Hi All-

Been asking around and searching on this forum, but no dice. I am an I129F filer, and currently my fiance (or wife) is waiting for the interview date as wel as instructions for medical exam. I have been stressing about this for a while now. Here's a quick timeline of what has occurred:

April '07 - went back to visit her; went Thailand for vacation, and went to Vung Tau for wedding pictures (we hired a shop call Casta to take wedding pictures, basically for our own album safekeep).

June '07 - Filed the I129F, and subsequent NOA followed (the normal stuff)

December '07 and January '08 - Went back again to be in the wedding reception, which was planned out months prior. We did not obtain marriage certificate or license as we knew we have to do that here in the US, and that's what we wanted to do.

Here's my question - will this wedding picture taking, in April, and wedding reception in January have a negative affect at her interview. Will it possibly be a case for them to deny her? We hired an agent in VN to help her with the paperwork, and we have asked him and he said as long as you did not obtain a marriaged certificate you should be OK. Of course you would think it would be OK, but from all of my research it sounds like they do whatever they feel like to. So, if there are any members out there that have done something similar to what I have done, please please please reply back to this post. Your feedback is greatly appreciated, and best of luck to everyone and his/her journey.

Thanks,
Phuong

I can't imagine it would affect you, but I actually do not know one way or the other.

You would think it would actually lead credibility to your case. Obviously your fiancee's family isn't going to all fly out to the United States for a wedding celebration, so it makes sense to do something in Vietnam for their family.

We did the same thing for my fiancee's family, too. It gave her family a party to remember and a proper send off for their daughter. It just seems to make sense.

Edit: I should caution, however, that this IS the government, so the "common sense" policy may not always be in effect. So I'd wait for someone with more experience to weigh in.

I would recommend to avoid giving them anything the would make them suspect a marriage has taken place, this can cause them to hold on issuing a K-1 visa until they or you can prove that a marriage has not taken place.

The number of trips to the foreign country is good evidence of relationship.

Well, one of the requirements going into the interview is to obtain a marital status that she is single, which has been obtained...

I agree. If someone sees those pictures, they will halt the processing of the visa right then and there and make you jump through all sorts of hoops to prove you are not married. I don't even think the paperwork proving you are not married will be enough proof. I am betting they will tell you that day to go back and get another one of those forms to prove you didn't do it in the mean time cause the pictures make it look like you did.

Put those pictures in a safe place to bring with you. Show other forms of proof.

I would second what YuandDan wrote. I would add that I would prepare notatoized statements from everyone (photo studio, family, fiancee, etc) a about the pictures and reception just in case the Consulate finds out by asking neighbors or family members. If they suspect you got married, then they will need you to prove otherwise.

Peter and Thi

I-129F Sent : 2007-05-26
I-129F NOA1 : 2007-06-11
I-129F RFE(s) :
RFE Reply(s) :
I-129F NOA2 : 2007-10-26
Touched: 2007-11-02
NVC Recieved: 2007-11-16
Consulate recieved ??????
Packet 3 sent 2007-12-11
Packet 3 received 2007-12-24
Packet 3 returned 2007-12-28
Packet 4 sent 2008-1-14
Email Reply with Interview Date 2008-1-23
Interview Date 2008-2-27
Passed Interview 2008-02-27
Visa Pick Up Date 2008-3-05
Received Visa 2008-2-29 (called to pick up earlier)
POE 2008-3-05 Los Angeles

Yes about the single cert, however what's to stop you from marrying after getting the single cert? "Wedding pics" can cause the Counselor officer to question the validity of the single cert.

I would not include any pictures that could give the CO an inkling that there was a wedding or anything resembling a wedding. All it takes is the measure of doubt and you could be done.

There's got to be a person, or two, or three, out there that has done something similar to me. I find it hard to believe that I am the first person to have done this. If this is indeed a problem (I still would love to have a person who has done the same thing as I did to reply back to this topic), then which one do your think is a better step to take:

1. Hiding the photos of the wedding reception and wedding picture trip
or
2. Obtaining legal documents proving that you are single - both for my fiancee and myself.

