Ok, my wife has been in America for almost 3 years now. She just got her 10 year green card. I have Veterans educational benefits that extend to my family, so I would like to send my wife to university. The money the gov't offers is not enough to attend any American university, but it is enough for a Canadian university.
My wife has been accepted at a school in Alberta, Canada. I plan to file for her N-400 right before we leave for the Fall semester of 2008. The Canadian school is only an hour from the border, so we will be returning each weekend to our home in America (Montana).
Does anyone know the rules as far as, from what I know, the 3 out of 5 years needed? If she has already lived in America for 3 years, we should be able to take off for Canada with no fear...right? We will be coming back to check the mail each weekend, and we are fairly close to the local USCIS office in Helena.
Any suggestions or rules anyone knows, thanks in advance!
Full Version: Travel Overseas After N-400?
There is never a thing with the INS called "No Fear". She just has to maintain US residency in order to qualify. So if she somehow breaks this then she could easily be denied. You need to prove you are living and residing in the US not in Canada. So does your situation cause an alarm? It could. It's not as straight forward as someone moving overseas to get a job, but still you seem to be holding up residency in Canada rather then the US. This could possibly pose a problem.
It will all depend on your Interview officer, how much hard core evidence you can prove you are maintaining US residency etc. You are at least close to your home to pick up mail and easily travel back for the FP, Interview etc. One thing that probably would be the best is to just commute each day if it's only an hour. This then shows you are still living in the US with ties more then just keeping the home, but living in Canada.
Honestly you will never know what an IO might do or not do, nothing is ever "a sure safe thing". Some seem to have no problems even being away for 8 months at time, while others have been denied for being far less. Just depends really on who you get and what they determine as breaking the residency rules...
It will all depend on your Interview officer, how much hard core evidence you can prove you are maintaining US residency etc. You are at least close to your home to pick up mail and easily travel back for the FP, Interview etc. One thing that probably would be the best is to just commute each day if it's only an hour. This then shows you are still living in the US with ties more then just keeping the home, but living in Canada.
Honestly you will never know what an IO might do or not do, nothing is ever "a sure safe thing". Some seem to have no problems even being away for 8 months at time, while others have been denied for being far less. Just depends really on who you get and what they determine as breaking the residency rules...
Hey that is not overseas. I have not idea about your question though. I would think you really only need to establish residency for the application, but these IO can be fickle.
QUOTE(kmineo @ Apr 30 2008, 09:09 AM) 
Hey that is not overseas. I have not idea about your question though. I would think you really only need to establish residency for the application, but these IO can be fickle.
Any location outside the USA is considered to be "overseas" that includes bordering countries like Canada and Mexico.
Residency in the USA is a very big factor for Naturalization.
That seems kind of silly, I am not sure who came up with that shortening, was it that hard to say out of country. I know if I use "I am going overseas" outside VJ as a trip across the border I would be laughed out. Just like I imagine a french person traveling to Germany would never say I am traveling overseas.
This statement is a direct result of sitting and waiting and waiting and get bored waiting on the 10 year Green Card.
This statement is a direct result of sitting and waiting and waiting and get bored waiting on the 10 year Green Card.
the N-400 form doesn't even mention Overseas.. the question is this...
http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/N-400.pdf
QUOTE
How many total days did you spend outside of the United States during the past five years?
http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/N-400.pdf
Assuming she's applying on the "three years married to a US Citizen" rule, there are a few rules:
1. She must not have abandoned her residence in the US. Regardless of where she's visited or for how long, she must have maintained her primary home inside the US.
2. She must not have taken any single trip outside the US for more than six months during the past three years (they may allow some exceptions to this rule for trips up to one year, but it increases the burden of proving that continuous residence wasn't abandoned).
3. She must have spent more than half of the days of the preceeding three years actually physically inside the US.
She's got to meet these requirements both at the time she initially files the N-400 plus at the time she goes for her naturalization interview, maybe 6-8 months later.
I'm not an expert on this matter, but I believe the fact that she's maintaining her home inside the US, returning to it every weekend, not selling it or renting it out to someone else, and spending most of her time there when classes are not being held, is reasonable evidence that she hasn't abandoned permanent residence. It would be even more convincing if the place she stayed while in Canada was something like a college dormitory, hotel room, short term rental, or other living arrangement that's obviously much more short term in nature than her US residence.
