Thanks! It's for my wife who has a regular Russian driver's license. I was just wondering if anyone's Russian spouse had changed theirs recently.

I recall someone mentioning that it's now too expensive to be worth it.

If your wife is going to get "lessons and a license" and pay a couple hundred bucks, then it's not worth it. But if she's actually going to get taught to drive a car and shows up here knowing how to drive, then that money is well spent.

But if she spends $300 or so to get issued a license then she'd be better off keeping that money and just going through the normal process here. Licensing in the U.S. is actually pretty cheap, it's just that you have to pass that pesky driving test and actually prove that you can drive.

I agree. Learning to drive is so simple, even children do it. In Alaska, they can get a learner's permit at age 14. Can you believe that?? 14 year olds driving around. It's freakin' insane.

Save the money in Russia. If she knows English, she should be able to get a license her within a 1-2 weeks of having a social security number.

And yet here I am, 22 years with a SSN and no driver's license to be found.

It's all on a needs basis. If she needs to drive then she can get her license rather quickly. If she doesn't need to drive (like, she needs you to drive her everywhere) then she may take a little while longer.

And there are also states which don't allow people to drive at 14 years of age where requirements for licenses are stricter and you need more than two weeks to get a license.

I tried teaching my wife in an automatic. the First time we stayed on a a back road and I didn't allow gas pedal or turning privileges and she did fine. The second time though there was a mix up of gas and brake pedals and she floored it. knocked over a handicap parking sign and bottomed out on a sidewalk. no body damage, but she did something to the engine that I still haven't figured out.


I wouldn't let her drive from there on out, but my parents tried to teach her, she almost wrecked their car too. I think I've got to teach her VERY slowly.

I'm more of a motorcycle person myself.

Well, the universe has two kinds of people - motivated and unmotivated...

Or "people who live in cities with public transport and no need for a car" and those who want to spend money on gas, insurance, and maintenance. I prefer to walk and use metro/bus systems. So far, having gone to boarding school where I couldn't have a car, and then living in urban areas where driving is hellish, it hasn't been necessary or even advantageous to me to know how to drive. Which is why none of your wives know how to either. I have no interest in life in a place where driving is a requirement.

My advice...if she is fluent enough in English send her to a reputable driving school. It sounds like your situation is a job for the pros and it would be money well spent.

given the above, she, and civilization, might be better off if she had a bicycle.

Take her to a big empty parking lot and let her do whatever she wants to get a feel for it. It shouldn't take her too long to really "get it" that way. I too tried to teach my wife to drive slowly, park, turn, etc. and she really struggled. I took her to the parking lot and said, "Have at it." and she started to make some progress.

Just make sure it's big, open, and there are no poles!

Here's the thing though, eekee, I'm sure if placed in a driver's seat, you'd figure it out with minimal instruction and training. It seems as if some of the girls from Russia/FSU have really struggled to "get it" even after driving several times.

And there are significant advantages to knowing how to drive, even in places where you'd never need to drive and/or even if you didn't have a license. You may need to drive for someone or if there's an emergency or something you could have to drive for someone or yourself. The outcome of a "what if" scenario almost always favors those with more knowledge and training. Ability = survivability.

And along AKD's school of thought here, if it's something that's going to be undertaken, you've (not just you eekee, but everyone) decided to start learning to drive a car, why should it take more than a day or two? Is it really that difficult?

People who are unmotivated to get a driver's license....

People who are motivated to get a license...

...unmotivated to get a license....

See how easy it is?

My wife had never had to drive in her life when she arrived in the U.S. Luckily she was able to find a job that is only a ten minute walk from our house. She eventually wanted to have her own car so we signed her up at a driving school. She saved up and bought her own car while she was learning. It took her a loooooooong time to be able to control the car. After many months of practice, she finally got her license. If my wife can do it, anyone can. Oh, and hello all. I haven't posted on here in ages.

The day she got her license.

Seattle has a large Russian community. One of my wife's favorite websites used to be Russian Seattle (http://www.russianseattle.com). She's real big on CorbinaTV now.

Is your wife very fluent in English? Was she highly fluent in English on arrival to the USA? Does Washington give the written test in Russian.

The point I'm trying to make is that some places in the USA are "Russian friendly" and others are not so. In Texas the written test is given only in English and Spanish. Everyone else is SOL and must hire an interpreter. Some states even have the driving handbook and written test printed in Russian to make the process easy and relatively painless.

Fortunately both my wife and stepdaughter were already highly fluent in English before arriving in the USA. Otherwise their getting Texas driver's licenses would not have been such a cakewalk. Ditto for employment opportunities.

