For babbles et al

I can totally relate to that - I did my four year degree and I *loved* my degree. I loved the variety of things I was learning because I had to learn about all subjects. I loved working with the children and I loved coming up with new and exciting things for them. By I think my third year it began to focus more on paperwork (I graduated in 2007) and by the fourth year I was lucky to make it through my final placement because aside from driving over 50 miles each day, I was having to teach six separate subjects a day (or thereabouts) each with a detailed A4 plan (removing margins, size 8 font etc) for the lesson as well as weekly, medium and long term plans, references to E&E, ECM, NNS, NLS, NC, PNS... the list goes on...

I was in bed by 9pm every night after working 12 hour days - I prolly should have spent *longer* on my planning but I just couldn't. It almost got to the point that I couldn't be bothered - I just wanted to get through it and I thought that is no way to live. I don't want to spend my life feeling like that, the children don't deserve it, I don't deserve it... It really sucks because at first I had so much energy and imagination but it was sapped through constant assessment and cross referencing of the million different supplements the goverment had released to try and patch up the holes in its shoddy education system... harsh, no?!

The way I see it in the UK is that the NC is the only statutory doucment - give that to the teachers, let them use LCP/QCA schemes to help them plan but let them get on with it instead of trying to have them duck and weave to hit all the g-spots for the government

Ok... that's my rant Maybe the US is different - I want to at least get into TA work for a while anyway - I love working with kids, it will enlighten me to the education system there and if nothing else I can volunteer and maybe get babysitting work out of it

Aly, Thanks for starting the thread -I was half joking about making you do it - but you are so good at kicking these things off.

I've been teaching since 2004 so, only a relatively short time, but I feel I have aged so much as a result. The work-life balance is really hard to get right and even working as a supply teacher this past few months I've been struggling to retain it. Although, I wasn't strictly employed just for cover purposes - I was drafted in to write schemes for a shortage subject. I've loved that part of it, making resources and supporting other teachers who are not specialists in my subject and giving the kids help that they've never really been able to get before.

To be honest, I am so relieved right now to be given the opportunity to have a break from it and I'm undecided about going back. The California State Credentialing thing is a big deterrent for me, but I would be interested to hear from anyone who has gone through this after a period of being qualified abroad.

The other thing that scares me is just the difference in the systems. I have a very limited understanding of how the US education system works and it is daunting to think that on top of the usual paperwork I might have a completely alien system to get to grips with too.

So, for the moment, I'm considering an alternate career. Besides, teacher's everywhere are suffering the same issues. Why jump from the frying pan into the fire?

And to comment on Karen's points - I think we all feel the same. The kids make it an enjoyable job but it does get to the stage sometimes where you're too knackered/jaded to even enjoy that fully.

I don't know much about getting qualified over there but you're right - moving abroad gave me a good excuse *cough* I mean reason to not go into teaching. It's hard to get out of because you feel like you have put so much time and effort and training to do something that you feel guilty or even a failure if you don't stick with it - I felt awful for the longest time and I was really torn between trying to make a go of it or just not bothering. My confidence was so badly knocked during my final placement that I felt like I could never get up in front of a class and teach effectively as well as managing all the other things you need to. I felt like I would be detrimental to the children's education and that is a horrible feeling. I am sure I wouldn't have been that terrible but it is hard to bounce back when you feel like that.

I think having a fresh start will allow me at least to see things with fresh eyes - I really want to find a career that I love. I don't want to be one of those people who lives for the weekends and begrudges getting out of bed in the morning. Some people think I am crazy - that there is no way you can have a job like that and that work is a necessary evil. I think finding the perfect job is like falling in love - you might have to go through a few jobs to find the one that is perfect for you

One day I will have a job that I will love so much that I will look forward to the end of the weekend I think that is a good goal to have

I wasn't around for the start of the conversation but it's one that interests me a lot, so you'll excuse my butting in

