There is not an eye-rolling icon that is emotive enough to express the eye-rollingness quotient of this post.

Again...(and this is directed to all the "Russian [men|women] are arrogant" crowd, not just the poster I quoted) how on earth can you love a Russian woman and not love or respect her culture and people? And please don't start pointing out to me all the social ills and what-not. Every culture has these problems--read a goddamned book. What you say when you make huge, wide, sweeping generalizations like this is that there is a flaw in the psyche of the entire culture. And not just a flaw, but a *fundamental* flaw. And if you believe in this fundamental flaw, then you most definitely have to believe that your woman carries this fundamental flaw. And so how do you justify this? That you saved her from her own people? That even as flawed as she is, you will make the necessary allowances in order to tolerate her? That you love her, despite this fundamental character flaw? Now *THAT* smacks of not only arrogance, but elitism and misogyny as well. It's not your woman who's the flawed one in your relationship.

I think you raise some good points here--my own personal circle of russian friends includes, basically, people born from the late 70s to early 80s who are college educated and living in st. petersburg, although many of them were born in other parts of russia and came to spb for university. I don't know any zolotaya moljdezh' though. i do think there is a marked difference between life within the big cities and life in the more provincial areas. The people here who are happy and truly in love with Russian girls from dating sites seem to be dating women who already have been through marriage and divorce and are from small cities, where the options are much slimmer. But workin4somethin's generalizations were just making me really angry.

My cousin married an American women (my grandma's family still all lives in belarus, and he received a full scholarship to the university of texas in the early 90s) and they're still happily married. But obviously there's not this same phenomenon of people meeting on the internet like there is with Russian women and American men, so there's fewer examples to go by.

I basically agree with your points and overall argument Mox. But playing "devil's advocate," I think some American men think they're "rescuing" Russian women from the evil empire...especially older men. And speaking only for myself here, frankly, some Russian women do bad mouth their own homeland and government and this might reinforce the concept of rescue.

I remember the depth of hatred towards the Soviet Union in the USA and some of it was brainwashing but some of us got a close up look at things the Russian were up to back in the old days... and it wasn't pretty. I have had to "come around" slowly myself, to start to open my eyes and my heart to Mother Russia...and respect and admiration have replaced the negative stuff...but I still have work to do.

But once things started opening up a little, the Russians loved American and the American lifestyle and had "American dreams," especially the young people.

My guy hates the government and certain aspects of Russian society, and if we hadn't met he would have emigrated to New Zealand or Canada. But I think it's one thing to understand that Russia has problems or to dislike the government, and completely another to disrespect the culture. I would be totally fine with living in Russia forever, but we feel that we can have a more stable life for our future family if we move to the US instead. That doesn't mean that there's not a lot of things about the "Russian Soul" and Russian culture that i really admire, and some things that I actually prefer about Russia when compared the US.

Absolutely, I agree there are a lot of guys out there who think they are rescuing their woman. For most of these men, they are in for a surprise. But really, "rescue" is a terrible place to begin any relationship, foreign or domestic.


Good for you. (that's not sarcastic, I really mean it. It's hard to move past our own histories sometimes.) Terrible things are done by all sides when it comes to war and politics. The American government has done, and continues to do, horrible things to foreign nationals (and possibly US citizens too, but the PATRIOT act blankets our ability to know the extent), but it is not indicative of the character of the American people, who are a good and kind-hearted people. Power corrupts, and anyone in power in any government will be corrupted by it. It is and was people like you who unfortunately suffer for it.

He pulled that out of his a$$.

By the way, Don't Mess with Texas.

Hi dear VJers!
This is Sat's wife, the original poster.
Wow, 21 pages!!! I didn't expect that!
Oh my God, I've heard so much new about myself! (arrogant, heartless, lier, etc. etc.) Some of you are really mean here! )
Now that everyone calmed down, I apologize again that I've posted this topic. But admit that it turned out pretty entertaining!
Since Satellite never apologizes, I will do it for him! Sorry for calling everyone suckers! (You know that's not true, eh?)
Also, I dont agree with my husband on the "online friends" issue. I have some great online friends, but I prefer to talk to them privately (email, ICQ), and not just post stuff for everyone to see...
I can not write as beautiful in English as some of you on this forum, but I must say that not all Russians are arrogant, please, please!! Not all Russian men are drunks!! These are all just stereotypes.
By the way, I found it really interesting that some people rushed to offer help to my husband after they have read that I left him, and, at the same time, they turned against me (e.g. I became a "mistake of humankind", they suggested my husband to get a lawyer, etc.) But they didn't know what the reason for my "leaving" was! What if he treated me badly? What if I had some other good reason? All they've read was that i left.
Well, I didn't like VJ before, but now I come here more often.