I'm not denigrating your wife's accomplishments here in the USA. I'm just trying to point out that the USA is not uniform from state to state or city to city. Some locales are more "Russian friendly" than others. It is also safe to say that not everyone is equally motivated or progresses as fast as another person.

Not everyone's situation is the same. Different people are not the same either. It's not fair to compare Natasha in San Francisco, NYC, or Seattle to Svetlana in Nashville, Corpus Christi, or Baton Rouge. Not everyone's wife is fluent in English fresh off the airplane. Some of my wife's Russian speaking aquaintances and friends she has met here in Houston from various former USSR republics are at various stages in their assimilation. There are lots of factors at work. Location, motivation, age, education, confidence, etc. to mention just a few.

Best of luck to you and your wife. I'm glad all has worked out for both of you. Keep on posting your experiences.

My wife spoke very little English before she came here. She is very good at languages though. English is her fourth language. They offered the test to her in Russian, but she chose to do it in English. I'll tell her about the website. Thanks!

I think for many of us teaching a Russian woman to drive is one of the most challenging things. I think part of why it seems so much harder for them than for Americans is that when Kids grow up in America they are driving a lot of things. There are so many toys that steer like a car, they ride bikes, they play with big wheels and 4 wheelers, they go the the amusement park and ride the dodgums and the Cadilac car rides and kids in Russia don't usually do that. Back in the stone ages I got my permit one week and took and passed my test the next week.

I would have been a lot better off reading the stuff they gave her myself as well because they talk a lot in the driving book about teaching someone to drive. My suggestion is to not just let her read it, read it yourself to, at least the part about teaching someone to drive.

The best advice here for someone begining the process is what Slim said about starting out in a big parking lot. I never thought about that and it cost me 5 grand. (the story is upthread if you missed it). Well we are maybe three months into the learning process with tons of time spent with her driving. The idea of her driving without me would still scare me to death. Yesterday she flew through a red light. She has a hard time with intersections that are three way stops. She misses stop signs sometimes and can't find her way anywhere. We were a block from home the other day and she did not know where she was. She confuses left and right. I think she could very easily turn onto a 4 lane divided highway pulling in the wrong way and find herself driving against traffic. The bad part is I think she could pass her test if I let her take it.

I hope her driving futilities are limited to driving. If everything in the world also comes this difficult to her, I pity you greatly.

Sounds about how my wife was. My suggestion is to take her to a driving school and not take all the stress yourself. I thought I could teach my wife to drive, but I would get so frustrated that I would make her mad and than she wouldn't want to drive anymore. I think it cost my wife about $300.

As I remember from my own learning experience many years ago - as soon as you start driving independently, without someone sitting next to you and constantly telling you what to do and what not to do, your level of attention, awareness and ability to figure out things increases dramatically. Having a worried instructor at your side is a very distracting and unnerving thing, however kind and patient this instructor might be.

Just relax and let her drive. She'll improve, you'll see.

My wife actually drove better when she was mad. I don't know if it was to prove me wrong or if she just wasn't taking it seriously until she was angry, but once we would start yelling and get all stressed out, she whipped in and out of the cones like she'd done it her whole life.

That to me said she was concentrating too hard and thinking too much instead of letting the car go and simply just driving. You know, the fun part of driving, the kind they talk about in the Cadillac commercials. When she was "thinking" about which way to turn the wheel and how much gas to give it, she wasn't "feeling" it and thusly drove very poorly. After just letting go, she did much better. When I pointed it out to her, "See, when you're p!$$ed off you drive better!" she had to laugh and acknowledged that yes, she probably just needed to think about it less and just let it happen.



That's true. Scary, but true. My wife's only been driving on the streets by herself for about two weeks now and I still worry about her, but I know for her to get better I can't be there.

The best way for her to get practice at this is, once again, go to that big empty parking lot or back streets or wherever you can practice and get out of the car. Let her drive around for a while all by herself without you in the car. Once she improves in the parking lot, have her drive a few blocks on her own and then back to your location. I realized very quickly I was just going to have to let her go. Whenever I rode with her, I was so stressed out I couldn't even eat my Taco Bell. And that's sad for a fat man!

I've seen her progress already. I'm still worried, but I can't be there all the time, and I don't want to be! She'll be OK.

I can't really find driving lessons around here. There is a vague mention of AAA offering them somewhere but I think we are past that point.

Blues, I agree with you when there is not a worried instructor sitting by your side it does increase the alertness level. I think when there is no one to ask if you are doing it right you just think it out yourself better. Besides all that screaming when I think death is close, covering my eyes and her worrying if I am ok when I turn white as a ghost must take away from her concentration as well.

