduct his search. In my case, I used a site that would not be exempt at this point. That site does not follow the dictates now, and so I would have had to find someone else. While their are lots of wonderful Vietnamese ladies out there, I wonder who I would have found otherwise? Seems to me that the system should not have that much power, to force a change in the person I will spend the rest of my life with.

On the name "mail order bride", I think that this is a holdover from the 1800s when a man could actually have a woman sent over having never met her. Of course, disparites in wealth and living conditions, (as well as potential for future well being) between the American men and the foreign women was always a big factor in this equation, and often still is. See the great movie "Picture Bride" to learn more about this. Or better still, study the subject in general, the more you learn about the subject, the better a partner you will be for your foreign spouse. With the requirement of meeting your intended spouse, as well as the visa process, there is no way these people should be considered "mail order", and I think the term itself lends sleaziness to the whole subject, which is a big part of the problem we are faced with. Hence, this new requlation, as well as the negative attitude projected by so many normal Americans when judging our "mail order" marriages.

Cigarovich, I am betting on it, on USCIS expediting cases, but to play safe, everyone recalled should make a request for expedite processing when returning the RFE, under USCIS error motive.

I can´t find who said USCIS said they´d be expediting cases.

Well, I don´t know about you guys, but as one of the recalled cases, I´m not worried about the process after submiting the RFE.
Is waiting for it that makes the waiting unfair.

I´m sure after we send the RFE it will be pretty fast until it gets to the Embassy abroad.

But it could take us a long time to get the RFE.
I wonder if we could ask for an expedition now, before we get the RFE.

I don't think it would be useful at this point, tbh. The case will only be considered lost sixty days after the Consulate sent it back, and I doubt the incorrect approvals will qualify us for expedited handling, since the situation is technically being formally addressed. I'm sure the request would be denied.

As someone said earlier, you are a great writer!

As far as time lost, I suppose you could make that argument against the long lines at the DMV (Dept. of Motor Vehicles) as well...hehehe. ...or traffic congestion.

I appreciate your distaste for the term 'Mail-Order Bride' and I've had to fight some stereotypes with my own family when I told them I was dating a woman long distance from a Third World country. However, that doesn't dismiss the reality that there are many unscrupulous agencies out there who are profiteering on the notion that an American man can simply 'buy' his spouse. They even state such things as saying that these women are submissive, obediant, non-complaining, etc.

Not every site that connects foreign women to American men are necessarily sinister or evil. But let's not be ignorant about the possibility of woman being coerced or forced into such services. The sex trade exists and is a huge problem among Third World countries. Because these agencies are international and not under the jurisdiction of the U.S. Federal courts, we are unable to stop them from using unscrupulous practices.

I think the new IMBRA law will in fact be a positive effect in putting pressure on dating agencies to use ethical standards when American men who are serious about marrying someone for love will be more careful as to which agency they use. That's something that has long been needed.

[quote name='top-gorilla' date='Jun 18 2006, 02:17 PM' post='258628']
somone wrote (sorry, accidentally deleted the part that stated who, and don't care to start over)
Someone stated this earlier - it's not just that you want to marry someone, but you want to bring them into the U.S., and that is an immigration issue, and to a larger extent, a social issue. If requiring you to disclose how you met your fiancee is social engineering then so is any rule or regulation established in deciding what immigrants we let into our country. Secondly, Mail-Order Bride services do in fact exist and anyone who doesn't believe that is simply in denial. The law hasn't made that illegal since it is difficult to clearly define just how much a marriage broker is marketing foreign women to American men. It's just requiring petitioners to state whether they used one or not. How is that harmful to anyone who sincerely wants to marry someone out of love?
[/quote] So then I write the following...
well, let's see, it has now cost about 10,000 couples about 3 months, which according to my math equals about 5,000 years of human lives. How many years of human lives have been improved with this thing do you figure?

By the way, on the so called "mail order bride" issue, I am assuming you all have read the fine print on this. For reasons that are unclear (to me anyway) certain internet meeting sites are exempt, while ones that charge men but not women are not. The non exempt ones have such a burden put on them, some of them have quit serving Americans. Others have quit doing business. For a resourceful person, he can merely look around and find different venues to conduct his search. In my case, I used a site that would not be exempt at this point. That site does not follow the dictates now, and so I would have had to find someone else. While their are lots of wonderful Vietnamese ladies out there, I wonder who I would have found otherwise? Seems to me that the system should not have that much power, to force a change in the person I will spend the rest of my life with.

