Thanks!

ooopssssss I meant welcome is afwan..... brain freeze early ! sorry Afwan is welcome ! Shukran is Thank you

Tis ok! Thanks!

Hey everybody, hope you are well!! I wanted to know some information. Somebody told me that muslims do not have pictures of their children on the walls in their home and are not allowed to have angels (like figureines) in the home. Is this correct and if so is there anywhere that I can read this information? I have tried to find it but maybe I am not looking in the correct place.

Extremely religious Muslims do not have photos at all in their homes....demons live in them they claim. Any statues are forbidden in your home...because people back in the days would worship statues...hope that makes sense.

Tasha...I'm sending you a link via PM....it references some hadiths...



Shukran: Thank you

Afwan: You're welcome

"Angels do not enter a house which has either a dog or a picture in it." (Bukhari).

I'm sure you will get many different answers to this question, so this is mine

At the root of this question is the prohibition of creating images that promote or give the impression of idoltry. The one hadith that you refer to is: "Angels do not enter houses where there are images" but there are others such as "Whoever makes an image in this world will be asked by Allah to breathe a soul into it on the Day of Judgment".

Different schools of jurisprudence (and within these schools different scholars) have made rulings on modern uses of images - such as photography. Some will say all images are forbidden. Some will say the images can be in the house in a drawer or photo album. etc...

here is one comment from islamonline.net to the question about family photos that are framed/hung on the wall:

First of all, we would like to stress that there is nothing wrong, as far as Islam is concerned, in keeping those framed pictures as well as other family photos you tend to keep for memories or as souvenirs.

In his response to the question, Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, a Senior Lecturer and Islamic Scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, states the following:

"There is nothing wrong for you to keep those pictures in a frame on a bedroom dresser. Photographic pictures are not considered quite haram or forbidden as is the case with carving of images, which has been forbidden in the Prophetic Sunnah. Pictures are taken by trapping the shadows of a thing, and hence, it is not mimicking Allah’s creation.

Also if a person is simply keeping them for memory or as a souvenir it is not at all prohibited to do so. However, to display pictures of heroes or leaders or scholars on the walls may fall into category of undesirable or forbidden category, for it may breed reverence, which is a slippery road leading to hero-worship, which is forbidden in Islam."


IMO, some of the more strict rulings seem to forget the intent of the Quran on this issue and create some impractical contadictions. For example, what about passport photos? A strict narrow interpretation of the hadith about angels would make this image (often tucked away in a drawer) haram, right? Often the strict scholars will then make a loophole in their ruling saying that a passport is necessary so it is an exception.

Here is a more specifc answer to hanging pics on the wall rater than framed pics on a dresser. also from Islamonline.net



There is nothing to prohibit hanging family pictures on the wall as long as this is far from the possibility of breeding reverence and glorification and the content of the picture itself does not reveal any `awrahs or indecency.


In his response to the question, Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, a senior lecturer and Islamic scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, states:


“It is not considered haram (forbidden) to hang family pictures on the wall; however, I should urge you against hanging them on the wall directly facing you in Prayer. For by hanging them in the direction of Prayer, your thoughts will likely be distracted; furthermore, it may inadvertently give the impression that we worship pictures. It is important for us Muslims to make ourselves distinct in our religious practices from those who associate partners with Allah in their worship. So never hang such pictures in the direction of your Prayer.


Still another point to consider: Never hang pictures of leaders and heroes, past or present, on your walls, for it may inadvertently lead to feelings of extreme reverence and hero worship, and this in turn may become an avenue leading to shirk. Such things are considered as avenues leading to that which is haram, and hence considered as forbidden. It is worth remembering that this was the main rationale for prohibiting carving images and statues in the first place.
Since, however, such motives are entirely lacking in hanging family pictures, there is no reason to consider it as haram.”

Thank you both very much for your input!

Before my husband got here he told me we'd have to take down all pictures that I have on my fireplace mantel. Well he's been here almost four months now and I haven't taken anything down AND have dragged him to an art museum so I think in his mind he's changed or something. I don't follow that rule at all though and it'd be a very hard thing for me to give up since I love photography.

To me the bigger dilemma is pictures of ME that other people have without hijab. I"ve only been wearing hijab now for a year so, like, when I go to my parents or my sisters' houses they all have past photos of me without hijab. I haven't broached the subject with my sister and won't at all with my parents since they're very much set in their ways and well...old. lol. Just food for thought though.

I remember seeing photos of the King of Morocco all over the place when I was there. Also, I had never heard anything related to pictures from Wadi and his family had photos in the house. What is standard opinion in Morocco?

thanks i to wondered why no pictures on the walls, ahmed has beautiful neice and in her own home the walls are very bare, as my house has all kinda of pictures nick nacks i did notice theirs had none, i take that back i do remember seeing one of his dad on the wall and at the sisters there is one of the dad on a end table

Is the father alive?



