Guys...like o_O

We just got our NOA2 today so now I'm freaking a bit. So ya'l are all British and my fiance's Scottish. For those of you who have been in the US awhile and working and everything, what the heck do you do to file taxes? o_O

Have been digging around awhile and seeing how long the Green card status can be stretched out, or even dual citizenship set up, etc. And realizing that we know all the things we need to do for the US government but haven't really heard a peep out of the UK government.

So what happens when a Brit comes over here and works all year? I looked it up and I know the US taxes you, but is there some kind of waiver or any sort of communication going on with the UK gov. all this time - do they try to tax you and you have to get a refund, or are there fees or penalties or tedious paperwork or what?

Can I just say: AAHH.

Props to everyone who's made it this far xD

Congrats on your approval...was soooo happy when I saw it! About the other, I have NO idea...

There are tax treaties between the US and UK that stave off double taxation.

When your guy moves here, he will probably have worked in Scotland, right? You will report that income on IRS Form 2555 as 'foreign earned income' on your US tax return when you file next spring for 2008. You will probably choose to file jointly (married filing jointly). If your combined incomes are under a certain amount, his wages earned in Scotland will not be taxed on your US return - but you still have to show it. The total household wage amount changes each year - I believe it's around $85000.00 this year.

Long story short - if you earn as a couple less than the maximum, his wages will not be subject to US tax. But you have to show them on the return, so it requires an additional form. TurboTax or similar self-help software walks you through this nicely, or you can hire a tax professional to help you.

We found the biggest nuisance about this was converting sterling to dollars for the return. He should start saving his paystubs from January 1, 2008 as the tax year in the UK runs April to April compared to the US method of calendar year - ie he won't get a 'W-2' for 2008 so you have to hand calculate what he earned in calendar year 2008 for US tax purposes.

He will also likely be entitled to a tax refund on his UK wages. He fills out a form with his employer right before he goes to get that money back (or he can visit his Social Security office). If memory serves me it's called a P85 - someone here who has done it more recently can confirm or correct me. And they can mail the money to the US.

Thanks green You guys got yours the fastest I think! You win, you should get cake and a party and things, congratulations to you too
To be honest I feel really BAD about it...it really doesn't make a difference to us. Iain is finishing up school so can't come over until October anyway, so I kind of wish I could...trade places with someone at CSC or someone who's been waiting ages, you know?


Rebeccajo that is an amazingly helpful and thorough post Thanks so much.

But no he's never had a job ever and keeps trying to find one but he's a lazy bum and probably won't have had a job ever when he moves here xD In our defense we're students so meh, but nah that's not what I was worried about with taxes. I'm worried about like...living here, working HERE, how that money is going to be taxed for at least the next three years. From what I found googling around, you can't apply for US citizenship for 3 years after the AOS under K1. Permanent residents are taxed by the US government though, which is fair since you work and live here. But it's just weird that he'll...still I guess officially be a British citizen. I just don't know how that works, if he still has to pay british taxes (please god no) or what sort of hoops we'll have to jump through for that, at least until he gets citizenship.

Or honestly I assumed everyone on these boards was getting US citizenship but now that I've searched a bit it really doesn't seem to be the case You can basically be a permanent resident like...forever, seems like, just renew every ten years.
Problem is, trying to search for info on it yields lots of information on how you're taxed if you're an American living in UK (all the expats), but basically no information the other way around

I keep telling him he needs to transfer all his GBPounds to me though while the exchange rate is so high because it might even out just as soon as Bush is out of office have to squander as much money as we can.

UK citizens don't pay tax to the UK unless they are earning the money there. So when your man gets a job here, the only government he will pay taxes to is the US government.

However, should you ever move to the UK and work there, you will owe taxes to the US government on those wages. US citizens are bound for life to pay to their government, no matter where the money is earned.

Which means - if your husband naturalizes and you both return to the UK, you would both owe taxes to the US government. Something to think about for those US/UK couples who are waiting for the UK citizen to naturalize before they return to the UK to live.

Yeh...back when we were first deciding who was gonna move where, it did seem like me immigrating to the UK would be harder than him coming here, just because the US is kind of...evil/more stringent/strict/demanding than other countries on these sorts of things, it seemed like Was really quite scary.

Really good to know, he just won't be taxed at all from the UK! Thanks a lot rebeccajo, that's one less thing to worry about. It seems awfully NICE and easygoing of the UK though, I'm slightly suspicious and if it turns out they're really this cool about, I wanna write them a nice letter and send some cookies

Or biscuits...mmm Penguins hobnobs. What could the US POSSIBLY have to offer to make up for what he'll lose!