Well, we bought her a car yesterday. Haven't seen it yet. We are heading to Michigan tomorrow to pick it up. We have been watching Craigs list, Ebay, AutoTrader and cars.com for a while. I saw a car that would be perfect the other day. It was a rebuildable wreck with the front totally smashed but drivable. I told her we should get it for her and anyone seeing that car coming down the road would get off the road in fear and give her clear driving. We didn't buy it though. There were only a few cars she liked. Beetles, Hyundai Tiberon's Toyota Celicas and yesterday she added Cougars to the list so we got a Red Cougar. Hopefully the bright red color may help people see her when she goes through a red light or stop sign and may help a bit.

I tried to get my wife a panel-van. She was having nothing of it. When we first started looking for a car all we had was $750. She said, "I will buy car for this 750 bucks." We got on E-Bay and I pulled up a $750 car. It was a rusted-out van with three or four different colors on all the different panels from where it'd been wrecked or rusted through and changed out. I could just picture her all "fashion-able" behind the wheel of that van.

She made a shrieking noise of some kind hissing sound and then next thing I knew she was talking about going to work or something....


We ended up with the Cobalt which is in the same family as the Couger, Tiburon, Celica, etc. I still worry about her having such a small car but they are relatively safe, I guess. I sure wish she would've bought that panel-van. Kind of like the car with the wrecked front, I'm sure people would've yielded to her, even if she was cruising through a red light.

Who knows, maybe this will make them concentrate more and drive even better. (And by the way, Pizza Tower is still open! I checked last weekend, the Mexican place is next door. So if you guys get "lost" on your way back home, stop by and grab a pie.)

Driving lessons is the first thing my wife did after I left to come back . I think its a great idea to pay for the lessons. I can think of a much better way to spend quality time with Jojie. besides, I just couldn't pass up the price..I think it would have cost at least 10 times more to learn here. who doesn't love a good deal. She now rents a vehicle maybe once or twice a month for an overnite trip to her hometown by the sea. its about a three hour drive and its great practice.. I must say, I am impressed. I know some of the places she drove and not even her older brothers chose that route. (DON SALVADOR MT ) hopefully she will be an expert by the time she is here driving our vehicles..LOL.

I bought my wife a (shudder) new PT cruiser. Remember your first car and how you took care of it? Same way with her. She washes the car by hand, parks in the last parking space and at an angle to keep from getting car doored, and wouldn't trade it for an Escalade. She now wants to move up to a Rav 4, and I told her we would only buy it with no trade in, would keep the PT because of low trade-in and good gas mileage as opposed to my pickup. She really loves her little car and thankfully, no wrecks in 3+ years of driving, I still hate to ride with her though, and no sense of direction, none!

M wife bought a (new) 2007 Chevy Aveo 5 for $8,000. They listed it as "the cheapest new car in America". Has a 5 star rating though, with side impact airbags standard. Spent $700 on studded tires (with wheels) though - but I think it's safe and it is perfect for a little in-town car, which is what she wanted. It's also a stick, which is ironic, because when I bought my Jeep, I got an automatic - mostly for her benefit. Oh well.

A 6-cyl sports car for a new driver? You guys are crazy.

I see the Korean made "Chevy" Aveo was recently rated on of the worst cars currently sold in the US

Yeah, my Jeep was also on that list.

The people that make such lists are complete morons.

6 cylinder sportscar? Isn't that a oxymoron?

The people that spend $13,000 or $14,000 for an Aveo are the real morons.

I'm sure it's worth the $8000, but I'd take the Jeep first.

How can you rate a vehicle whose main purpose is off-road... on the road? Hence the low rating.

Why wouldn't you expect one of the lowest price point vehicles to rate at the bottom of the list vs. BMW's and say a Lexus?

I think the morons are the ones who interpret without reading or understanding.

I agree. If you spend $13,000 for something that you can get for $8000, you're definitely a moron (:

As for that list - they rank the Aveo 5 so low because it lacks features and has a cheap feel. Well duh! What the hell do you want for $8000? Then they compare it to the Toyota Yaris and the Honda version of a cheap car (can't recall the name off hand), which sell for almost twice as much. It's hardly a reasonable comparison.

My Jeep made the list for little reason other than its a Jeep. They compare it with non-Jeep vehicles which could never meet the functionality of a Jeep and completely ignore the reason why people buy Jeeps instead of "more refined" vehicles. If Jeeps were made the way these list people wanted them to be made, they would no longer be Jeeps. In short - the list makers an such are all morons.