There are kings all over the place in the middle east...LOL...plus look at Saddam...Statues, Pictures...Syria, Jordan, etc..

Yeah, so now I'm confused! But what else is new?

I'm the same way...I was thinking what about TV or DVDs? All have photos of people as well....hmmm....

Well IMO the king wants to be venerated - God, country and king and the whole kiss his hand thing. But I guess that's a dfferent topic all together

Most of Morocco tends to interpret Islam through the Maliki school of jurisprudence. Maliki tends to draw a difference between 2-D images and 3-D images makign photos, drawing, painting etc much less an issue than otehr schools of law.

yes his dad is still alive and they have sent me 5x7 of the neice so its not like they dont get pictures made they just werent displayed like i do

Right...Its basically up to the schools of interpretation....as we can see by the answers and experiences everyone has.

That's interesting. So which schools do other areas of MENA follow?

Maliki is found predominately in Africa with the exception of Egypt, but also in some of the Gulf states on the Arab penisula.
Hanafi is found in Egypt, and most Muslim countries in Asia (Turkey, China, Indo-Pak Sub Continent etc)
Shafi'i is more often in far east like Indonesia, Malaysia but also in east Africa, Egypt and some parts of India
Hanbali is most concentrated in the Arabian penisula

Even within the regions where one school dominates, there are minority schools of fiqh too. These four are considered the four main school of law.

Just question to through out there....at mosques men and women pray separately....or at least men in front of the women. In Mecca, they pray side by side. I know there are millions there and it would be difficult to separate them. Anyone have any thoughts?

I always thought that the women in Mecca had to pray separately. Actually I think there's been a big problem there in that there hasn't been enough room for the women or something so they had to even pray in a separate building.

Or I could be thinking of somewhere else but I swear I remember reading that last year somewhere.


At the mosque that I like it's an old church building and the women pray up in the choir area and the men pray down below. I love that because we get our own everything, even a children's room that is enclosed with a speaker in there so if you're with your child you can still hear the imam.

There's one in a city next to us where my husband goes just due to pure location that does not allow women!! Actually there's another one like that south of Boston too.

Do you mean segregated groups or literally side by side?

At one time some in Saudi Arabia suggested banning women from praying near teh kaa'ba altogether

During Hajj, both are together. When they circle the kabbah, they are side by side.

I didn't realize that. I guess I assumed that when I read men and women pray together in Mecca, that it meant there was no physical barrier between the two. Very intersting!

They r together but they re in motion so u cant separate them...

Attention cross-stitchers

I have brought out of the closet, my graphs for 4 small projects. One says "Allah" one is a mosque, one says Bismillah and the other is "Subhanallah'

I made 5 copies...and will start coloring them in. Whoever wants a set, pm me your address and I will send right away! These will also work on plastic canvas. Easier for kids and men to do on plastic.

Any one or the set would make a great Eid gift! (or nice to display at your home too!)

Jackie

Oh, that is so nice Jackie! I want one, but I will have to convince my husband it is okay to give you my address He constantly worries of the dangers of dealing with people over the internet. I managed to get the okay today to send Kathleen the baby shower gifts and he didn't fight it too much thank God (the return address will be on the box). I just have to space out these things so I don't overwhelm him, lol.



Also, in regards to the pics. I sent my husband's family pics of us in frames and they put them up in their living room on the tables. I feel bad though because they don't have any other pics since they had to leave a lot behind in Iraq. Thank God they enjoy them so much so it works out.

Yeah, I knew that too, it is just an infrastructure thing, too much chaos to even attempt to organize that aspect of it I guess. I don't like the whole women's balcony idea or whatever they do today in modern mosques, because that just gives the women license to talk during the khotba which makes me FURIOUS but I can't say anything about it because then my prayer will be invalid. I don't go to jumuah here in Morocco because they speak too fast. I do go when I'm in the States and if I keep having problems with the women who won't zip it, I'm going to request to the mosque director to let any women who want to, to be able to sit behind the men downstairs during the khotba to hear the imam. Let's see how that goes. Then once the khotba's over I'll go run back to the women's section to hang out with the ladies lol.

Hay April!!!! How's things going Guuuurrllll.. is your BIL still there??

I have a questons that I asked before but didn't see answered....

What is the difference between Shia and Sunna? I don't want to cause any arguements but just wondering

Rajaa

There are a lot of differences. You can find a lot of information online. I'm not sure I want to get into it here.