They really are that "cool" about it.

probably someone will correcet me, but I don't know of any other countries you are taxed on your income by, while not actually living in them to earn that wage. So it's not that the UK is cool, just that the US is Crazy!!!

You know, we still talk about that angle of things sometimes.

My husband still believes there are more opportunities here - more jobs. He believes it's easier to rise yourself up out of the 'social class' you were born into. As an American, I wonder what it is he sees - the American middle class is disappearing IMO.

At least in the UK you can't become bankrupt and loose your home because of medical bills. If you loose your job, your unemployment doesn't run out at the end of six months. You can take buses, trains and cabs to get to where you need to go - Americans are slaves to cars, the upkeep of them and gasoline that will now end up costing us more than the car itself.

I have a son and so my husband moved to the US. As that child is spreading his wings - I sometimes wonder - would we be happier across the pond?

That is if you can get a home in the UK in the first place.

That's true too.

We had a thread about that recently. Buying a home would be my biggest fear insofar as returning. And while I hate to bring up my 'age', it's a fear for me because we do have some equity in our home, and that equity in dollars wouldn't go very far in sterling. I wouldn't really be keen on being a renter. That's for youngsters..

There were some people in that other thread, though, who felt the cost of housing in the UK was no worse than here. But it was also pointed out that depended on which part of the US one lives in.

or what part of the UK.

Yeh, I've gotten the impression from Iain that it's just not...really the standard in Scotland for people to buy rather than rent their homes, whereas I've always gotten the impression that here in the US that was what you aimed for. I don't know, I can see that maybe pulling yourself out of the social class you're born into might be harder in the UK. I consider Iain's family to be just...straight out friggin rich, by their habits and spendings and things - they're kind of upper class Edinburghers and my understanding is that other cities like Glasgow and Manchester and Fife and stuff kind of look at Edinburgh as snobs and are more working class, so I don't know how accurate my impressions have been.

The public transportation IS awesome, but if you don't live in a city it's not much help I guess - people still have to drive into work and pay more than us by far for petrol still. Or one day we were going to the um...that Swedish furniture store place, about an hour outside of Edinburgh, on bus, and saw the workers on there who had to ride 1 or 2 + hours back to their houses. They looked pretty miserable. And the trains are VERY expensive to me, too; I positively quivered every time Iain bought us train tickets.

It seems like in Scotland regular things like transport and eating out, maybe groceries, costs pretty high, but then COOL things like anything cultural and tickets and trips are very low, so it makes it look like an awesome kind of bohemian accessible lifestyle. Like being able to get new CDs for 5 pounds at Fopp or some such place, friggin awesome. 3 pound books, unheard of in the US. Concert tickets to really really good bands for 20 pounds, or a megabus journey (tee hee ) to some far off town for like...six pounds, amazing xD Because isn't the UK's minimum wage like 7 pounds or something? So that makes it sound...awesome.

I don't know. This is part of why I think it might be cool if the US tried socialized healthcare, for example. It seems to work well in the UK. They have higher taxes sure, but not THAT much higher, and it just seems worth it to me if it actually worked. But really I think a lot of this stuff comes down to the difference between living in cities and then just random spots, rather than the difference between the two countries. Edinburgh to me in obscure South Carolina suburbia is like Paradise.

And Penguins.

Well....but that's 'equalizing' itself in a scary fashion. Take Northern Ireland, for example, where my husband is from. Up until about two years ago, property was still dirt cheap there - mostly because nobody in their right mind moved into the country.

Once the peace process seemed to be holding, all hell broke loose on the real estate market. When my husband moved from NI in Sept 05, his house (a three bedroom semi in - um - 'bachelor condition') was worth about 35K. His brother's 3 bedroom terrace home (in great condition) valued around 70K.

I'm now told that Wes' house (remodeled as it was after he left) would be worth over 120K. His brother's house - 110K or better.

And all that happened in less than three years.

There's just not a lot of land in the UK but a lot of people who need a roof over their head. I can see why property is so high. Like I said, if we were ever to go back, finding a home we could afford would be my number one fear.

Property is high because credit has been cheap - I predict the global credit crunch is going to send those prices south again.


But the issue is affordability (what you expect to earn versus the cost of a home) - some places in the US are more out of whack in this regard (LA, for example, average house costing $500k and average HH income is $60k) than places in the UK. For many, the cost of housing is less of an issue in terms of a decision to go the other way depending on their circumstances.

the market rises & falls. Who's to say what will happen in 3 more years?