One area of concern is that, if she's spending all her weekdays in Canada and only weekends in the US, she's accumulating a lot of days outside the US. Obviously, if she had been doing that for the past three years, she'd have more than half her days outside the US, and thus wouldn't be eligible for naturalization. But if she's already spent three years inside the US, then a few months of going back and forth won't add up to enough days to come close to the limit.
The safest thing to do is to wait until she becomes a citizen before she leaves the US. Once she's a citizen, she can leave whenever she wants, for as long as she wants, and she'll always be guaranteed the right to re-enter the US. That said, I don't think your plan is terribly dangerous. You may want to discuss it with an actual attorney who is qualified to give actual legal advice, though.
1. She must not have abandoned her residence in the US. Regardless of where she's visited or for how long, she must have maintained her primary home inside the US.
2. She must not have taken any single trip outside the US for more than six months during the past three years (they may allow some exceptions to this rule for trips up to one year, but it increases the burden of proving that continuous residence wasn't abandoned).
3. She must have spent more than half of the days of the preceeding three years actually physically inside the US.
She's got to meet these requirements both at the time she initially files the N-400 plus at the time she goes for her naturalization interview, maybe 6-8 months later.
I'm not an expert on this matter, but I believe the fact that she's maintaining her home inside the US, returning to it every weekend, not selling it or renting it out to someone else, and spending most of her time there when classes are not being held, is reasonable evidence that she hasn't abandoned permanent residence. It would be even more convincing if the place she stayed while in Canada was something like a college dormitory, hotel room, short term rental, or other living arrangement that's obviously much more short term in nature than her US residence.
One area of concern is that, if she's spending all her weekdays in Canada and only weekends in the US, she's accumulating a lot of days outside the US. Obviously, if she had been doing that for the past three years, she'd have more than half her days outside the US, and thus wouldn't be eligible for naturalization. But if she's already spent three years inside the US, then a few months of going back and forth won't add up to enough days to come close to the limit.
The safest thing to do is to wait until she becomes a citizen before she leaves the US. Once she's a citizen, she can leave whenever she wants, for as long as she wants, and she'll always be guaranteed the right to re-enter the US. That said, I don't think your plan is terribly dangerous. You may want to discuss it with an actual attorney who is qualified to give actual legal advice, though.
Yes I know Canada is not overseas. Ther term I was using "overseas" in was an example of someone working overseas in like India and living there is easier to prove abandonment of residency then someone travelling across the border to Canada back and forth as the two are next to each other.
They know overseas locations take a lot more time and money and hassle to travel to and back from while land borders like Canada/Mexico can be done easily ever day possibly. This is why the original poster may or may not have an issue. If it was school "overseas" it would be less likely they would be affording to fly back every week, considering this is why they are not going to school in the US in the first place and so the IO would mostly likely deny them for breaking residency status.
So yes as mentioned, any time outside of the US counts against you, Canada, Bahamas, Mexico, Tibet, Mauritania etc. Anywhere that is not US soil...
They know overseas locations take a lot more time and money and hassle to travel to and back from while land borders like Canada/Mexico can be done easily ever day possibly. This is why the original poster may or may not have an issue. If it was school "overseas" it would be less likely they would be affording to fly back every week, considering this is why they are not going to school in the US in the first place and so the IO would mostly likely deny them for breaking residency status.
So yes as mentioned, any time outside of the US counts against you, Canada, Bahamas, Mexico, Tibet, Mauritania etc. Anywhere that is not US soil...
A friend of my wife is doing this - she has been here more than 3 years and has applied for citizenship based on marriage and is waiting for her biometrics and interview. Her USC husband has moved to Colombia and is getting their house situated. She will move their also while waiting but after biometrics. They are using a brother's address in USA for their mail. When she gets the interview letter, they will fly back and go for the interview. In the meantime they are keeping an eye on how long she will end up 'overseas' and would avoid long periods if it came to that. They are planning on living abroad the rest of their lives, with the ability to travel to USA as and when they want along with retirement benefits for her through marriage. I don't know why you couldn't do something similar if you are already at that point e.g. can apply for citizenship based on 3 years on greencard. If you haven't met it - then its a different issue and perhaps continuing to live on the US side of border may be more correct till you reach the 3 year mark. Good Luck
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.