I'm a teacher by profession too... worked ten years in Australia, then two more here in London, and it's only relatively recently that I've moved 'sideways' into an education-related job, that doesn't see me in the classroom all that much... for the first five or six years of my career I worked easily twelve or thirteen hour days, on average, and because it was a private school there was Saturday sport and mid-week afternoon training on top... however, I found the system in Australia to be LOADS better than the one I found here; not faultless, by any means, but much of that time I was spending at work was making resources and creating schemes of work and actually doing something worthwhile, not a shedload of useless paperwork
and as I got more experienced, and I could re-use and refine the stuff I'd started with, I didn't need to stay as long each day, and I became a better and more confident teacher, so while it was still tiring, I didn't find it frustrating

teaching in the UK was a different story altogether...

if I'm over-simplifying, I think I'd blame league tables for the bulk of the problems, but there IS more to it than that... the absolutely crazy amount of paperwork would be another big thing
I was so glad to leave, after two years, and I wouldn't teach here again without knowing there'd been a major shake-up in the system

I still don't know what I'm going to do about a job in the US... I may go back to it; I get the impression it hasn't gone as ridiculous as the UK, and I don't think league tables exist
but my experience here has definitely scared me off, and there'll be the stupid accreditation issues in Texas too - I find it frankly insulting that twelve years of classroom experience, in pretty much every subject area at some point, teaching kids ranging in age from 9 to 19, six years' experience as a head of faculty, long-term positions on committees ranging from literacy to special needs, all counts for nothing
I can understand that there have to be checks and balances, but they NEED teachers, for Og's sake! it wouldn't be difficult for them to find out if I can actually do it

Yeah that does seem kinda crazy - I can understand some kind of course to train you on the US education system but you wouldn't need to be taught how to teach all over again. I don't have any experience outside of my training so I can understand why I might need to but still

Yes, paperwork is the killer here as well...and we do more every year (most of it having to do with No Child Left Behind-NCLB)...

But I just asked a teacher I work with (originally from Nottingham), and she said there is far more paperwork in the UK than here...and since most things are computerised, even the paperwork is easier.

NCLB is a four-letter word ...

Amen Sistah!

Haha - maybe that's the secret? All our acronyms seem to be three letter ones...

That's what Alex (my ex-pat fellow teacher) said...

what, like PGCE? NC? GCSE?

Nah - I was thinking, ECM, E&E, NLS, NNS, PNS, ELS, ALS, FLS... I am sure there are more but I've been trying to forget them

I don't think I know any of them

I consider myself well blessed

ECM - Every Child Matters
E&E - Excellence and Enjoyment
NLS - National Literacy Strategy
NNS - National Numeracy Strategy
PNS - Primary National Strategy
ELS - Extra Literacy Support
ALS - Additional Literacy Support
FLS - Further Literacy Support...

Buttresses to the governments holey curriculum and strategies

it's SUCH a shame how crap the education system here is now... it used to be one of the best in the world

I know

To be honest, I went into teaching because when I was coming to the end of my degree I just wanted some career stability with the added bonus of actually using my subject knowledge, rather than going into a generic graduate profession or training for another two or three years on an MSc. I was told that I would be snapped up, never be stuck for a job, could demand the best conditions simply because my degree is in a shortage subject (Physics).

The reality is that the system has got so used to 'making do' that it doesn't really matter whether you can offer subject specialism or not. Jobs in schools where it does still matter tend to come up very infrequently and other schools don't offer 'A' levels at all and are simply looking for 'science' teachers. The curriculum has changed so much at GCSE to cater for the lack of subject specialists. The government only seems to be interested in encouraging schools to get any kind of pass out of students (A*-G) and score in the value-added portion of the results tables. In many schools the standards have dropped so significantly that it's not about who can 'teach' so much as who can get control the crowds sufficiently to get all students to obtain their target grade rather than pushing them to attain higher.

Only a year ago this situation was so ridiculous that we were chasing students for almost a year during their GCSE studies to do coursework (since this constituted 33% of their grade), running sessions in our own time that kids did not turn up to time and time again. The kids who met all the deadlines ended up with no better scores than the ones it took a year to get coursework out of because we gave them so little time by comparison. We were babysitting the ones who couldn't be bothered just so that they would score something for our league tables because the pressure to do that came from above. Needless to say we got a 100% pass rate.