Thanks again for all your feedback.

Phuong

Lots of people have hidden pictures of ceremonies and parties that elude to the fact that they might look like they got married.

The legal document part is not in question whatsoever......We have all had to do that. It's a question of if the embassy sees those pictures and doubts your are telling the truth about being single. It does not matter if you have the legal documents proving you are single at that point. If I were the interviewer and I saw the pictures looking like a wedding, and that legal document was not dated yesterday (as in the day before the interview), I would think you married in between getting that legal document and coming to the interview.

Why would you risk that no matter what? Is it that important to you that you must show those pictures at the embassy?

You are absolutely right, but if I ask my fiancee to re-obtain the single status cert now, I think it woulddn't be a problem considering I am currently in the states and there are also plane tickets indicating that I have gone back to the States since January. It would be, of course, impossible to get marry in Vietnam if I am physically in the States.

Actually, my fiancee obtained the single status paperwork after I left Vietnam in January, so she doesn't even need to re-obtain that.

Phuong

How will you prove exactly when the pictures were taken?

Well, of course the pictures were taken in the past, and since I am not in Vietnam between January 8, 2008 to present and my fiancee requested and obtained the single status a week after January 8, 2008 when I already left (and physically obtained it about a month later) ... this should be good enough proof, right?

I do understand your thoughts on not showing them the pictures, but like PeterFB said, if for whatever reason they find out, then I think it's a "No go" for sure. So, that's my thought on being upfront and honest...

Phuong

Everyone, and I mean everyone I have talked with privately has had a wedding ceremony in Vietnam. All people I have talked to refer to their fiancee as their "wife." We had a wedding ceremony ourselves, four days after our engagement ceremony. I have been advised by my lawyer not to mention the word "wedding" or show any pictures of the wedding.

To me, this seems stupid, but I can believe that the consulate would make trouble over this. It's a very simple question with a very simple resolution: If I died today, would my "wife" be entitled to anything? The answer is not no, but hell no. End of inquiry. We may consider ourselves married in our minds, but it is thrust in my face more strongly every day that we are NOT married, and we don't have any legal rights or standing that married couples enjoy. So give us a visa already, HCM consulate, so we can GET married, OK?

I am in a similar situation. My fiancée and I are filing for a K1 but because her family is Catholic, it is very important to them to have a wedding ceremony/reception party in a Catholic church in Viet Nam since they obviously can't come to the US. I emailed the US Consulate in HCMC and explained my situation and asked for their advice. This was their reply:

Visa categories that applicants apply are based on the nature of the relationship. If you marry your fiancée and sign a marriage certificate in Vietnam or elsewhere, you have to file an immigrant visa petition on behalf of your spouse so that she can apply for a visa to immigrate to the US . If you just have a wedding ceremony in Vietnam without legally documents - marriage certificate - signed, you can file a fiancée visa petition for her. For more information on filing an immigrant or fiancée visa petition, you should contact the regional Citizenship and Immigrant Services office that has jurisdiction over your place of residence. You can also find this information on the USCIS website at www.uscis.gov

If you have further inquiries, please do not delete your original email in all correspondence.

Sincerely,
Info Unit Staff
Consular Section
U.S. Consulate General HCMC

The Consulate is fully aware of how important this is to many couples. I would think that any dated receipts, such as for the photographer, would establish when the ceremony took and place. Therefore, any Single Cert dated after that time(as close to the interview as possible) should be acceptable.

I want to state that I'm not recommending you volunteer the information. That is up to you. I'm just sharing some info with you so you can make your own decision. I haven't even decided how I will handle the situation when the time comes. I'm only considering it because of the short amount time I have been in this relationship and because it might lend some credibility. I also don't like the idea of keeping secrets.

Good luck to you. Keep me posted. I'd like to know what you decide.