I' have gone online but can't seem to find the stark contrasts all I know is everyone has strong feelings about the other and here i am wondering why...

But thank you for responding

The basic difference is rooted in how should rule the muslim community after the death of the prophet. Sunnis accepted the elected leadership by the ummah and while Shia's followed the leadership through decendancy of the Prophet. since that "break" , sunni and shia islam has evolved under different leadership and legal schools.

Getting in to the particulars can be very complicated here

ok... i'll accept that answer lol thank you

OOPS! I guess I misread your answer when I posted

I know there is no segregation when performing the circles around the Kaaba, but I meant segregation during salat in Mecca? When I read men and women pray together during hajj, does it mean they are side by side side or more traditionally men in the front and women behind?

OK, I know about the original political split of Shia and Sunni, but I had an additional question about ahadeeth and Shia which can totally be answered in non-inflamitory way so I thought I'd ask. Sunnis follow the ahadeeth which are proven/thought to have strong chains of evidence by Sunni scholars. Do Shia follow ahadeeth, or does that vary from person to person, mosque to mosque, area, or none do it? And if they do, I would guess they have their own scholars and what they consider to be strong evidence or not? Or does everyone more or less agree on ahadeeth and varying validities? (I figured this was barely more than a yes/no question or multiple choice to the different parts so it's not something for debate). I've never really gotten much of a straight answer on this and I figure there must be a straight answer, even if it is "it varies."

I found this link and it answered a lot of questions about things like that:

http://www.islamfortoday.com/shia.htm

Here are a couple key points:


Sunnis and Shias agree on the core fundamentals of Islam - the Five Pillars - and recognize each others as Muslims. In 1959 Sheikh Mahmood Shaltoot, Head of the School of Theology at Al Azhar university in Cairo, the most august seat of learning of Sunni Islam and the oldest university in the world, issued a fatwa (ruling) recognizing the legitimacy of the Jafari School of Law to which most Shias belong. As a point of interest, the Jafari School is named after its founder Imam Jafaf Sidiq who was a direct descendent through two different lines of the Sunni Caliph Abu Bakr. And Al Azhar University, though now Sunni, was actually founded by the Shia Fatimid dynasty in 969CE.

Practical Differences
On a practical daily level, Shias have a different call to prayer, they perform wudu and salat differently including placing the forehead onto a piece of hardened clay from Karbala, not directly onto the prayer mat when prostrating. They also tend to combine prayers, sometimes worshipping three times per day instead of five. The Shias also have some different ahadith and prefer those narrated by Ali and Fatima to those related by other companions of the Prophet (pbuh). Because of her opposition to Ali, those narrated by Aisha count among the least favored.

That about answers it, yep!

The further you move away historically from the first Caliphs after the deathf the prophet, the more the division seems to be. Amoung Shia'a there are divisions as well just as there are divisions among Sunnis.

Most Shia'a follow the Jafari school of lslamic law (as apposed to any of the major Sunni schools- Hanafi, maliki, ect) but over time tehre have been splits in the shia'a fiqh. This is where you find Ismailis for example.

Yeah that's what I was trying to get at.... you just said it way better than me lol

Good stuff happenin in here... i feel like I am learning somehing new everyday! Thanks

has anyone lost the....ummmmm personal feeling in prayer? I feel like a robot these days?????

I go through phases. Sometimes I'm into every single action in salat and others I just struggle to get it done. Make dua that you will feel your prayer better. I'm sure there's a formal dua out there somewhere but I usually just make my own up in my own words.

I mean I pray with all good intentions .. it just, different i've noticed. Anyway, thanks for your response

what is everyone's favorite online recitation of the Quran?

I've started reading the quran in Arabic. I still need the english translations, but I can now recite it directly from my husband's quran with a little bit of confidence

So much easier to memorize things when you can read it that way - I've finally memorized more than 3 suras You know the short ones at the back and al-fatiha

They're probably the same three suras that I use in my salat! lol. Those are the only ones I know aside from Al Fatima.

I've been listening to THIS this morning but they're too short and it's a pain to have to keep clicking on the next one to listen to.

how to pray, al-fatiha, and these three suras are the first things taught to any new muslim. The three suras are the last in the quran and also the shortest with alot of repeating words.

I had to find a page of something in arabic to read aloud in front of the class for my arabic final this week, and the quran has everything vocalized (with the vowels on it) and most modern arabic doesn't. So I went to my husband's quran to see if it was doable for me - and yay very easy for me to recite

Good for you! There was a seminar that I didn't go to last year that a few of the women in my group at the mosque went to and after just one night they were able to at least attempt to read it in Arabic and they did sooo good! Now I wish I had gone with them!