By the way - had the Aveo 5 for about 18 months now and it has not given us any trouble at all, except the fuel pump went out for some reason - and that was of course replaced under warranty. Had the Jeep for about the same period of time - it has been no problem at all (:

If you want to add to the moron list:
Anyone who buys a new car or even better anyone who buys one with a clean title.
The Russian community here in Sacramento is pretty good at splicing together two vehicles to get you any brand, model, and year with salvage title and the price tag being half of the used car price on KBB.

It's not reasonable to rate a cheap vehicle low just because it is a cheap vehicle. It would be like rating a BMW or Lexus as low, simply because they are expensive vehicles. You need to rate a vehicle within the context in which it competes. In other words, for the Aveo 5 - the question is not, "how well does this vehicle rate relative to a BMW?" - it should be "how well does this vehicle rate as an extremely inexpensive, basic, no-frills vehicle?"

Again - rate it for what it is, not what you want it to be.

These people doing the ratings claim to be unbiased, however, the very criteria they use for rating reflect a bias, and for some vehicles, such as a Jeep, are simply inappropriate metrics. I'm sure I could develop a suite of metrics that very fine vehicles such as ferarris and corvettes would rate poorly in, while my Jeep does very well. The metrics used for ratings should be reasonable and appropriate for the vehicle being rated. Many times, this is not the case. It's like rating a motorcycle poorly because it can't carry 4 passengers. That's just a meaningless metric for the vehicle.

Hell, look at what CR rated as the best SUV of 2008. The Mirauno or whatever. Give me a break. Like anyone is going to take that thing off road. If they did, it would never make it back. This video pretty much sums it up: http://youtube.com/watch?v=C_PfsY7mePc

Funny that video was posted by Ak something or other.....

Makes me wanna go out and get my Wrangler X all dirty. Of course, here in the urban jungle, off-roading, it's not so challenging. The hard part is to find some dirt!

Ak, is the trail featured in the video indicative of the road conditions where you live?
Probably not. For the average American living in the Urban / suburban jungle, their vehicle is never going to go off road, and many will never even use the 4 wheel drive option. In todays market and rising fuel costs, the sub compact car is looking a whole lot better than a large vehicle whether it be the H1 or the Jeep. I tend to disagree with the video, mostly because the average consumer is on the road and all cars should be rated based on some basic features like handling, acceleration, space, safety, fuel economy, reliability, towing abilities, and off road abilities. But one having only one decent feature should not automatically elevate it above all others simply because the others vehicles might be lacking in that same category. I think consumer reports is right for looking at the whole of the car and practicality of the car. And a category of "SUV" is sufficiently small to characterize those types of vehicles. Because if we break them up any further then each car will have its own category or "purpose" it will make the rating system even more worthless.

Pretty close - esp. during spring breakup (:

Therefore, a Ferrari should rate very poorly because it is very expensive to buy, very expensive to maintain and lacks room for more than 2 passengers. What an awful awful car that must be. The fact that the vehicle is not designed or marketed as an economical soccer mom transporter doesn't matter.

Well probably, but with the current price of gasoline it is hard to find or afford anything that falls into the class of 4 cylinder economy vehicles (you know the stripped down pieces of junk they normally can't give away) If you are lucky enough to find an economical vehicle and you ask them for a discount they look at you like you are nuts even though the price is sky high. The two cougars we looked at they nearly begged us to take them and my offer was nearly 20% below asking price. She does love her cougar and it does seem to get good mileage.

Want to try an experiment. Go on the website of the Smart ForTwo car and look at the prices. You will see base prices for this tiny two seater car with 45 GPM starting at $12,???,00 Now go on eBay and see if the prices you see for used ones don't hit in the $ 19,000-28,000 range.

I think a Ferrari is a lot like my Russian wife.....


Great to look at

It's a wild ride

So damn expensive to maintain

Try another experiment:
Go to http://craigslist.org/
Then go to sales.
Then type any combination of:
"Salvage Civic"
"Salvage Echo"
"Salvage Carolla"
"Salvage Golf"
All very fuel economical cars, all well below prices you would pay at a dealership or Ebay.

The primary concern should be the safety of the driver. An inexperienced driver in a light responsive car with a powerful engine can wreak havoc, even if she tries to drive extra carefully.

If this were true, the person would not drive at all.

Yes, but you will also get less when you sell it. We actually looked at a pretty nice Echo at a local dealership that had an R (salvage) title. We saw the car on Sunday and went back on Tuesday ready to buy it but it was already sold. I will agree there are some good values.

I had a pickup with an R (salvage) title one time. Bought it with 46,000 miles, sold it with over 400,000 miles. It did make it harder to resell or trade with that title. Everyone worries about what was really wrong with it. Still you are right, you can find some economical cars

So the mileage had nothing to do with it?