CraigCam - I just sent an email to hcmcinfo@state.gov asking pretty much the same question you posted. I'm sure I will get the same reply. I will then print out a copy of this reply and attach it as part of the whole evidence package. This evidence plus my dated records (photographer, wedding reception receipts, hotel receipt, passport dated I left VN before the last Single status record was issued, etc.) should be good to go. Of course I will inform my fiancee to only give them the evidence that they need, but definitely not to intentionally hide anything...

Like Melrose Plant said, “don’t ever mention the word “wedding” if I was you. We will have a wedding's picture at the Church, but we will not show them at the interview, because I do not want my K1 compliate.

I personally don’t trust the US Consulate General (Info Unit Staff) eventhough an email was clear. But heck knows.

So, be careful, buddy.

Haonie

I talked it over with my fiancee and we decided not to show any pictures of the wedding ceremony. We will show pictures of the reception party and refer to it as an engagement party.

Ok We had a engagement cermony in Vietnam and got married over here I would not say a word of the marriage K1 is for your Fiancee not your wife so No dont show your photos or I think you will have a huge mess on your hands.

Since you didn't apply for I130 you can bring her as fiance only if they find out about marriage they stop this and start over with I130 as a spouse. don't even bring the photo album to US with her

Hi Phunong,

I agree with the other posters about NOT showing the photos. In addition, I would recommend that you and your fiance stop making any references to "Wife" and "Wedding Pictures" and "Wedding Reception". What you have is a "Fiance" and "Engagement Photos" and "Engagement Party". Repetition of the words is important: The last thing you want to do is make a "slip of the tongue" in front of the embassy and say "Wife" or "Wedding" when you are there for a "Fiance" visa.

Best of luck to you two!

Warm Regards,
Samby

Everything you do without the Marriage Certificate signed and sealed is considered: HUGE @$$ Party with dressing up like marriage couples and bunch of people who you don't personally know, come, eat, drink your foods and beers and they seem to be very important to your fiance's family.

What Craig said is clear and simple, Phuong please take note! Your picture with you and your "wife/fiance" whatever you want to call it, is just a picture, C.O. is fully aware of this tradition in Vietnam. No respectable family will let their beloved daughter marry a foreigner and leave with him, without having some kind of "Official Announcement Ceremonial Party" to the whole neighborhood and klans to share the good news. Therefore, your "wedding-lite"/"engagement" ceremony is not only wanted but expected by HCMC. Do not, I mean do not hide the information or appear to be deciving as some suggested on this thread. HCMC knows you think you married her, no wedding-look-alike will override the "Certificate of Single Status" from both of you. Also, you know how easy it is for HCMC to pick up the phone and call over the Dept of Vital Records and ask: hey, did Phuong and such and such get married last year, they claim they aren't! The answer would be devastating for you if it is YES and clear up everything if it is NO.

Remember, your relationship is REAL, isn't it? Then you can only give HCMC what you have. You can't give what you don't! Focus here, everything you do and worry these days is a very good attitude, you are anticipate the worse and hope for the best. So you worry about the "wedding" pictures? Get your Single Status Certified notes ready, both of you. Having a letter stating that your relationship is ABC and you can't wait to bring her to America to "get married" officially. C.O. will not just deny/delay your Visa for one reason, usually, they aren't sure if your story is real! And it's up to you to help them to see that it is...

Focus, not a single piece of evidence will make or break your case, it's the totality of your love story that backed with supportive and convincing evidence will give the C.O. a FULLER view of the "big picture" of your relationship, and as the result, will decide the fate of your fiance's visa application, hopefully in your favor!

Think big picture!

I just want to share with you a story, my fiancé and I still don’t know what we should or should NOT.

1. I have a friend (a brother of brother-in-law). He went back to Vietnam on 2004 and had the engagement party. On summer 2005 he flew back there again (15 days before an interview). He celebrated his wedding at the Church (they are both Catholic).