Why are we so scared of kids failing? We're not helping them in life. The education system here seems to be all about attainment for league tables and never about individual kids. The government is constantly changing the system to make it easier rather than more interesting or challenging for those who want to learn. Those who don't want to learn, well I don't think they should be left behind but we're selling out the education of those who feel the time is right for them to learn.

Ok, rant over.

It makes the nation look bad. Let's worry more about "how we look" rather than "are these kids really getting it". Right now, we have a 13 year old in Grade 5. That doesn't "look good". Never mind that maybe this kid doesn't want to learn, can't learn, or maybe a combination of both.

Education here in the US was sold out a long time ago, IMHO. It's just recently that it came to the forefront when reports like this came out: http://www.morganquitno.com/edrank.htm

ETA: tried to get the chart to paste but I did something wrong. Oh well. Click on the link above. It breaks down each state by how "smart" it is, from 2006-2007. Oy Vey!

See, I think it's ingrained in me to feel awkward about stating anything like this. But, the fact is - sometimes for some kids 'now' is not the right time, for others the system does not cater for their needs. It's a whole can of worms because focusing on either the kids who can or the kids who can't or don't (for whatever reason) in mainstream education is always going to make one of them suffer.

I don't want to go back to a system that isolates kids who can't or don't but I think there has to be a compromise - and somewhere along the way that compromise has to realise that not all kids are going to come out with the same or similar qualifications. We just need to make whatever qualification route they take equitable in some way and it is a really difficult task.

I think that there is too much emphasis on academia - if from an early age we instilled in children that it was great to be good at anything and not just English, maths and science and taught more vocational subjects from an earlier age then we wouldn't have problems with career shortages in skilled trades and children who may be good with their hands but are not very academic would still feel like they are achieving...

That was my big thing I got into my head in my final year at uni anyway - I think it is so sad when you see children who have fantastic spacial awareness and imagination but can't spell or punctuate properly and so instead of letting them flourish in a subject they are good at, they are forced to take more time to do something they may never fully understand... Not of course that I don't think spelling etc aren't important, just that I don't understand why other things aren't given the same precedence

babbles, I WHOLEHEARTEDLY AGREE with EVERYTHING you said above

see, you've made me talk in capitals

the whole school system is tragic... and worrying
I hope it changes soon...


( edited 'it's' to 'the whole school system' because on a re-read it looked like I thought agreeing with you was tragic and worrying )

After the events of last week (found in the Vent thread - Canada Forum...if you're interested), I've decided to abandon education as a career as soon as it is financially possible to do so. I'm going back to school to brush up on the career I started out on many years ago: drafting. I can find part time work that will pay a heck of a lot more and give me the flexiblity I need right now for my daughter. I need to be more involved in HER education, not just homework and such, but THERE, at the school to keep an eye on things. My daughter has special needs and is served by the Special Education Dept here and to be quite honest, I am NOT impressed one bit. *sigh* Education used to be such a wonderful field...at least for me.

This is it in a nutshell! One system of education that I've seen that IMHO works is the Montessori method. But it's private education and by golly it's expensive! Kids learning at THEIR pace, that's what it should be. Then there's the kids who want to, but for whatever reason have a very hard time getting it and the system doesn't cater to their needs because they "don't qualify" for anything. It's those kids that hurt my very soul.

Karen, I read the thread. I totally empathise with you. I loved teaching too but there are too many problems inherent in the system to make it a truly enjoyable vocation anymore. I respect your choices for leaving education as a career although it sounds like you will be a real loss to the profession. At the end of the day, teaching is too demanding emotionally these days - I have no idea how people who have kids cope with the work-life balance, I have found it difficult enough as a single person without family responsibilities. I am looking forward to times where when the working day is done it is really done.

Sounds like Steiner schools...

I think that after thousands of pounds of debt and four years of training I was amazed at how quickly the profession went downhill... ok not the profession in terms of teachers being cr@p but in terms of how the government kept trying to patch up their leaky system with more and more paperwork...

I don't know what I will end up doing in the US - I would really love a website with a career database or quiz or something that will give me some ideas - I want a job I really love but I just don't know where to start looking...