P.S. What do you guys think of this video? )
http://youtube.com/watch?v=6ixwxhiylsQ

sometimes i'm scared i sound like that in russian.

Now come on you wanted to see if you could get more pages than akdiver when he pulled the wool over our eyes..




Karmic backlash



Or perhaps they are just a figment of our imagination.



Well that was actually the intent of all the fervor, to get you to show up a little more often, it gets lonely and cold in cyberspace and sometimes we need company. So dont be such a stranger, come, sit down, have a cup of tea and some cookies. We'll chat and find out more about you. So tell us about yourself, do you have any annoying habits you would like to discuss, or perhaps a rash that wont go away, or maybe you have a dream where you are standing on a mountain in sungod like robes with a thousand naked women screaming and throwing little pickles at you.


P.S. I liked the video

Hello Sat's wife...it would be great if you had a name.

I accept your apology for your post. Your husband should make his own apologies, however.


I would be happy to see you around here more! Maybe you should make your own account so we can see when Satellite is posting, and when you are posting, more easily.


She is very beautiful!

Apology accepted wife of Sat. We sort of gathered Sat has issues with saying he is sorry. You are always welcome to contribute to the tragedy, comedy and mostly drama found on our little Russian forum!

I KNOW I sound like that when I speak Russian, especially with mixing in the English words when I dont know the Russian word!

Don't forget the women too!




Are you serious? They're protecting us from the terrorists. If it wasn't for important laws like the Patriot Act, we would've been bombed again by now. It's too bad that Bush can't win again, 'cause he so would!

I wonder why his brother's not running.....?




That guy sure was arrogant! "Like nobody. I'm best."..... "I'm poor. But I'm cool. I'm very cool!"

Bush would win if only the 1 in 4 Americans who don't think he's the worst president ever vote.

Oh, Slim, which comedy club can I catch you at? Good stuff!

Actually very few of us had anything against you Olga, it was your husband's behavior that was the cause of all the commotion. So your apologies, though obviously well-meant, are completely unnecesary.

Ahh...it's Olga. Okay, I somehow missed that.

And agreed with Blues, you already apologized for the initial post. We all love you here. Your husband should make his own apologies though.

I missed her name too. Welcome Ol'ga!

Dear Mrs. Satellite,
I think it was unfortunate that your husband got slammed by several people on this site who wear their feelings on their sleeve. In any event, it is now water under the bridge. Your YouTube link reminded me of another one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkdeZqDAmX8

It's not very "cricket" to have two people posting under the same user name. And why do I have this nagging feeling in my gut that maybe only one person is really posting...maybe there is no Olga posting. Maybe we're being played? It's pretty easy to get a user name...yes? Not rocket science. If Olga wants to post...get a user name and post.

If we honor the one person per user name rule...why are folks so happy to play along with this oddball situation?

Maybe a moderator might want to do something here?

Is it against the TOS? If people are signing their posts and making it clear as to who is posting--as Olga and Sasha have--I don't see why it would be a problem.

If it were true, nothing would stop Sat from simply creating another account and posting as 2 people.

We either trust posters or we don't. It's what started this whole fiasco in the first place.

Sat's wife again:
seanconneryii, Thank you for your compliment. It means that my english isn't that bad. Don't you see a difference between my writing (3 years in the US) and my husband's (Over 18 years in the US)?
If someone would wanna play with you, don't you think he would get another user name to make you believe there are two people posting?
Who made this rule (One person per username)?
As Putin said not so long ago: вы чего, хотите, чтобы я землю ела из горшка с цветами? Клялась на крови, что я это я? ))

That's good.

A couple other Putin quotes I like:
"I think the American people should express their preferences, and we'll accept their choice."
And
"You must obey the law, always, not only when they grab you by your special place."

I didn't get a very coherent translation of Putin's words of wisdom. "You of that, want, that I ate the ground from a pot with colors? I Swore on blood, what it I?" Whatever...

I think laziness is a powerful force...it does take some effort to set-up an account with VJ and it probably requires a separate email address. For the purpose of just having some good fun with the masses, it's easier to just go with the existing account. The initial "wife" post was bogus (a joke?) but now posts are offered as sincere. Maybe we are still "suckers?"

Faking a Russian wife's syntax and tone should be easy for someone as clever as Sat.

Just my thinking out loud. Who knows? In fact...who cares? I'm just having a boring day.

I can't read through all 22 pages of this BS, but I do resent the arrogance and general behavior in this thread by Satellite. I appreciate his wife's (Olga's words) and hold no ill feelings toward her or him, BUT a little lesson for the budding lawyer....until you have practiced big cases and spent many years in the trenches always learning and sharpening your skills STFU, get me my coffee, and go make copies of the 500 boxes of documents I have sitting in the other room for the opposing counsel. See you in the big leagues.....MAYBE!