UK Housing Market Cracks

UK house prices slumped in the quarter to December 07, with London leading the way as momentum gathers towards the 2 year forecast for an average decline of 15% by August 2009. The mortgage banking sector has only just beginning to feel the impact of the housing slump as the number of foreclosures (repossessions) is expected to surge to a record busting 80,000 for 2008 from 40,000 last year. Northern Rock was the first to go bust, other banks will follow. But in the meantime watch out for other mortgage lenders, especially those exposed to the buy to let sector such as Paragon to be pushed towards bankruptcy, down 90% from its highs.



What I can get in Bristol:

2BR, 2BA
Asking Price £249,950

A unique two bedroom apartment situated on the ground floor of this luxury residential development and re-creation of an original Victorian building. The apartment itself benefits from a contemporary specification, open plan living/kitchen area, two bathrooms, water views and parking. Overlooking Conham River Park on the banks of the River Avon and enclosed by beautiful woodland, the remoteness of the location belies its proximity to local amenities and its convenient situation just a few miles from Bristol's city centre.

M, that's $500,000.00 US dollars.

It's lovely, I'm sure. Don't get me wrong.

My perspective is this and this only - it would take a lot of US dollars in pocket to move to the UK and put a large enough down payment on a property in order to end up with an affordable payment.

RJ, how insulting. I am well aware of the exchange rate. I'm going over next week as a matter of fact.

(AFAIK) you've never lived abroad (or in LA) so until you do, please don't lecture me on costs of living in the UK (or other parts of America).

You think decent houses in LA are under $500K??

Oh, yes, you think buying a house is the only option for a smart person. Not everyone can buy, and not everyone WANTS to.

It would take the exact same dollar amount for a downpayment for what would likely be a lesser property local to where Illumine currently lives. Property in California is really that expensive.

The "UK is so much more expensive" argument against going back does depend very much on where you currently live and where you plan to move back to.

Sister, I didn't insult you. Not yet.

Get over yourself.

Ok. That's apples to apples.

So I guess the next question is - CA or Bristol - what's the likelihood of being able to come up the downpayment?

Where are wages better?

I'm not arguing - not at all. I'm asking because I seriously don't know and am curious.

it's not just about wages tho, cost of living is different. Food, insurance, car, etc.

That said, my hubby probably made slightly better money in Bristol. He had more vacation, shorter hours & a shorter commute. All this factors into it.

Median HH income in LA county is about $40,000. Median HH income in the UK (and I believe Bristol closely matches UK averages) is about 30k sterling


I wouldn't argue that generally speaking, the US is not more affordable. But for some parts of the country it's about the same. I happen to live in one of those places.

I really don't know anything about finances and stuff, I'm still very much a noob and haven't graduated college yet. Terrified though!

I live in one of those good pocket places in the US I think, economically. I'm upstate SC/almost at NC, which is booming just now around Charlotte and Asheville, but still pretty low property costs and food costs and gas costs, compared to everywhere else. Apparently we make a good bit less too, but I think we still just...win. I don't know. Everybody comes down here to retire now though which is making the prices go up so I think in another decade or two it'll be bad here, too

I think it shouldn't be undervalued too though, the way it does seem like the Brits (and most of Europe for that matter) gets much more vacation time than Americans do. I think we get what, 2 weeks a year maybe? I think Britain gets like 4 at least, seems like more, often...and better benefits besides too like better maternity or even paternity leave, isn't that right? They just kind of seem...happier to me, mostly. The rat race mentality seems a lot more prevalent in the states than in Britain and Europe. But again maybe I've only seen the good side of Britain.

Where are you in SC? I have family in Spartanburg - probably cheaper cost of living than most places in the UK, that's for sure.

I lived moved over to the UK a few years after graduation and then moved back almost 10 years later - I miss the UK a lot, especially the nearly 6 weeks vacation I gave up (reduced to 2 weeks here - yay!). Some things about the US are better, and some things are better in the UK, IMO.

I think that's the bottom line. There are going to be advantages/disadvantages to each. It would be interesting though to see a spreadsheet. Of course, that spreadsheet would be different for every couple, based on where they were going and what they expected to be earning. And what they were able to take with them from the US.

*scratches head*

I guess what floors me sometimes is thinking of taking our dollars over there. I mean - you take a beating. It's obviously more advantageous coming the other direction.

Even though there's so much about the UK I find attractive, I would have to plan for awhile to move back. I've done enough risk-taking for one lifetime. I'd have to really 'map out' a financial journey with a comfortable cushion. If we moved TODAY, we'd only have 15-20 more years to work. That might not be enough time to 'recover' from devaluing your cash by 50%.

Weird. This 'conversation' began with a comment about everything our UK spouses give up to come here. Maybe once the proverbial barn door has shut, some of us will likely just keep trudging on. They say 'you can never go home again'. Wes says he thinks much will change - that it just wouldn't be the same for him. I, on the other hand, am just pure 'chicken'.