Interview: They asked her why K1 with wedding’s picture at the church. Said, “because my family could not come to US to attend our wedding, and my parents expected my fiancé could do it here and …. lah, lah.. “only the Church’s pictureâ€�). They accepted and the pink was given out.

My case:

Of course we will have the engagement party, but we will also have pictures at the Church (my case looks like him, her parents expect).

At Interview: If we present "the wedding Church's pictures, I will then write a letter with explanation why, and why, and I am already done with it (she will take with her at interview).

My friend said, "Church's pictures are one of the strongest evidence for your case". I am concern it now.

I have 3 week to think about this issue. Is this too risk? Or roll a dice.

What do you think? Present Church's pictures with an explain letter. 2005 and 2008 totally different

Thanks,

All-

Below is the email I sent to, and the reply I got from HCMC Consular Info. My fiance will print a copy of this and take it to the interview. We will present all evidence, including wedding ceremony pictures, and not hide anything. Again, we are not legally married yet as we have not signed any marriage certificate or license.

Phuong



From: Phuong (removed my email address)
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 6:33 PM
To: HCMC Consular Info
Subject:



Hello,

I am in the process of filing a K-1 Visa, I129F, and have a question that hopefully you can answer. One of the requirements for the I129F is that my fiancee and I should not be legally married, meaning we should be Single in our marital status and should not sign a marriage license or certificate. Does having a wedding ceremony and/or reception prior to the K-1 Visa interview, but not signing a marriage license or certificate, still qualify us for the I129F Petition for Alien Fiancee filing? Your reply is greatly appreciated.


Thank you in advance,
Phuong
________________________________


RE: ‏
From: Bui, Loan Thi Thu (Ho Chi Minh City) (built@state.gov) on behalf of HCMC Consular Info (HCMCinfo@state.gov)
Sent: Wed 3/26/08 2:38 AM
To: Phuong (Removed my email address...)

Dear Phuong,

You are correct. K-1 visa petition is only valid if you and your fiancée do NOT obtain marriage certificate. If you have or do not have a wedding ceremony and/or reception, your K-1 visa petition is still valid.

Sincerely,

Info Unit Staff
Consular Section
U.S. Consulate General HCMC

Tel: (84-8) 822 9433 – ext 4636

Fax: (84-8) 824 5572

E-mail: hcmcinfo@state.gov (regarding visa issues)

acshcmc@state.gov (regarding services for U.S. citizens)

Adoption: HanoiAdoptions@state.gov

Website: http://hochiminh.usconsulate.gov
This e-mail is UNCLASSIFIED based on the definitions provided in E.O. 12958.

Thank you Phuong, this will clear up any confusions out there.

Nice work, Phuong. I think you are doing the right thing. The more I think about it the more comfortable I am with your decision. We will probably do the same thing.

Is the Single Certificate something that is requested in Packet 3, or is it an extra precaution that you are taking in your case? Where would my fiancee go in HCMC to obtain this and what are the fees and process times?

Good luck to you!

CraigCam - we hired an agent to do the paperwork for my fiance in HCMC, and according to him this single status cert (not sure the exact name) is required for her. I don't know exactly where she got it, but I think the first or best place to find out is the local Police office/headquarter or whatever. The cost is a few hundred thousand "dong" (VN money), this is peanuts if you look at all of the other fees. I believe the process time is 30 days or less, but please don't quote me on this. If you haven't noticed by now, but my knowledge of HCMC's geography and all of the governmental services is extrememly limited.

As for the petitioner, there is no such thing as a marital status certificate (or something like that) in the US, at least not in the county I live in. I asked PeterFB on this forum, and he mentioned he did not have anything like this. I called two different Cook County Clerk's Office, and one rep told me all you can do is an affidavit of single status - signed and notarized. The other rep told me I can get a certified letter (it has the Clerk's Office seal) of "No Records" found. So, I ended up doing both, although the certified letter from the Clerk's Office didn't really specify anything about marital status.

Hope this helps...
Phuong