That made me lol. Not necessarily because it was directed at Sat (although that's funny too) but because I've seen this so often in my own professional experience. Some new hotshot is going to come in and show us all how it's supposed to be done, pisses everyone off, usually screws something up, and winds up in a...er..."support"...role until his ears dry off a bit more. Hell, I was that guy once.

I think its more like, "What do you want, that I wlll eat dirt from a flowerpot? Swearing on blood that I am me?"

Still sounds weird though. Oh, Putin.

Woot! I got "flower pot" right! Why on earth I should know the word for flower pot at this point is beyond me, but I do.

Way off topic: My daughter (16 going on 22) has been picking up some Russian too. She's completely fascinated with Nadya and has even spoken to her on the phone. Anyway, she's started incorporating random Russian words into her every day speech, but in completely nonsense contexts. So when she says hi to me on the phone, she says "плавать лошади." Her phrase for goodbye is "Клубника лифчик." Why? No idea. I think she just likes to be weird.

Oh those phrases are funny!

My 15 year old loves to talk some Russian to a Russian male friend at school. But she tries her best to say it right. My youngest son also loves to speak in Russian which his mother forbids in her home as she sees it as some uninvited presence of me.

That's great that your kids are so interested in their future stepmothers' culture. it's not always that way.

I don't have any kids yet, but when I do, I hope that they will be fully bilingual.

That's our goal. I think it would be great if all of us are able to communicate fully in either language. Plus, since so few speak Russian in our area, it will be nice to be able to have a covert talk in public if needed.

Yes, all my children love my Alla. Although only my oldest son has had a chance to met her in person thus far. I took him to Kazan' two summers ago so he could see where his father was going to live for the year. He had a blast!

Hehe. My kids' mother wouldn't be dumb enough to try to stop her from speaking Russian. She's already alienated the kids quite a bit the way it is. But I'm sure it drives her up a wall to know my daughter is sharing in a part of her father's life that makes him happy. She's funny that way.

Клубника лифчик!

That is actually a very nice asset to posses.

..... and the ex-wife so hates it when you and your son/daughter can say stuff without her understanding!

Well...my ex wife's father was Russian so I can't say she's got "Russian" issues. My son was interested in the Russian culture long before I got married to Russian woman. He has Soviet Union flag in his room and the Russian national anthem on his IPOD. My son is actually related to Shostakovich the famous composer.

I have mixed feelings about learning Russian. It's a tough language to master and it would be a full-time job to learn it in a robust way....is this a good use of my time? Otherwise, I'm just kidding myself and murdering the Russian language. It's a struggle for me to even memorize their crazy alphabet and those weird symbols. I see English as the center of our new life...Russian is only a symbol of a dying past.

Jeez for that reason alone I should enroll my kids in Russian language lessons.


- The Cyrillic alphabet is not near as difficult to pick up as you think. I had it down in just a couple days. No weird symbols that I know of, they use the same punctuation we do.

- Your wife will *LOVE* you for even attempting to learn. When I told Nadya I was starting to learn Russian she positively beamed, and she is always asking how it goes and encouraging me. It will score you massive brownie points. I've heard from more than one person that the women will downplay the importance of learning their language, but they do in fact really want you to learn the language. Perhaps some of the ladies here will speak up and either debunk or confirm.

- You don't have to be "robust." I've decided to take the plunge and learn the language. But you really only need to learn enough to know some common phrases.

- It is definitely a good use of your time, if for anything else, the "secret code" that's been brought up.


Huh.

that's cool that your son's related to shoshtakovich!

yeah, russian is hard, but i'm sure that learning english wasn't a cakewalk for your wife, either. russian is so much more emotive and expressive that i think it adds another dimension to your relationship. english is very cold in comparision.

as far as russian being like a secret language... in new york it doesn't work at all. Plus my mom's first language is Belarusian so when i'm in pennsylvania that wouldn't work either. drat.

For me the alphabet was super easy. Made be wish ours could that simple. My challenges are the cases and declination. My Alla has also said, "Better to make mistakes than not to try and speak at all."

While I agree English is obviously important. I cannot imagine telling my Alla "Russian is a symbol of a dying past." I am proud of her roots and want them celebrated. I can only imagine if I did, her response would be, "You know I am Russian? Why you wish to marry woman that is this symbol?" As I stated in a previous thread, we intend on having one day a week be 100% Russian in language and spirit.

Same here. Case and declination. And of course gender. I'd like the bash the caveman's skull open that came up with that idea.