Back in, say, 2000, your dollar would have gone a hell of a lot further. The pound recently hit 20 year highs against the dollar and many economists predict it will fall. Things could be different in a few years time.

I'm from Spartanburg county I live in Boiling Springs like...ten minutes down Asheville Hwy/176 from downtown Spartanburg. We have the new Cleveland Park and the new Krispy Kreme with a conveyer belt so you can watch them being made in all their drizzle fat glory and that's about it xD

Iain really loves lots of US cities that I've never been to, like New York and San Francisco. Mountain cities of NC are pretty gorgeous and awesome too. I think the US has a lot to offer...surely by sheer SIZE we can make up for ourselves.

I went to the UK first about...seven years ago I think, and the exchange rate was about $1.50 - 1 pound then, which really seemed about fair - I mean consider that you can get some things really cheap, a chippy for 3 pounds, stuff like that. And when Iain had a flat his rent was 250 pounds a month, each, for 3 people in a 3 bedroom place - That sounds like a pretty awesome deal here, even with the double rate considered.

I hope it all evens out again though, yeh I guess it won't magically fix with the administrative change in February though. Even the euro exchange sucks now, doesn't it? I guess we can always vacation in central and south america. I guess it's fair enough the US has the occasional bad time. I'd hoped it'd mean we'd at least be more ecologically conscious and things but that doesn't seem to be happening at all

My dad and stepmother live in Boiling Springs!

I also know a couple who live in Boiling Springs!

Hi - sorry just to get back to the taxes point. I'm the UKC - if my visa comes through say in October this year (fingers crossed) and I move over for example on 1st November. As a LPR will I be liable for US taxes on money earned from the date I arrive or from money earned from the beginning of the 2008 tax year (is it April to April in the US?)

I am getting a redundancy payment in Sept which is tax free in the UK - it would be a killer to have to pay tax on it in the US.

You pay taxes from the date you earn. The US tax year is Jan-Jan. However, it depends if you file jointly as well.

I use an accountant & he knows all the laws!

Yeh, I'm sure you'll probably have to pay taxes from the date you start working here, I guess. Sowwy I don't know what the 'redundancy' thing means but if what you're making is tax free, why would it be killer to have to pay the US in taxes though?
I'm with illumine though. I'd just let an accountant handle it all I'm sick of the immigration paperwork as it is, I don't wanna get lost in the tax ones too.








I bet we're all secret blood enemies or something Egg their houses.

I realise I would have to pay taxes from the date of entry and any work in the US but I wanted to know if they also looked at all foreign income earned by the non-USC in the tax year prior to their entry.

Redundancy = severence pay. LOL - my husband thinks it's hilarious that we call it redundancy pay. Basically I am being offered severence pay when I leave my job here in the UK, which is brilliant timing as I was leaving anyway to immigrate. In the UK the first £30,000 of severence pay is not taxable under UK tax laws. So if it's a tax free payment under UK law it would be very annoying if the US govt could claim some of it - especially as I will get it before I arrive in the US.

I think I will ask my husband to find an accountant who knows about international situation but can anyone else confirm whether the non-USC can be taxed on income for the months before they became a LPR?

(ahhhh - just re-read your post. I meant "it would be a killer" ie really really bad. Not "it would be killer" ie awesome. I had to just call my husband to find out what killer meant in the US! )

Why would you pay taxes on earned income while as a citizen living in their homeland (& before LPR status)?

If you bring in a large amount I believe there is taxes though. Ask an accountant.

Oh I think illumine's right. On the declaration cards when you're entering the US on an airplane or anything, you're only allowed a certain amount of cash. But I think past that you just have to DECLARE it, not necessarily that it's taxed. It sounds like the US would not normally tax you on any prior earnings, no, so your severence pay should be clear and untaxed, but maybe you'll get a different tax just for bringing in so much.

But you know maybe you can get around that? How much time is there between when you receive your severance pay and when you're flying over? Maybe you can wire the money to your fiance in small quantities or something, or leave a bank account open in the UK after you've moved here even, and withdraw it slowly? Might wanna check that all that is um...legal and not tax evasion or anything, of course

Take a look at [email="http://www.expatexchange.com/expat/index.cfm?frmid=282&forumid=0&dbname=ee&tpcid=3327737&shared=N"]this[/email] link. Looks like these guys have roughly the same question as you do.

Ah sorry I screwed up the link, and it won't let me re-edit it again for some reason.

Here ya go: for the win

I made a really good sized portion of money from my house sale in the UK. I paid it into my HSBC current account and applied for a HSBC credit card before I left. I used that credit card for everything in the USA and paid the monthly bill online from my current account before any interest charges were added.

We did the same as Mags with our UK money