On the name "mail order bride", I think that this is a holdover from the 1800s when a man could actually have a woman sent over having never met her. Of course, disparites in wealth and living conditions, (as well as potential for future well being) between the American men and the foreign women was always a big factor in this equation, and often still is. See the great movie "Picture Bride" to learn more about this. Or better still, study the subject in general, the more you learn about the subject, the better a partner you will be for your foreign spouse. With the requirement of meeting your intended spouse, as well as the visa process, there is no way these people should be considered "mail order", and I think the term itself lends sleaziness to the whole subject, which is a big part of the problem we are faced with. Hence, this new requlation, as well as the negative attitude projected by so many normal Americans when judging our "mail order" marriages.
[/quote]


I remember when even meeting online for people localy was completely taboo. Now with social meet websites out there, and social online gaming, it's not so taboo. Old traditions die hard though. You marry a spouse from a foreign country, especially asia or russia, and that must immediatly mean he/she is a mail order spouse.




Honestly I think it is the waiting part that we will have to endure that will make it seem like we haven't even began applying yet for a visa. For many of us, we were just waitng for the appointment to be scheduled. So most of the actuall work is done. Once the RFE is recieved and sent it, it's just a matter of waiting for it to be processed and then it gets put in the que at the end of the line for appointment scheduling at the embassy.



yep, thats how i think they would get out of honoring expidite requets due to USCIS error too.

Yeah it's deplorable with how badly discriminatory the label "Mail-Order Bride" is and the thoughts it brings to someone and about the person you love. Luckily, my immediate family was just happy I found someone finally. So they have been pretty supportive. Even with the initial suspisions due to "what they hear on the news" etc.

And lol @ Philippina's being submissive, obediant, non-complaining. hee hee! My fiance is all about the 'tell it like it is' "you either fix that, or i'll get the hammer and do it myself" type. I LOVE IT! I know what you mean though. These agencies should be shut down faster than the RIAA can send a 12 year old to jail. They profiteer on that notion fairly easily, unfortunatly, because of the many DOM's out there (Dirty Old Men) who want to have a fantasy life wife much younger than them that they think they can control. I can't tell you how many God realatives my fiance has here who have had to leave their abusive older husbands. Lets just say more than 15.

yes indeed, and a great detriment to the phil's is the sex trade there. That is also a great detriment to us because of all the extra steps we have to take to prevent sham weddings due to the abuse thats going on there, and in many other parts of the world.

I support the good parts of IMBRA and what it can do. But the only reason why it wouldn't pass on it's own is because of the bad parts in it that are not fair. The writer refused to change it, and instead hid it in another law. Then once they realized it passed (two months after the deadline) (ok an exaggeration) anyways, once that happened the way they are implementing it is what I have a major issue with. It is sickoning quite frankly.

Has anybody really tried sending in an expedite request yet?

I doubt it yet due to the fact that we haven't gotten our RFE's yet to send in. But they don't really like to do expedite ever, if at all possible. Many have tried for other things seemingly valid, but still get denied while others get approved.

thanks for the link rlt. I will definitely be using it in my Expedite Request. And I will definitely post if it is approved or not.

Question for you all....

I sent a letter to both of my Senators regarding this whole situation May25th. On Friday I got a letter from Senator #1 who contacted USCIS. The OMB pulled my application and told the senator my application was submitted on the 19th of May(actually it was the 2nd of May). The letter then went on to state about the new form that is coming and the pending RFE's etc. Then on Friday I got a call from Senator #2 asking if there was anything they could do to help.
Here is my question. In contacting them I did not ask for help with my application specifically. I just asked if they could get some answers for me. I did not include my case number but yet USCIS looked at my case and gave Senator #1 my (wrong) petition date. I'm hoping I haven't sh*t canned myself in contacting the senators. Is this possible? I'm concerned about "additional security checks or name hits" or whatever it is called.
Next, I am to call Senator#2 back on Monday with any additional concerns. If I have screwed myself
should I go for the full Monty and have Senator#2 contact USCIS/OMB. I'm inclined to have #2 not make any inquires on my behave at this time until I need them later.
What do you guys think?

Well, I think you are a nice, optimistic person who is l