The thing that makes Russian easier is that it's a phonetic language. You speak it the way it is spelled. No silent letters, no "it's pronounced this way in this word, and another way in another word," and no "these two letters together make a completely different sound." (there are always exceptions, but they are rare enough not to be a problem. "Ь" and "Ъ" make things interesting, but you can usually fake your way through it.) In that way Russian is easier than French, Spanish, or any other latin-based language. Of course Russian makes up for this ease by trying to cram as many consonants in a row before finally giving you a break with a vowel, and giving German a run for it's money in the "how long can we make a word before your jaws sieze up?" department.

It's a challenge, but it's also pretty fun.

I want to try this too. Maybe we'll start off easy with "Russian mornings" or "Russian let's-do-this-another-day."

That's sort of true for Russian pronounciation being totally phonetic, but you have to know where the accent is in the word and certain letters will be pronounced differently when they're next to certain other letters. The orthography is pretty standard, but without knowing where the stress falls you won't pronounce it correctly, even if you know what sounds all the letters make. It is MUCH more standardized thaт english though.

we aim for communicating half the time in english and the other half in russian.

This is true. I got a curious look from Nadya the first time I said "kak DEE-lah" instead of "kak dee-LAH." This is where it's good to have a tutor.

Wait until you start using possessives...You have to think a couple of words ahead because the possessive words gender has to match the nouns gender, and the noun might not come for a word or two after the possessive. That is my biggest problem.

I have to admire the good intentions to honor the Russian language and your spouses through the process. Good for you guys!

But if you really want to honor Russia in a serious way...why not live in Russia for a certain number of weeks or months each year? Immerse yourself in the culture annually and really use the language authentically...not merely as contrived chit chatting with your spouse once a week in the USA. And how far can you carry that Russian language only commitment...what language will you use when the phone rings or there's a knock at the door or your American kid's friends come over to hang out? That's easy....English.

I can see maybe learning Russian as a hobby but where oh where will i find room for another hobby? i can not even finish a good book anymore. For me learning Russian is not practical or worth the time i could be doing something for my wife to make her happy in my good old American way. I want to serve her now in a way that will have immediate positive impact...not many months or years down the road. I have a Russian vocabulary of about 30 words and i think that's about it for me. It's enough to survive in Russia at a base level and converse with my wife when we want to do a simple exchange in Russian. BUT I will never be able to do the rolling RRRR thing...my mouth just does not work that way. So I'm doomed to failure.

Besides, my father's ancestors spoke French...the most beautiful and romantic language in my judgment. When i hear Russians talk it always sounds like they hate each other even if it's a friendly discourse...or they're yelling at each other. French sounds like poetry even when people are cussing each other out.

Bonjour!

I got a Russian tutor before I went to Sochi and it sure paid off. Due to work and other daily drains, I don't take many lessons anymore.
To me, the language is both simple and complex. Tanya and Alina do appreciate that I try to speak in Russian to them but most of the time Tanya tells me "English only, please" on our daily phone conversations.
As I am helping her and Alina with their English lessons, I sure do appreciate how hard they are trying. Incredible how fast a 13 yo girl can learn English! Tanya does well also but like me, it is much harder learning as an adult.

My only motivation left is to learn enough of the Russian Language so I can understand when they talk to each other in "code"!

wait until you write an essay and your teacher says, "well, there are no grammatical errors" and then proceeds to mark the entire in red to fix non-idiomatic speech.

french men and italian men were recently rated the worst lovers. that's all i have to say about romance languages. i found studying them to be really boring. Наш язык лучше.

Strange... I feel the exact opposite!

I agree, French is a beautiful language. My daughter speaks it, and she sounds angelic speaking it. But to me Russian is also a beautiful language for different reasons. It still sounds romantic to me, but a more primitive, earthy romantic. I dig them both.

I plan to do exactly that. I hope to transfer to Moscow within 3 or 4 years. The company I work for has an office there and they are always looking for Russian speakers. I hope to live in Russia for about 3 or 4 years and then return home for a few years, then back, etc.

Come on guys, Russian isn't as hard as Chinese or Hebrew!
Russian is великий и могучий! If you try hard, you can learn it. The only problem might be age... the older you are... the harder it is to learn the language.
The cases and conjugations aren't as bad as they seem to be. You just need someone to explain how they work. I've had lots of american students who now speak very good Russian.
Learning Russian is NOT impossible!

seanconneryii,
Why didn't you find a French lady then? I find your words very offensive. Feel sorry for your spouse too. Do you think it's easy for her to say such simple words as "Better" or "water" in English?

-Olga.

I have to be honest and maybe contradictory...I like hearing my wife speak Russian.